Mel Fisher faced this for 20 years

[2cmorau]

EXCLUSIVE: Couple who found $10m hoard of gold coins while walking dog could have broken law by not telling the police | Mail Online

 

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[Jeff95531]

Really great follow up. One of my favorites:
"Walter N. Dimmick was accused of embezzling $30,000 in gold from the San Francisco U.S. Mint in the early 1900's and was imprisoned for it."

The rest of the articles just reinforce what others have said...they shoulda kept a low profile and sold them a little bit at a time. Now everybody wants a share.

 

[goldenIrishman]

Considering that these folks found the stash ON THEIR OWN PROPERTY I think they've got a foot up on Mel Fisher. Still... With the state of the California economy I wouldn't be surprised to see the state try to take possession of the find with some kind of legal action. It's just the kind of thing that the bureaucrats would try to do.

These people should be left alone to enjoy their good fortune. Even if it was stolen from the mint way back when, the statute of limitations on that crime would have run out. It's easy to see that they were not the ones that stole it and at the very least, if they have to turn it into the government then they should get a sizable reward.

Now... If I had been the one to find something like that.... I'd have kept my mouth shut and sold off the coins one at a time. Considering that from what I've read on this story, many of the coins were in mint condition and will bring many MANY time their face value.

That's my 2 cents on this one.....

 

[NHBandit]

At least they were smart enough to say it was found on their own property... Regardless of where it was really found. What I am having trouble with is the government taxing them on the current value. Who decides what the value is ? Some of these coins are unique as far as being the best examples known. You can't look that up in a book. NOBODY knows the real value until after they are sold. Does the IRS just pick a number out of thin air and tax them on that amount ? I have said it on some of the other threads on this find and I will say it again. These coins are worth face value until after they are sold. At that point they should be taxed on the profit. If they decide to keep them they should be taxed on the face value until such time that they are sold and then taxed individually. Forcing them to pay taxes now on whatever the government "guesses" the value to be forces them to sell at least half of them to pay those taxes. Am I the only one who thinks that's ridiculous ? Taxing them at the time of sale, individually, whenever that may be is the only fair way to do it (not that the government is ever fair).. Edit to add more thoughts on this. Let's suppose the government decides the coins are worth a total of 10 mil and they sell half the coins to satisfy the tax man. They keep the rest as an investment. Now 10 years later that 5 mil worth of coins has gone up in value and they sell them for 8 million. Does the government get to tax them AGAIN on the 3 million profit ? You know they would.. So in effect they get hosed twice for the same coins.

 

[rodoconnor]

The tax situation is interesting. It is legal tender with a face value of $27,000.Do they pay a tax on that? Do they pay on the bullion value ? The collector's value? When would they pay? When they sell? What if they choose to not sell? We all have a good idea on what the State of Kaliphony and the IRS will decide for them.Silence is truly golden

 

[Graysondigger]

Unfortunately not a surprise to me. We can all learn from this story for sure. Good post!

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

They would pay on value of coins today. Like any asset if you sell it down the road you owe taxes on the profit...

If you win a car on a game show you pay taxes on it, if you hold that car for 10 years and for what ever reason it becomes a collectible and you sell it for 3 times what it was worth when you won it you owe taxes on the profit realized..






American by birth, Patriot by choice.

I would rather die standing on my two feet defending our Constitution than live a lifetime on my knees......

 

[golden ray]

While its great to hear that there are still large hoards of coins to be found,
the couple could have avoided all this mess with the government & upcoming
lawsuits by just keeping the find to themselves; and selling off a few coins
at a time. Where money is at steak, EVERYONE wants a piece of the pie.

 

[2cmorau]

just my 2 cents Mel Fisher had salvage rights, that didn't stop Florida, and yes i agree whit what u say, i am sure California will do what it can to get some, it being in the hole withh pension and other liabilitys i think i last heard was like 600 billion in obligations

i have often played the senerio in my head, what if? i find that large hoard, i think i could pull it off, but i would have to tell a pal or two and i know thats where my problem lies LOL, having found a pocket many years ago best ever ( a few oz of au ) I told my buds, the rush was on and also detecting found a large mans gold chain Oaklands Marina area my buddies saw me pull this from the ground we detected all day n found a couple more rings, but in testing the chain thats when i got excited almost two oz 22k tha was a long time ago

Considering that these folks found the stash ON THEIR OWN PROPERTY I think they've got a foot up on Mel Fisher. Still... With the state of the California economy I wouldn't be surprised to see the state try to take possession of the find with some kind of legal action. It's just the kind of thing that the bureaucrats would try to do. These people should be left alone to enjoy their good fortune. Even if it was stolen from the mint way back when, the statute of limitations on that crime would have run out. It's easy to see that they were not the ones that stole it and at the very least, if they have to turn it into the government then they should get a sizable reward. Now... If I had been the one to find something like that.... I'd have kept my mouth shut and sold off the coins one at a time. Considering that from what I've read on this story, many of the coins were in mint condition and will bring many MANY time their face value. That's my 2 cents on this one.....

