p.o.o. approved

[N-Lionberger]

If GW calls only he will know, what about the rest of us?

 

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[Goldwasher]

If GW calls only he will know, what about the rest of us?

Exactly
If I call I may be on the phone for an hour and I'm normally on line at like 6 to 8 am or in the evening.

I'm not messing with you. Just a few questions that others would like to hear answers for. That I can check on later.

Basically what you did...everyone has been told costs $1200.00 bucks to even start the process.

I'm sorry you didn't pick up on my sarcasm. It is not directed at you it is directed at a situation. Sorry it came off that way.

As soon as I finish an estimate for my land lord I'm gonna call..now that you harrassed me into it

 

[Goldwasher]

Who's telling the stories GW?

go stub your toe some where...this is all over your head anyway

 

[Hefty1]

I for one, see no reason why you cant post your information here? Black out what you need to. I would like to know the names of all persons talked to in your district, agencys, permits, costs, what ever you have.

Now that would help the other miners proceed, as you say.

 

[Goldwasher]

Did get to call and chat a bit last night. We had to go so, Ill call again tonight.

Good info. Many of my suspected thoughts were confirmed and backed up things mentioned on the threads in regard to
motors and mining.

dreadgernauts reason for going this route makes sense. Guys on blm may chooses to do it differently. He is in National Forrest. And not working in stream.
However within that dreaded hundred yard zone. And running a pump. in a way that we are being told is/MAY be a diversion.

per my talks with the waterboard office and Dreadgernaut it is not a diversion.

Guess what you don't have to drop 1200 bucks to figure out if they will "allow" you to operate.

Still the same situation for most you will never meet the criteria to need the permits they say you need.

It's more of a decision of am I going to jump through hoops or stand up for my self if I choose to do what I know is allowed based on actual law.

I have another few more specific questions for the next call.

The DFW FAQ page is a scare tactic. They are hoping that people will read it and think it is more trouble than it is worth...and just go panning or give up.

Read and know the actual laws. Make your own choices. Use their system when appropriate.

Do not blindly follow the FACTS as given by the Alphabet Soup creeps.

 

[Bejay]

My observation about all this becomes one of "CONTROL". The POO is a contract disavowing your Federal Mining Rights....those rights you relinquished in order to work your claim. It appears you achieved that ability, and I applaud you for the success. Hopefully the application to successfully work will not be overruled as others attempt to achieve success working their claims. But as noted I believe the CONTROL factor is the key....until challenges occur to halt such approval.

Again I applaud you for your effort and end result to mine. I wonder how many other miners will be willing to enter into contracts that negate their Federal Mining Rights.
Good luck to you. State rights vs Federal Rights!....we see this occurring most often now!

Bejay

 

[dredgernaut]

hey bejay , thanks , ill take what I can get one step at a time , I'm just happy to dig

 

[dredgernaut]

hello hefty 1 ,
I'm sorry I will not show my papers because:
unless your my neighbor your probably gonna have different agency's and districts so , the people you will need to speak with will be different , and maybe different regulations or feelings about mining , I know that shouldn't matter , but it does
also if a bunch of guys start calling these few people saying " I was told that you said " or " you gave someone a permit to run a trommel , and I only want to highbank ",or " why not me" . Then I will probably get screwed in the long run , all scenarios will be different , I told you what I did , no one told me , I stumbled my way through . I know I'm lucky , but I'm not gonna gamble what I achieved in order to help others , but I did and will tell you how I went about it

however , I will say -I deal with forest service and water board for my district or region only , I have no dealing with blm.
call ask for mining official , ask if they have a couple minutes to answer dumb questions , explain your situation , and ask what would be required to move forward and your desire to conform to their requirements , the water board is the agency that will decide for the most part if you are gonna work or not , be very polite , however they will not approve anything that discharges sediments back into any waterway , I am working near a creek but I'm high and dry , my water re-enters clean , also I only work for maybe up to 8 or so weeks a year , they emailed me a p.o.o. application , I filled 2 out , sent one to each of my governing agency and waited to see what happened , water board took steps and kept me informed of progress , f.s. not soo much help , I have to call and chase them for info on progress , but always politely , and understanding. however I am still waiting for an approval to reopen an old road , and install a gate , there will be a bond for this , IF approved , and it will probably take another year to even get an answer if possible , for now I use existing roads , and campsite , i leave only footprints ,
if you need more description of process than that , than p.m. me your number and I will call ya ,
that goes for anyone seriously wanting more info , but I will not give any names , nor do I want any help this summer , lol

 

[Hefty1]

dredgernaut, no need to be sorry, as I knew exactly what you were going to state as the reason not to.
I also had a POO many, many years ago. Till it expired and then for many years afterwards kept working without one. Found out I didn't need one, Fed laws and water rights was all I needed.
Always have been polite to the agency's, till they turn. Then put them in their place.
Good luck with your endeavors.


