Ray Howland and the Adolph Ruth Mystery

Matthew Roberts

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Apr 27, 2013
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Paradise Valley, Arizona
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In 1917 Ray Howland was a young man engaged in the business of painting automobiles in Detroit Michigan. Ray and his wife Elizabeth (Lizzie) rented a small upstairs apartment near downtown Detroit. One evening Ray was reading an article in a magazine titled "Lost Mines of the West." Within a month Ray Howland and his wife had moved from Michigan to Phoenix Arizona where Ray opened a small auto paint shop on Van Buren Street.
Howland planned to search the Superstition Mountains for lost mines and Spanish treasure he believed had been hidden there. By 1924 the Howlands had moved to Mesa to be closer to the Superstitions and Ray again worked his auto paint business on east Main Street.

On July 28, 1927 the Mesa Tribune Journal reported Ray Howland had found the remains of a Spanish corral, crumbled adobe buildings and various Spanish artifacts in the Superstition Mountains. Howland was now making trips into the Superstitions on a regular basis. So much so that he neglected his auto paint business and the bank who had loaned Howland the money to finance it took it back from him in February of 1928. Ray's business which was known as "Howlands Mesa Auto Painting and Duco Service" was taken over by a Los Angeles man, Albert Henderson. Howland and his wife began living on the edge of the Superstition Mountains.

In December of 1930, less than 5 months before Adolph Ruth arrived in Arizona, the Phoenix papers reported Howland had discovered Spanish armor, sword, lance, crossbow and arrows at a place called Castle Rock (Cathedral Rock) in Barkley Basin on the south edge of the Superstitions. Howland also claimed he found a Spanish graveyard near Castle Rock.

In late January of 1931, three months before Adolph Ruth arrived in Arizona, a Los Angeles Times writer Ernest Douglas wrote an article about Howland and his wife Lizzie and their searches in the Superstition Mountains. Several other newspapers picked up the article and printed it. On February 11, 1931 it appeared in the Miami, Oklahoma Daily News Record on page 9. The article was titled, "Hunting 37 Mines."

Here is that article as written by Ernest Douglas:


Hunting 37 Mines
By ERNEST DOUGLAS

Sixteen years ago, Ray Howland was an automobile painter in Detroit. He owned a prosperous business and a comfortable home, had just married. One evening he chanced to read a magazine article entitled "Lost Mines of the West." He jumped up suddenly and yelled across the living room: “Hey, Lizzie, let's go to Arizona and find ourselves a couple of golden mountains."
"All right, Ray," agreed Lizzie, who had been reading the same article. "I can start tomorrow." And that's how Arizona's most picturesque, most persistent, most enthusiastic lost mine hunters got their start in the strange occupation, calling, mania, call it what you please to which they are devoting their active, rigorous, dangerous, but very happy lives. Their business, their hobby, their passion, is to run down the lost mine and buried treasure stories current in Arizona.

From the Grand Canyon to the Mexican border they have roamed, from the Colorado to the Rio Grande. They have driven an abused old car over thousands of desert miles that never before felt a rubber tire. They have prodded reluctant pack burrows over heights so steep and rough and bare that even the wild mountain sheep never range there. And when the going became too hard for the donkeys they still pushed on, on, on. They have faced death in a thousand forms, with heat, thirst, poisoned water, vicious beasts, venomous reptiles, accidents far from human succor to search for ancient antiques that Spaniards and pioneers are supposed to have worked between the days of Coronado and Kit Carson.

There are hundreds of such frontier legends, some written down in histories and others kept alive only by word of mouth where prospectors, cowboys, sheep herders and other desert wanderers gather to spin their farfetched tales. Many are pure fiction, of course. And some are true. The Howland’s know all the lost mine traditions, they have delved into the evidence back of each, and reached the conclusion that 37 are sufficiently well authenticated to deserve investigation. So they are investigating them, this big, grinning, talkative, sunburned optimist and his sturdy, trustful, quieter, no less sunburned and no less optimistic wife-partner.

Two of those 37 desert mysteries have been solved. The Lost Padre Mine, in the Estrella Mountains, and the Lost Burro Placers, in the Eagle Tail Mountains have been rediscovered by the Howland’s and sold for money to carry on their quest for the Lost Dutchman, the most famous, most sought, and probably the richest of all Arizona's mislaid bonanzas.

For four years now they have dropped everything else to comb the rugged, jagged, cruel, weird-looking Superstition range for the Mina Sombrero from which Don Miguel Peralta took many mule loads of gold-laced ore before the Mexican War, which the Apaches spent an entire year in hiding after they had slain 400 of Don Miguel's workers. And which was relocated in the 1880's by two eccentric and ill-fated Germans named Walz and Wiser— never to be seen since by human eye.