 

[NHBandit]

They would pay on value of coins today. Like any asset if you sell it down the road you owe taxes on the profit... If you win a car on a game show you pay taxes on it, if you hold that car for 10 years and for what ever reason it becomes a collectible and you sell it for 3 times what it was worth when you won it you owe taxes on the profit realized.. American by birth, Patriot by choice. I would rather die standing on my two feet defending our Constitution than live a lifetime on my knees......

Understood but who gets to decide what the coins are worth ? Like I said, many are unique in the fact that they are the finest examples known. You can't very well use past auction records as a way of deciding value. Many many grey areas with this case. I'm thinking the ones who will profit the most will be the lawyers.

 

[flasks]

Mel Fisher (deceased) had NO salvage rights beyond the median high tide anywhere along Florida's East coast. I hunted (and found) the last Galleon (1964) since the sinking of the 1715 fleet as a result of a violent hurricane. I have found dozens of gold coins, hundreds of silver reales as well as maravitas, jewelry, pottery fragments, lead sheathing from the hull and several small ballast stones. As far as I know it's still finders keepers if with-in the median high tide mark, see following statement. If an article is found that does not tie directly to an indigenous tribe or privately owned beach front land (condos, beach houses,etc.) the land comes under the State and county laws. My experience of beach hunting which spans 60 years taught me one lesson...just keep your mouth shut and move on! Picture is of a large emerald a lady I met found while walking the beach in the Sebastian area of Florida. Precious stones were carried in bulk raw as well as faceted along with other treasures the Spanish had pilfered from South America. She refused $7M for it by a jewelry shop. If that raw emerald would take a faceted cutting to say half it's raw weight you'd be looking at a high 6 figure price. The photo shows the asking price of $30 in 2005...I don't know what's become of it now. By the way...she was not "treasure" hunter when she found it but rather collecting colored beach glass. She wondered way no rounded and sand worn edges were on that green piece so she took it to the jeweler and he's the one that identified what it was...

 

[Jeff95531]

Understood but who gets to decide what the coins are worth ? Like I said, many are unique in the fact that they are the finest examples known. You can't very well use past auction records as a way of deciding value. Many many grey areas with this case. I'm thinking the ones who will profit the most will be the lawyers.

Don't forget our friendly local, state and federal tax agencies. They'll get a chunk of it and give it to the greenies....in our best interest of course.

 

[JUNKER]

Well the cat is out of the bag now. And what I said before easy come easy go but it's not over until the f-- lady sings anything could happen but their in for a long ride I think they did some of their home work but not enough. We'll have to wait to see how this one plays out if we live long enough. They should of remembered the three monkey's

 

[Rob in KS]

I sure hope they don't end up too far in debt over this.

 

[carnet56]

if it was me I would arrange for a robbery lol and tell them dag gone some one stole it

 

[dustytrails123]

Well there going to spend a good portion of there finds in lawyer expenses fighting for this treasure with every leach including the government on there backs...good luck proving it belonged to the saddle ridge hoard and even so how can relatives make claim to something there great grandfather had stolen thats beyond me

 

[G1sammons]

It's a sick and twisted government we get robed from daily! The EPA will probably get them for digging in a watershed area without a permit also.. And then send in the greenies to remove the mercury from there property ...just in case they missed something..

 

[Lanny in AB]

I'm happy that someone actually had some good fortune, and I'm saddened that everyone else seems to want a slice of it. What's wrong with just letting them enjoy their find? It's quite a statement that so many people hold their hands out when someone else has some amazing luck.

All the best,

Lanny

http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/metal-detecting-gold/69-bedrock-gold-mysteries.html

 

[Hoser John]

#1 rule of finds-SILENCE IS INDEED GOLDEN especially now-John

 

[pods]

The king has to get his tithe.
My utter contempt for something like this makes anything else I want to write here risk my membership.
Just awful.