PS I used to go deer hunting in Wis Dells. Just northwest of town by the old fire ranger tower. Don't know if its still there. But that whole area turned into condos, apts.

 

[Bejay]

Well dredgernaut, you made my point exactly. Your ability to achieve success will be attempted by many others. You understand that many others will give rise to the opposition ranting and raving about the big oooooppps allowing motorized mining to continue. While all this will occur in time you will be able to mine per your request.

The agencies will again be called upon to gain more control and stop mining. At same time miners will fall prey to the concept that State and Agency entities have preemption over the Federal Mining Laws......per States setting precedents for other anti groups to follow suit. The anti crowd is not going away.

Bejay

 

[dredgernaut]

ya bejay , well should I feel bad about saying you can still recover your ability to work with motors , by following the new state rules . just for the record the state is in control right now , look around whos enforcing what , if the feds want to step up and protect my rights at any time , I have lost nothing and hurt no one , should I just complain about being violated or go back to work , or break the rules and end up like Brandon . they are not my laws , I do not agree with most of them , yet there they are in print . opposition will never stop anyways , like I said earlier "I will take what I can get , 1 step at a time" and others should too if they want to move forward , currently your federal rights aren't worth anything when mining is the topic
if and when federal rights again supersede the new state laws then problem solved , if the state gets worse , than again I will try to comply to preserve my current and future rights to work , you can keep worrying about your past rights with an agency that as of now that does not care about you either
if others follow suit , I do not feel bad , I'm happy they are up and running , more permitted mining is also a stronger defense for mining rights I think ,
danged if you do- danged if you don't , I thought people would be happy to know it can be done , apparently your not
the pro-crowd is not going away either

 

[Goldwasher]

I am glad and don't blame you one bit. there is a lot to be learned just from you doing what you did. It surely shows a different situation is there than what most small scale guys are told and believe.

The frustrating part is that it is different on a person to person basis and that is the opposite of how "laws" and " regulations" are supposed to work.

Thanks for sharing your doins'

 

[calsierra-Dan]

I Wanna know the difference on mining Private land Vs A Mining claim!

 

[Bejay]

Well dredgernaut I did not say I was unhappy nor did I say I was unhappy for you. Not sure how you reached that perception. I was merely pointing out some issues I feel are relevant and "paint a picture" of potential "unhappiness" by the anti crowd. I believe everyone can agree the anti crowd will not be appeased by the influx of miners achieving success overcoming the obstacles keeping them from mining.

It will be interesting to see what transpires. I can not disagree with what you say as the rule of law is not something we have been able to rely on.

Bejay

 

[winners58]

I Wanna know the difference on mining Private land Vs A Mining claim!

the difference is who owns the surface and the mineral estate.

on a mining claim the controlling factors are the mining laws and FLPMA
on private land you would just fall under state surface mining regulations

over a certain level of activity both could be regulated by the state, as they would have MOU's with Federal agencies

 

[Goldwasher]

I Wanna know the difference on mining Private land Vs A Mining claim!

Dan I have paperwork from El Dorado County that states what your allowed to do at the county level. They are very easy on you.
After that you have to deal with what the state says you can do.

None of the mining laws protect you on private land.

I got my info from planning when I opened up shop. I wanted to know at what point I would need any special licensing to guide people. Or evaluate and help people work their property.

The lady went into the back offices for a good ten minutes to pull info and talk to a supervisor. I was getting pretty worried.

She came out with some copies and pulled out a highlighter to show me some things I needed to know. I left with some great info and a big smile on my face.

Stop by the shop once I open first week of may. I'll make you some copies.

I moved over next to the River Shack.

 

[calsierra-Dan]

Dan I have paperwork from El Dorado County that states what your allowed to do at the county level. They are very easy on you.
After that you have to deal with what the state says you can do.

None of the mining laws protect you on private land.

I got my info from planning when I opened up shop. I wanted to know at what point I would need any special licensing to guide people. Or evaluate and help people work their property.

The lady went into the back offices for a good ten minutes to pull info and talk to a supervisor. I was getting pretty worried.

She came out with some copies and pulled out a highlighter to show me some things I needed to know. I left with some great info and a big smile on my face.

Stop by the shop once I open first week of may. I'll make you some copies.

I moved over next to the River Shack.

cool i will have to stop by when ur open , i was wondering why it looked quiet over by ur shop lol!

 

[chlsbrns]

But none of that matters, cause didn't you hear that SB 637 banned motors for mining within 300 ft of a banned waterway....

Lol

Actually​ it says:. (e) It is unlawful to possess a vacuum or suction dredge in areas,
or in or within 100 yards of waters, that are closed to the use of
vacuum or suction dredges.

Dredges not motors.

 

[Goldwasher]

Sarcasm

 

[calsierra-Dan]

Dredging Sucks! lol