Now success is in their grasp, say the Howland’s. The statement that the Lost Dutchman has been ''almost found" by this reformed auto painter and his wife will bring a derisive smile to the face of many an old-timer. It has been "almost found" so many times that its very existence is often questioned by a skeptical new generation. But none of the other seekers had the stick-to-itiveness, the contempt for hardships, of the Howlands. Nor did they have the letters that Jake Wiser wrote to his brother in Michigan.

Soon after their arrival the Howland’s began piecing together every scrap of information they could obtain about the Lost Dutchman. From chiefs and medicine men of the Pima Indians they learned how the Superstitions got their name. The Pimas believe that evil spirits dwell up in the forbidding fastness who will turn to stone any of their tribe who invade the forbidden region. So they have never ventured beyond the utmost foothills. Howland sought out grizzled Apache warriors who in their younger days had accompanied raiding parties, ignorant or scornful of Pima myths. But when he brought up the subject of a gold mine, there was silence.
Silence from all,that is except Old Tom. Tom told of the massacre of 400 Mexican miners. One party had been slain while in route to an arastara, a crude mill on Salt River with a pack train of ore.

Back Howland went to the mountains. Ray found the piles of ore left where the pack sacks had fallen and rotted away. He found bones of humans and mules, remnants of saddles and other gear. He thought he could back track from there to the mine, but he could not. Weeks and weeks he tried, but the goal still eluded him. And Tom would tell no more less he bring down upon himself the fearful Apache curse laid upon any of his people who might lead the hated whites to the yellow stuff they so dearly loved.

Only one Apache ever dreamed of defying that curse. While imprisoned at Florida and later at Fort Sill. Geronimo, their noted war chief, tried to buy his freedom with the secret of the Lost Dutchman. But his jailers set his babblings down as cunning lies concocted by the captive in the hope that he might be taken back to his homeland and there contrive to escape. Gold could be picked up in handfuls where the Mexicans had been surprised and slaughtered, Geronimo said.

But no paleface would ever find the spot unaided, for after throwing the bodies of the victims into the shafts and tunnels, the Apaches worked a whole winter to loosen a section of mountainside and start an immense slide which obliterated every vestige of human activity. They wanted no mining settlements in their country. Geronimo is dead. Tom is dead. Every other Apache who might conceivably point out the location of the Lost Dutchman is dead.

The Howland’s went to Hermosillo, capital of the state of Sonora, to inquire if there had ever been a Don Miguel Peralta with a grant from the king of Spain, 15 miles square, in the center of what is now Arizona. Indeed there had. And somewhere in that grant he had found a mine so rich that one year he paid tithes to the church on an income of 3,000.000 pesos. Approximately a million and a half U. S. dollars. The mine had been called La Mina Sombrero because it was near a slender peak that when viewed from one direction resembled a high-crowned Mexican hat.

That peak was also known as Picacho Aguja or Needle Butte. After the Mexican War and the treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo, which ceded to the United States all territory north of the Gila River, Don Miguel became alarmed. He did not trust Americanos and had no faith that his grant was valid. Somewhere locked in these rock masses lies gold . . . including the bones of Spanish adventurers massacred by Apaches. Don Miguel did not believe his grant would be recognized by the government at Washington. So he sent in a large company of mineros with instructions to bring out the richest ore with all speed. Only a few survivors got home with news of the massacre. The Mexicans did not again venture into the Superstitions. La Mina Sombrero was abandoned.

For 16 years, Ray Howland and his wife have braved every hardship, running down legends or myths of lost and abandoned treasures in Arizona's mountains, actually finding two of the most famous claims of all in the Superstition Mountains of Arizona.

Scarcely less thrilling was the story of the two Jakes, Walz and Wiser. They must have been real prospectors, those Teutons, for they did find the mina of Don Miguel. Their picks uncovered at least a portion of the ledge one day in 1881. Several times they carried into Florence ore that was "lousy with gold" and threw the village into wild excitement. To inquiries they turned deaf ears.

One evening, after a long shift's 'work, Walz remarked that he "smelt Injuns," and thought he would do a little scouting. Wiser told him to go ahead while he prepared supper in their camp hidden among the jagged rock formations.

Walz was scarcely out of sight before Wiser was attacked by a band of naked warriors. Put on his guard by Walz's hunch, he was not exactly surprised. He made a break, shooting as he went, lost himself among the rocks, outguessed even the wily Apaches, and somehow reached the level desert floor, a wilderness of fierce cacti and thorny bushes. Wiser struck southward toward the Gila River, but was too far gone to make it. Some wandering Pimas found him lying under the pitiless sun, unconscious. The Pimas did not touch him, but notified a man named Walker, an ex-army surgeon who lived on a ranch near Sacaton. Walker went out and brought him in.

