My sister and her killing son... Just to play with his new rifle.

[RGINN]

Well I saw the pic, and I'm gonna go against the popular trend. Could be a .223, but that rabbit should be exploded, more than what you see in the pic. They don't make a hollow point for the .223 unless things have changed radically. They make softpoint and hardball. I would have to examine the rabbit closer. The .223 round is so fast and small that when it hits something it has a tendency to vaporize, and you may have a dozen exit holes in a small animal. A .223 will hit a twig and explode the bullet, so what was the logic of using that round in the jungles of VietNam, but we did in the M-16. AK-47 fired a far more reliable round. However, it wasn't done by a cougar, as there wouldn't be anything left to photograph. In tactical operations I carried a Mini-14 and an AR-15 which both use the .223 round. Flat trajectory for a thousand yards and you can pop off a lot of rounds and make a lot of noise real quick. Sometimes the sight of those weapons would discourage any gunplay on the street, but it's different these days. Now ignore my speculations and ramblings about the round. All young boys will be tempted to shoot an animal with their first gun, regardless of their training or role models. Some give in, some don't, some never do it again, and some keep it up. It is time for you, UNCLE MikeofAustin, to step in and give some guidance. Don't judge, don't accuse, but by all means teach, offer an example, and provide guidance.

 

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[mikeofaustin]

Judging by the size of the blades of grass, (St Augustine), and the wood chips and the size of the baby rabbit. I come to several conclusions.

1. The rabbit was definitely killed by a human, unless it was caught by a preditor who just played with it and ate part of it. I have had cats that would catch mice and small rabbits and would kill it and only eat a small part of it. But I see that the front legs are missing, so that makes me question a preditor even doing it. The picture doesn't really show the breast plate blown open but photos sometimes to give the whole different picture than it is seen in person.

2. Maybe not a .223 hollow point, because there would be nothing left of the rabbit if it was hit in the breast plate. Now maybe the legs, it may be possible, but again, the size of the rabbit and a .223 hollow point I don't think he made a direct hit, maybe he hit the ground just under it and blew the breast plate and front legs off. That could be possible. I know, I used to hunt and I know what different size calibers hollow point and full metal jackets can do to animals and humans.

3. If it was a preditor, as small as the rabbit is, there would be 3/4 to most of the rabbit gone.

4. First, I have a question about the age of the boy, before any gun was given to him, he should have gone to a gun safety course and had adult supervision.

I possibly see something down the road that will cause some real problems, not just with the gun and the boy, but something really major. I also question where is the father figure?

Update. Sorry, I'm not on here everyday. But;

He's 14 years old. Not had a father figure since 11. Also, for what it's worth, I thought the blades of grass were actually nut-grass (similar to monkey grass - looks like blades of st. augustine, but larger. I could be wrong).
I was also thinking that if he hit the rabbit with his .223 just on the outside of a 'direct hit', it would surely take this look (I've 'done in' lots of gophers like this in my time with similar outcomes - gophers clog up the combine/cutter on the farm equipment big time (sorry)).

Because I don't really care for my sister, I stay away from that whole spoiled bunch. They are All spoiled. It starts with the mom. I remember almost 20 years ago when she called me to ask "Which guy should I marry? One guy is good looking, but the other one has lots money". She married for money of course. She divorced him a few years back after she had 4 kids with him, and is now sitting pretty in a huge house, no doubt because of child support. Her ex-husband is a GREAT guy. In fact, I told him that if he should ever go to court, I would be on his side. I dislike my sister that much. Plus, she lives about 15 hours away.

I did post a comment on her facebook saying that this is not a cougar. It's a rifle round. And for her to look into it. I'm still waiting for what she says in support of her snowflake.

 

[mikeofaustin]

Well I saw the pic, and I'm gonna go against the popular trend. Could be a .223, but that rabbit should be exploded, more than what you see in the pic. They don't make a hollow point for the .223 unless things have changed radically. They make softpoint and hardball. I would have to examine the rabbit closer. The .223 round is so fast and small that when it hits something it has a tendency to vaporize, and you may have a dozen exit holes in a small animal. A .223 will hit a twig and explode the bullet, so what was the logic of using that round in the jungles of VietNam, but we did in the M-16. AK-47 fired a far more reliable round. However, it wasn't done by a cougar, as there wouldn't be anything left to photograph. In tactical operations I carried a Mini-14 and an AR-15 which both use the .223 round. Flat trajectory for a thousand yards and you can pop off a lot of rounds and make a lot of noise real quick. Sometimes the sight of those weapons would discourage any gunplay on the street, but it's different these days. Now ignore my speculations and ramblings about the round. All young boys will be tempted to shoot an animal with their first gun, regardless of their training or role models. Some give in, some don't, some never do it again, and some keep it up. It is time for you, UNCLE MikeofAustin, to step in and give some guidance. Don't judge, don't accuse, but by all means teach, offer an example, and provide guidance.