From Wiser's clenched hand he took a fragment of quartz that was almost half gold. With all his skill Walker ministered to the unfortunate fugitive. Wiser's mind cleared. He told his rescuer of the mine, the attack, that Walz had certainly been slain. But Wiser's terrible ordeal had been too much for even his iron constitution to withstand. Walker told him that he was going to die, asked if there were relatives to whom he wished to leave any message. "Hell no”, was the reply, “They never done nothin' for me." Before he died, Wiser gave Walker a rudely-drawn map on buckskin. Without the oral directions that accompanied it, the map was worthless.

Only Walker could know the starting point, which features of the range certain marks and notations meant. After the funeral, Walker prepared to lead an expedition in search of the mine. Right there his wife interposed. So Walker gave over his plan, temporarily, he thought. Mrs. Walker never did relent. The matter dragged along until Walker himself died. The map fell into other hands, but the only person capable of interpreting it was gone.
It happened that the Wiser story to the Lost Dutchman saga was the last into which the Howland’s made inquiry. When at last, four years ago, they learned that his name was Jake Wiser, Mrs. Howland exclaimed: "Now that's odd! My mother's father's name was Wiser. And it seems to me that when I was a little girl I heard him mention a brother Jake, who was somewhere out west. I wonder if he could have been this 'Dutchman. She dug into an old trunk. There, among other family heirlooms handed down from her mother, were several letters written by Jake Wiser to her grandfather.

Just what the letters disclosed cannot be told just yet, but the Howland’s admit that they contained information which was indeed illuminating. For one thing they found that they had been ranging too far east for the Lost Dutchman. They, and everyone else, had assumed that the "Sombrero" of Peralta, his Picacho Aguja, was the peak labeled "Sombrero Butte" on modern maps. It was not, it was Weaver's Needle, a mighty column of stone that is the most striking landmark in the northwest corner of the Superstitions. Mysterious writings, the meaning of which no man knows, prehistoric inscriptions found on rocks in the Superstitions.

Wiser’s partner Walz was not dead. He, too, found his way out, made his way to Phoenix. He settled on a little farm where he raised chickens. A big flood inundated Phoenix and his homestead and while he was trying to save his animals he caught a cold that developed into pneumonia and resulted in death.

All these different threads were traced and woven into a comprehensive pattern by the Howland’s. The lost Dutchman took a far stronger hold upon their romantic imaginations than any of the other legends into which they delved. Eventually they returned to take up their pursuit of the greatest prize of all. They explored Moonshine Canyon, Dead Man's Flat, Screaming Squaw Cave, Disappointment Valley, Panther Canyon, Desolation Ridge, ever seeking some sign, some trace.

With renewed confidence they invaded the wilds once more. The search was not over by any means, but with Wiser's hints to guide them they could confine it to a comparatively limited territory. Proof that they were on the right track was soon forthcoming. One day Mrs. Howland picked up a rusted old Mexican spur of a type no Yankee ever wore. Not far away was a man's thigh bone. In the clefts of a Spanish Graveyard, a castellated hillock of fantastically weathered stone atop Skeleton Ridge, they found more bones and implements.

They came upon the remains of corrals and of mining tools so rusty that they dissolved into flakes at a touch. And then, with triumph and untold riches in sight, disaster. One day Howland came to the Place of the Yellow Medicine. He had heard of a spring that the Apaches shunned as deadly, but it did not occur to him that this trickle of clear water was the same. So he drank. Yellow Medicine Spring is full of arsenic. Howland barely made his way back to camp. His wife rigged up a travois of poles and blankets behind one of their burros. Then began a heroic journey over mountains and deserts.

Somehow she got him to Mesa, alive, but no more. There were long weeks in hospital for Ray Howland with his Lizzie ever at his side. Then long months of painfully slow convalescence. Now he is raring to go back. "Probably it'll take a steam shovel to strip off the overburden," he remarked the other day. "But that'll be easy, once we find the spot. It won't be long, eh, Lizzie?" "And then what?" He grinned and consulted a battered notebook. "The Lost Squaw mine next? That's down south of Ajo somewhere, you know. Then we'll take a whirl at the Adams Diggings. And the Dr. Thorne mine, which is on Tonto Creek sure as the devil made sidewinders. After that, the Little Tehochcpi, or maybe the Lost Soldiers mine. -- END --

Over the next 3 years Ray Howland would become involved with the Adolph Ruth mystery. That involvement is a key to understanding what happened to Adolph Ruth, why it happened and who was involved.

Matthew
 

deducer

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Yet another outstanding post from you, Matthew. I look forward to more interesting discussions.
 

azdave35

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Dec 19, 2008
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"Two of those 37 desert mysteries have been solved. The Lost Padre Mine, in the Estrella Mountains, and the Lost Burro Placers, in the Eagle Tail Mountains have been rediscovered by the Howland’s and sold for money to carry on their quest for the Lost Dutchman, the most famous, most sought, and probably the richest of all Arizona's mislaid bonanzas"

matthew....the lost padre mine in the estrella mountains was almost for certain the old mine milton rose was working in the 30's....howland had a claim on it in 1918....he must have claimed it not long after he arrived in arizona
 

OP
OP
Matthew Roberts

Matthew Roberts

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On July 13, 1931, Tex Barkley and Jeff Adams entered the Superstition Mountains on a renewed search for Adolph Ruth. This time however, the search took an abrupt turn and they headed straight into the far northern part of the mountains.

The previous day, (July 12) Barkley and Adams received a rough drawn map with directions from Cal Morse and Erwin Ruth. Erwin had just received this map/directions from Ray Howland who had shown up unexpectedly at Cal Morse ranch where Ruth was staying.

On the 12th Erwin Ruth was supposed to have a meeting at the Morse ranch with Charles Knickerbocker in which Knickerbocker was to give some extremely important information about where to look for Erwin’s father.

But sometime in the early morning of the 12th before he could meet with Erwin Ruth, Charles Knickerbocker was killed.

Then, astonishingly, Ray Howland shows up out of the blue at Cal Morse ranch later on the 12th with a map/directions and wants to talk with Erwin Ruth about the exact same subject Ruth and Knickerbocker had been scheduled to discuss.

Morse and Erwin Ruth had yet to learn that Knickerbocker was dead. Cal Morse, who was both friend and partner with Charles Knickerbocker recognized the map/directions Howland had as belonging to Knickerbocker and couldn’t help but notice it had blood on it.

Ray Howland told Erwin Ruth a story that Adolph Ruth likely followed this map and that the map directions lead to the Salt River and beyond. Howland went on to say he saw Adolph Ruth alive on May 15 and he thought he was on his way to the Salt River. If that were true Howland would have been the last person to see Adolph Ruth alive.

Howland then offered to help Erwin Ruth in his search for the elder Ruth and in fact, the next day, July 13, Ray Howland began his own search for Adolph Ruth.

After Howland left the ranch Cal Morse immediately contacted Tex Barkley. It was at this time, on the 12th of July 1931 that Cal Morse came clean and leveled with Barkley and Adams about what Adolph Ruth was really doing in the mountains.

Morse told Barkley that he, Charles Knickerbocker and Adolph Ruth had been engaged in looking for a mine/cache/treasure in the mountains using information Ruth possessed coupled with a recent find Charles Knickerbocker had made in the mountains. Morse told Barkley that if he were to start looking for Adolph Ruth the first place to look would be somewhere on Peters Mesa.

Here are the directions that were on that map (one sentence is missing from the directions) :

The trail leads up the first long draw leading into the Superstition Mountains east from the west end on the south side.

……. (a sentence here is missing from the directions) …….

Then on across the mesa and down past a picacho on the left hand side and into a big canyon that leads to the Salt River.
Then up the first right hand canyon and out onto a flat to a big pit.
Do not mistake the canyon for the trail.

On July 13, 1931 Tex Barkley and Jeff Adams went into the Superstition Mountains armed with Howland’s map and the information from Cal Morse. They headed straight for Peters Mesa and took with them supplies for several days of searching. They also took with them ropes for lowering themselves down into a mine and sacks to put ore in.

Barkley and Adams returned from the mountains a few days later. That same day, as soon as they returned, Jeff Adams officially called off all searches for Adolph Ruth in the Superstition Mountains. Adams suspended all searches because he said the temperatures were too hot and there was a lack of water back in the mountains.

What did Adams and Barkley find ?

And why did Jeff Adams abruptly call off everyone from searching for Adolph Ruth ?

Matthew
 

starman 1

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Jun 3, 2010
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What did Adams and Barkley find ?


And why did Jeff Adams abruptly call off everyone from searching for Adolph Ruth ?


Hello Mr. Roberts:

Interesting questions.

Perhaps it is safe to say that whatever they found was what caused them to call off the search. Imagine the simple answer is they needed time, with the help of others to remove the discovery and arrange for its dispersal. Having said that is there evidence that either man came into great wealth after all of this?

Is this the discovery that Barkley came close to revealing to Walter? Was this what Walter was after, considering his LDM was on Peter`s Mesa and this discovery seems to be further north near the Salt River.