You're right, I think I'll contact his true father (the good guy), and casually mention this. The mom is as naive as a____________.

 

[Shortstack]

I agree with RGINN. That rabbit wasn't hit with a .223. Varmint rounds are in the .223 family, generally speaking, and tend to explode the animal into many pieces at 200 to 300 yards. Just last night, I watched a shooting program on the Outdoors Channel and the 2 men were shooting parairy dogs and ground squirrels at 100 to 300 yards and the animals would subdivide into 2 or more pieces. The men were shooting the new Ruger .204 round and, I think, .250........ not sure on that second one. I have a .22-250 Ruger M-77 bolt action varmint rifle that I supply with 45 gr. hollow point rounds. The .223 and my .22-250 are practically the same projectiles, but with a little differently shaped cases and powder. IF that boy shot this rabbit, he either BARELY clipped him or he used a different rifle. That wound looks like a high-speed .22 hollowpoint or a .22 magnum round. With the paws missing, I'd ask the kid about THEM. Why would he cut off some of the rabbit's paws? But, then again, grown men cut off a buck deer's antlers for trophy purposes as well as the entire head / neck area. When I was a young guy, some of my friends would cure rabbit pelts and make small items, such as mittens, from them.

 

[artzstuff1]

I say a good crack in the skull with the butt of the rifle would work wonders on the boy!!!!!

 

[RGINN]

Well, I apologize, as I have posted bs so far. Maybe I could continue and go into great detail about what a .223 round did to the chest of someone who was goin for a .12 gauge. It could have been a cougar I guess. Perhaps I should have contacted his true father and said, 'tell your boy don't go for that shotgun as I have a 30 round clip and am nervous.) MikeofAustin, you're the boy's uncle. In my family, uncles were the same as your dad. Don't rely on nobody else, but step up to the plate yourself and mentor this boy. We don't care about his mom and 'true father' as they obviously don't care a lot about him. You're just the man to do it.

 

[mikeofaustin]

Well, I apologize, as I have posted bs so far. Maybe I could continue and go into great detail about what a .223 round did to the chest of someone who was goin for a .12 gauge. It could have been a cougar I guess. Perhaps I should have contacted his true father and said, 'tell your boy don't go for that shotgun as I have a 30 round clip and am nervous.) MikeofAustin, you're the boy's uncle. In my family, uncles were the same as your dad. Don't rely on nobody else, but step up to the plate yourself and mentor this boy. We don't care about his mom and 'true father' as they obviously don't care a lot about him. You're just the man to do it.

Sadly, I'm 16 hours away from him. But I understand what you're saying.

 

[mikeofaustin]

My sisters response;

"I examined the baby rabbit up close, and when I turned it over it was obvious that another animal killed it and intended to (and did) eat it. Half it's face was eaten off. so sad! I have foxes, deer, raccoons, skunks, and RATTLESNAKES in my yard... ouch! My kids don't like to kill things, only target shoot which they do at a range. It's illegal to shoot around my house as I'm in a subdivision and in the city limits. Sorry you feel the kids could/would do this. They were sad as I was, once I showed them the pic. Take Care, Sis."

Is there anyone other than me saying, "What a biatch". I told you my sister is this way. can you imagine growing up with her?

 

[TheHarleyMan2]

Well I saw the pic, and I'm gonna go against the popular trend. Could be a .223, but that rabbit should be exploded, more than what you see in the pic. They don't make a hollow point for the .223 unless things have changed radically. They make softpoint and hardball. I would have to examine the rabbit closer. The .223 round is so fast and small that when it hits something it has a tendency to vaporize, and you may have a dozen exit holes in a small animal. A .223 will hit a twig and explode the bullet, so what was the logic of using that round in the jungles of VietNam, but we did in the M-16. AK-47 fired a far more reliable round. However, it wasn't done by a cougar, as there wouldn't be anything left to photograph. In tactical operations I carried a Mini-14 and an AR-15 which both use the .223 round. Flat trajectory for a thousand yards and you can pop off a lot of rounds and make a lot of noise real quick. Sometimes the sight of those weapons would discourage any gunplay on the street, but it's different these days. Now ignore my speculations and ramblings about the round. All young boys will be tempted to shoot an animal with their first gun, regardless of their training or role models. Some give in, some don't, some never do it again, and some keep it up. It is time for you, UNCLE MikeofAustin, to step in and give some guidance. Don't judge, don't accuse, but by all means teach, offer an example, and provide guidance.