Perhaps the discovery was more problematic, a discovery that resulted in death and destroyed dreams but for a few involved in all of this. Who knows maybe what they discovered is still there. Buried and hidden away again. Would not that be a hoot?

Could it be a treasure of a different kind?


Starman
 

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oldpueblo

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Hello Starman,

Another interesting post. I definitely have more than a basket full of questions. I have a very curious mind.

If I'm understanding this correctly, You are telling us that there were two discoveries made around the time of Ruth's disappearance. Why was one removed and the other was not? What other details can you provide us with about those two discoveries? What other details can you provide us with concerning Ray Howland's involvement with this case?

Thanks in advance,

Old Pueblo
 

OP
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Matthew Roberts

Matthew Roberts

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Starman1 wrote:

......."Perhaps it is safe to say that whatever they found was what caused them to call off the search. Imagine the simple answer is they needed time, with the help of others to remove the discovery and arrange for its dispersal. Having said that is there evidence that either man came into great wealth after all of this?

Is this the discovery that Barkley came close to revealing to Walter? Was this what Walter was after, considering his LDM was on Peter`s Mesa and this discovery seems to be further north near the Salt River.

Perhaps the discovery was more problematic, a discovery that resulted in death and destroyed dreams but for a few involved in all of this. Who knows maybe what they discovered is still there. Buried and hidden away again. Would not that be a hoot?

Could it be a treasure of a different kind?.........


Starman1,

The abrupt change in where to search for Adolph Ruth came about in that meeting at the Morse ranch July 12, 1931. After that meeting everything shifted to the north end of Peters Mesa all the way to the Salt River and even beyond.
It became clear Ruth was looking for more than just the Lost Dutchman Mine.
In January of 1932 Jeff Adams gave Jim Bark detailed descriptions of finding Ruth, taking a map/directions found on him and following them.
On January 13, 1932 Jim Bark wrote a detailed letter to Sims Ely telling him what Adams and Mrs. Barkley had said about that map/directions.

Here is a portion of that Bark letter:

Jim Bark letter Hells Hip Pocket.JPG

The letter starts: "Mrs. Barkley told me the map they followed led them down into Hell's Hip Pocket.

Now the term "Hell's Hip Pocket" was an old pioneers way of describing any place that was rough and hard or impossible to navigate.

But there is a place known to many and appears on most maps as Hell's Hip Pocket and it is located just across the Salt River from Horse Mesa.

In the old days before the Apache Lake Dam was built there was a crossing of the Salt at the northwest end of Horse Mesa. This trail connected with trails over to the west at Cottonwood Canyon and Agua Escondido (Hidden Water) where Jacob Waltz often camped and allegedly killed his nephew there.

Just beyond the Horse Mesa crossing as you are heading west toward Cottonwood Canyon you cross a wash known as Blue Tank wash. Just up Blue Tank Wash to the North is what is known as Hell's Hip Pocket, it is marked on many maps and theUS Forest Service still shows it on their topo maps.

For anyone who has ever been in that part of the mountains, Hell's Hip Pocket is one of the worst places imaginable to navigate. It is a geological jumble of rock and canyon and faults with numerous caves and blind spots.

Is this the place Jim Bark meant, or was he using the term Hell's Hip Pocket to just try to describe a very bad place ? If Adolph Ruth was trying to make it across the Salt River and beyond on his own he would have never made it. But someone else working with him might have been able to. I don't know, it is a mystery that has always puzzled me.

Matthew
 

cactusjumper

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Dec 10, 2005
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Starman1 wrote:

......."Perhaps it is safe to say that whatever they found was what caused them to call off the search. Imagine the simple answer is they needed time, with the help of others to remove the discovery and arrange for its dispersal. Having said that is there evidence that either man came into great wealth after all of this?

Is this the discovery that Barkley came close to revealing to Walter? Was this what Walter was after, considering his LDM was on Peter`s Mesa and this discovery seems to be further north near the Salt River.

Perhaps the discovery was more problematic, a discovery that resulted in death and destroyed dreams but for a few involved in all of this. Who knows maybe what they discovered is still there. Buried and hidden away again. Would not that be a hoot?

Could it be a treasure of a different kind?.........


Starman1,

The abrupt change in where to search for Adolph Ruth came about in that meeting at the Morse ranch July 12, 1931. After that meeting everything shifted to the north end of Peters Mesa all the way to the Salt River and even beyond.
It became clear Ruth was looking for more than just the Lost Dutchman Mine.
In January of 1932 Jeff Adams gave Jim Bark detailed descriptions of finding Ruth, taking a map/directions found on him and following them.
On January 13, 1932 Jim Bark wrote a detailed letter to Sims Ely telling him what Adams and Mrs. Barkley had said about that map/directions.

Here is a portion of that Bark letter:

View attachment 1478485

The letter starts: "Mrs. Barkley told me the map they followed led them down into Hell's Hip Pocket.

Now the term "Hell's Hip Pocket" was an old pioneers way of describing any place that was rough and hard or impossible to navigate.

But there is a place known to many and appears on most maps as Hell's Hip Pocket and it is located just across the Salt River from Horse Mesa.

In the old days before the Apache Lake Dam was built there was a crossing of the Salt at the northwest end of Horse Mesa. This trail connected with trails over to the west at Cottonwood Canyon and Agua Escondido (Hidden Water) where Jacob Waltz often camped and allegedly killed his nephew there.

Just beyond the Horse Mesa crossing as you are heading west toward Cottonwood Canyon you cross a wash known as Blue Tank wash. Just up Blue Tank Wash to the North is what is known as Hell's Hip Pocket, it is marked on many maps and theUS Forest Service still shows it on their topo maps.

For anyone who has ever been in that part of the mountains, Hell's Hip Pocket is one of the worst places imaginable to navigate. It is a geological jumble of rock and canyon and faults with numerous caves and blind spots.

Is this the place Jim Bark meant, or was he using the term Hell's Hip Pocket to just try to describe a very bad place ? If Adolph Ruth was trying to make it across the Salt River and beyond on his own he would have never made it. But someone else working with him might have been able to. I don't know, it is a mystery that has always puzzled me.

Matthew

Matthew,

I would suggest that anyone who believes that Ruth made it from Willow Spring to the North side of the Salt, and into Hell's Hip Pocket, that they attempt to make that little hike, or even ride it.

It's a nice new story, but does not conform to Adolph Ruth's reality. Is it going into a, so far, unpublished book? Ruth only made it to just south of Boulder Basin, IMHO. Either Tex or Bill & Brownie moved Ruth's bones to where they were found. Not much else makes much sense to me.

As you have mentioned before, It's all speculation and all such things are subject to interpretation and imagination. Matthew, yours is as good or better than many others. Nice post!

Take care,

Joe
 

releventchair

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Ruth was mobile. Slow perhaps but mobile.
Why no animal to lead until a ride was desired, and or to ride on and off? Were animals expected with some one else's arrival?
Suggests a confidence in his mobility and condition to go solo into known conditions ,as far as he planned anyway.
Meeting some one in the near future when a project among associates was being honed does have some logic. Stymied when that associate dies though. And / or another turns on you.
 

somehiker

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Did he die with his boots on ?
If I am not mistaken...poor memory perhaps ?....he was wearing street shoes or something similar when he last left his camp.
That his boots were found there, rather than with his remains.
btw: Horse Mesa Dam was completed in 1927....Mormon Flat Dam in 1925. So any crossing would likely have involved a boat, or crossing over either dam where attendants might have seen him or his party. Imagine he might have wanted to see Hidden Water for himself, but more likely after his search for the mine itself had yielded results.....or hit a wall.
 

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Matthew Roberts

Matthew Roberts

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Did he die with his boots on ?
If I am not mistaken...poor memory perhaps ?....he was wearing street shoes or something similar when he last left his camp.
That his boots were found there, rather than with his remains.
btw: Horse Mesa Dam was completed in 1927....Mormon Flat Dam in 1925.


somehiker,

We aren't sure what Ruth wore on his feet when he died. Both hands and both feet were missing including his shoes/boots.
I've heard the story that Ruth's hiking boots were found in his Willow Spring camp and that may be true but I have never seen anything that verifies that one way or the other.

The Horse Mesa Dam was put in use in 1927 as you mentioned. The old Horse Mesa crossing was just below the Dam a little ways. Once the Dam was finished the river downstream from the Dam was substantially altered.
Where you could once ford the river at that spot, it was too deep to cross after the Dam and spillway went into use. It's not far across the Salt River at that point but in 1931 if someone wanted to cross there they would have needed a boat or a raft.

Matthew
 

cactusjumper

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somehiker,

We aren't sure what Ruth wore on his feet when he died. Both hands and both feet were missing including his shoes/boots.
I've heard the story that Ruth's hiking boots were found in his Willow Spring camp and that may be true but I have never seen anything that verifies that one way or the other.

The Horse Mesa Dam was put in use in 1927 as you mentioned. The old Horse Mesa crossing was just below the Dam a little ways. Once the Dam was finished the river downstream from the Dam was substantially altered.
Where you could once ford the river at that spot, it was too deep to cross after the Dam and spillway went into use. It's not far across the Salt River at that point but in 1931 if someone wanted to cross there they would have needed a boat or a raft.