They do make hollow points for .223 and have been for over 20 years I know of. I know I have 55 boxes of them. The tip is drilled out about the size of 1/16th of an inch. Winchester made them for years.

 

[RGINN]

Thanks for the info, HarleyMan2. We were using .223 a lot in the late 70's and only had access to hardball and soft tip. I think a hollow point on the .223 round wouldn't make that much difference, as the soft point explodes pretty well on impact, through my experience anyway.

 

[packerbacker]

I believe your sister is lying. I wouldn't normally get involved in a family spat thing but your young nephew is involved here. The reason I think she is lying is simple. Why would she post, on Facebook, a picture that was to represent what a predator could do and post the lesser mangled side of the rabbit? If you want to make a point about something with a picture, you would capture the more graphic scene wouldn't you?
I don't know why but something is telling me this .223 is actually a Russian or Chinese made SKS. If that's the case, although ALL guns are dangerous, the SKS is a vary potent rifle. It's the closest thing to an assault rifle allowed in my state. It would be an expensive "plinking" rifle or small game weapon compared to a .22LR and it really isn't much of a hunting rifle. One of my sons got a wild pig with one a while back but my sons have hunted for many years, have been trained and mentored and are very accurate shooters. It doesn't seem like the boy wanted the gun for hunting because there isn't an adult involved that would take him hunting so what was the motive behind wanting this gun? It is NOT a gun to put in the hands of a 14 year old unless he gets drafted. Unless you go through all 10 rounds, which is the normal top loading capacity including the chamber, it is highly possible to have a chambered round when you are done shooting. A semi-automatic is not something to learn with, especially when there isn't a teacher around. If he just wanted a "plinking" gun he should have gotten a .22 and used it only under strict adult supervision.

 

[BIG61AL]

I detest killing animals for sport. You want to hunt - fine - but you better eat whatever you kill. That way the killing has some purpose. Killing for fun is just plain pathectic.

 

[Shortstack]

I detest killing animals for sport. You want to hunt - fine - but you better eat whatever you kill. That way the killing has some purpose. Killing for fun is just plain pathectic.

I don't think prairie dogs taste very good and jackrabbits are TOUGH meat.

 

[mikeofaustin]

Here is the rifle in question. I can't make it out, but I'm sure someone will. Also, from the looks of the clip, it seems rather small for a .223. What do you think?

 

[mikeofaustin]

I'll need to ask my brother what that rifle was as this photo was shot in the rear of his property. I can remember my nephew talking all day about his new .223. I have to wonder now that I've seen that photo. It really does look like a .22 long.

I'd ask him directly but he hasn't 'friend-ed' me yet on facebook (rolleyes). Nor, can I ask the mom, because that question would go over about as well as a _____. I'll keep probing though.

//my sis just upsets me to no end. I guess you guys can tell that.

 

[Shortstack]

The rifle in the photo sure looks like a Ruger model 10-22 which is a .22 rifle that has many different types of feed systems. It has an interior rotary magazine in it's stock form; straight external clips and banana clips of varying capacities are readily available from after market companies. You can also get sporterize stocks to make them "sexy" looking; some of those have callasping stocks to add to the "mystique".
The rifle, with that basic wooden stock and the internal rotary mag runs about $225.

 

[packerbacker]

Yeah, I'd say .22. A .223 with a clip that long is illegal in California. He should lean into it when shooting and he should not be shooting across water. Between the creekbed and the water he is in ricochet heaven. The land looks pretty flat so no telling where a miss would end up. He needs to set up specific targets with a backdrop and learn to shoot that way. Then properly clean the gun, lock the gun up, give an adult the key and look forward to the next time.

 

[Shortstack]

ssssshshhhshhhshhhhhh! he is hunting wabbits.

That wouldn't be bad at all, if he'd clean and eat the things.

 

[DigginThePast]

Here is the rifle in question. I can't make it out, but I'm sure someone will. Also, from the looks of the clip, it seems rather small for a .223. What do you think?

Yup, looks to be a 10-22. He needs to bring his left arm in a bit so that his elbow is supported by his torso, let the rifle rest on his left hand and "chicken wing" his right arm or better yet use a USGI sling. Oh yeah, and follow hunter ethics.

Better yet, tell him to bring that rifle to a shoot near him. http://www.appleseedinfo.org/

 

[TheHarleyMan2]

Yeah just like the last 2 postings, Ruger 10-22. I got one, it's a sweet little rifle!