Matthew

Matthew,

I only searched one of my Bark Notes, but found this on page 164, "They said his prospecting boots were at his camp.....".

From Helen Corbin's "Bible", we get this from page 314, and attributed to the Bark Notes: "A few silver dollars, his fountain pen, canteen comb and various personal belongings were found on the remains, but no maps of the mine, and both shoes were missing. Just before this statement we read this: ".......This caused the leg to be several inches shorter than his left, making it quite difficult for him to get around in the mountains or to walk in rough country."

All of this seems to suggest that Ruth was not wearing his "hiking boots" when he left Willow Spring. It also suggests that Ruth would have a very difficult time walking any distance in the Superstitions. Add to this, the extreme heat and his advanced age, it hints that he didn't walk far from his camp.

[1931 July 11, Phoenix Gazette, Page 1 - Column 7 and 8] From Garry Cundiff's site.
1931 July 11, Phoenix Gazette, Page 1 - Column 7 and 8

"Those notations, together with the fact that Mr. Ruth’s heavy boots, spectacles and most of his food were discovered at the camp when searchers found it, caused them to believe he could not have traveled far."

Seems clear to me, that he didn't walk far from Willow Spring.

Take care,

Joe
 

somehiker

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What did Adams and Barkley find ?

A pot of lead perhaps ?
How bout an overdue book from the Library of OZ ?
Am I getting warm ?



And why did Jeff Adams abruptly call off everyone from searching for Adolph Ruth ?

Maybe because he felt responsible for the safety of those involved in the search. It was pretty darn hot after all.


Hello Mr. Roberts:

Interesting questions.

Perhaps it is safe to say that whatever they found was what caused them to call off the search. Imagine the simple answer is they needed time, with the help of others to remove the discovery and arrange for its dispersal. Having said that is there evidence that either man came into great wealth after all of this?

Is this the discovery that Barkley came close to revealing to Walter? Was this what Walter was after, considering his LDM was on Peter`s Mesa and this discovery seems to be further north near the Salt River.

Perhaps the discovery was more problematic, a discovery that resulted in death and destroyed dreams but for a few involved in all of this. Who knows maybe what they discovered is still there. Buried and hidden away again. Would not that be a hoot?

Not if it's a meth lab.
Which, now that I've mentioned it....makes sense.

Could it be a treasure of a different kind?

Given your propensity for incorporating pretty much everything and everyone, I would have to answer "any" kind will probably do.


Starman

Hope this answers your questions....always glad to help
 

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starman 1

Full Member
Jun 3, 2010
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305
Hello Somehiker,

I would hope your answers to Mr. Roberts questions would reflect more depth. Guess your answers could be correct. Let`s see a pot of lead, A library book, and hot weather. Imagine that would explain the murders and other things that occurred.

And to my point you responded a meth lab and the inclusion of the Ruth story in a bigger history of the range. Even you would have to admit Mr. Roberts has repeatedly made the point that the Ruth business was far bigger than the LDM.

Never less it is good to see you are thinking and who knows maybe you are right its all about a meth lab.:laughing7:

Have a good day

Starman
 

starman 1

Full Member
Jun 3, 2010
157
305
Hello Somehiker,

One final point. Why spend time trying to destroy Mr. Roberts thread? He has been kind enough to share a lot of information and invited folks in to participate in a fascinating dialogue.

The dialogue is far to important to be shut down because of silliness.

Add what positive information you can or ask intelligent questions. You will be better for it.

Starman
 

somehiker

Silver Member
May 1, 2007
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Chill out Starman. After all, what's a verbal wedgie between friendly opponents ?
If Mr. Roberts finds it offensive however, I will be happy to delete the post.

In the meantime, perhaps you can contribute a little more meat to your rather vague assertions of this "bigger history" you speak of.
You know...stuff like historical documents, photos, maps. Names and dates....perhaps a time frame.
Those things tend to make a "story" easier to follow and believe in.
 

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releventchair

Gold Member
May 9, 2012
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Matthew,

I only searched one of my Bark Notes, but found this on page 164, "They said his prospecting boots were at his camp.....".

From Helen Corbin's "Bible", we get this from page 314, and attributed to the Bark Notes: "A few silver dollars, his fountain pen, canteen comb and various personal belongings were found on the remains, but no maps of the mine, and both shoes were missing. Just before this statement we read this: ".......This caused the leg to be several inches shorter than his left, making it quite difficult for him to get around in the mountains or to walk in rough country."

All of this seems to suggest that Ruth was not wearing his "hiking boots" when he left Willow Spring. It also suggests that Ruth would have a very difficult time walking any distance in the Superstitions. Add to this, the extreme heat and his advanced age, it hints that he didn't walk far from his camp.

[1931 July 11, Phoenix Gazette, Page 1 - Column 7 and 8] From Garry Cundiff's site.
1931 July 11, Phoenix Gazette, Page 1 - Column 7 and 8

"Those notations, together with the fact that Mr. Ruth’s heavy boots, spectacles and most of his food were discovered at the camp when searchers found it, caused them to believe he could not have traveled far."

Seems clear to me, that he didn't walk far from Willow Spring.

Take care,

Joe
I have looked ( not exhaustively) for details of Ruth's surgery.
Beyond a plate near hip ,( suggesting a fractured femur originally after rock diving) little else has turned up.

We have seen extentions/ lifts to counter a short leg.
He had a knee , No knee equals 200% more effort and a high amp where his plate was .
Or a failed locked hip means having to" throw" pelvis each stride ; I know from having to do so with a prosthetic. That requires a cane. Did Ruth use a cane for stability alone in offside hand ,or more for weight bearing ,or was it required to swing his plated leg forward?

My guess is it was for stability alone. Thus the impression he was mobile enough for sensible travel despite sand and gravel. No ,not Hades or high water or boulder leaping . Having been bit enough to cause original fracture the odds of trying a rough terrain again ........Except for enough gold or at gunpoint...

His tracks/ trail was described as obvious due to cane imprints....But no mention of a drag mark each pace.
Without properly modified height of his short leg the cane prints would not stand out near as much as a dragged leg for much of his stride.( Which one ,or both?).
With proper lift ,a drag still seems likely but shorter. Skill .,strength and practice would reduce it ,but the no nerve sensation would throw in an involuntary " clomp" now and then even with a cane.

Ruth's son sure would have known. As anyone watching him much would. How nimble for how long.
He did not bring or use crutches....So did not need them.
 

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i am the horse

Jr. Member
Apr 17, 2014
99
109
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
What did Adams and Barkley find ?


And why did Jeff Adams abruptly call off everyone from searching for Adolph Ruth ?


Hello Mr. Roberts:

Interesting questions.

Perhaps it is safe to say that whatever they found was what caused them to call off the search. Imagine the simple answer is they needed time, with the help of others to remove the discovery and arrange for its dispersal. Having said that is there evidence that either man came into great wealth after all of this?

Is this the discovery that Barkley came close to revealing to Walter? Was this what Walter was after, considering his LDM was on Peter`s Mesa and this discovery seems to be further north near the Salt River.

Perhaps the discovery was more problematic, a discovery that resulted in death and destroyed dreams but for a few involved in all of this. Who knows maybe what they discovered is still there. Buried and hidden away again. Would not that be a hoot?

Could it be a treasure of a different kind?


Starman


You know its a different ----- --- -------- just as do i. I just stay in this forum because everyone is so friendly. So why do you look in on this forum?
 

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cactusjumper

Gold Member
Dec 10, 2005
7,754
5,389
Arizona
I have looked ( not exhaustively) for details of Ruth's surgery.
Beyond a plate near hip ,( suggesting a fractured femur originally after rock diving) little else has turned up.

We have seen extentions/ lifts to counter a short leg.
He had a knee , No knee equals 200% more effort and a high amp where his plate was .
Or a failed locked hip means having to" throw" pelvis each stride ; I know from having to do so with a prosthetic. That requires a cane. Did Ruth use a cane for stability alone in offside hand ,or more for weight bearing ,or was it required to swing his plated leg forward?

My guess is it was for stability alone. Thus the impression he was mobile enough for sensible travel despite sand and gravel. No ,not Hades or high water or boulder leaping . Having been bit enough to cause original fracture the odds of trying a rough terrain again ........Except for enough gold or at gunpoint...

His tracks/ trail was described as obvious due to cane imprints....But no mention of a drag mark each pace.
Without properly modified height of his short leg the cane prints would not stand out near as much as a dragged leg for much of his stride.( Which one ,or both?).
With proper lift ,a drag still seems likely but shorter. Skill .,strength and practice would reduce it ,but the no nerve sensation would throw in an involuntary " clomp" now and then even with a cane.

Ruth's son sure would have known. As anyone watching him much would. How nimble for how long.
He did not bring or use crutches....So did not need them.

Mr. R. Chair,

It would have been a pretty good effort just for Ruth to make it up to Boulder Basin or just south of there. A slow pace in that heat just cooks you longer at a shorter distance. West Boulder would be very difficult for someone who required a cane, just to walk, let alone considering the heat and Ruth's age. Once Ruth left Willow Spring there was no water available, that he would have come on. He was sucking on that small thermos of water that he carried with him.

Have you been in the Superstitions?:dontknow: Something else is at play here.

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo
 

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