Seeking info on this double-edged metal weapon

[AZEllen]

Thank you for allowing me to join; I'm looking forward to enjoying this forum!

My husband and I unearthed this whatever-it-is about 25+ years ago while out in the Arizona desert using our metal detectors. It was found at the base of a tree, just below the surface of the soil. It's been tucked away since then, but a friend saw it yesterday and said we should REALLY try to find out what it is and possibly its age.

I've done the best I could with the photos, but realize they're not great. I'm not even positive about the letters, but as nearly as I can tell, it reads "Mayagendon" or something very close to that.

Any help will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance!

 

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[Retired Sarge]

Pike, polearm, spear, or lance point (Terms are interchangeable in some texts).....? Found in Arizona it COULD POSSIBLY be of Spanish origins if original. Not saying it is or isn't that's beyond my knowledge.

 

[BennyV]

What does the letters spell out?

 

[Retired Sarge]

What does the letters spell out?

According to her post possibly Mayagendon.....

 

[Kenosha Kid]

What does the letters spell out?

closest i get is “mayagendam”, an Ojibwe word but they lived north central USA & Canada.

https://ojibwe.lib.umn.edu/main-entry/mayagendam-vai2

 

[Retired Sarge]

closest i get is “mayagendam”, an Ojibwe word but they lived north central USA & Canada.

https://ojibwe.lib.umn.edu/main-entry/mayagendam-vai2

The same thing I was finding.....

 

[Red-Coat]

It looks like a spear point, and I think you'll find it says "Maragondon", which is in the Philippines.

 

[AZEllen]

Well, THAT is certainly interesting! Thank you!

 

[AZEllen]

It looks like a spear point, and I think you'll find it says "Maragondon", which is in the Philippines.

Very interesting. I've read about Maragondon, but wonder, if it is of Philippine origin, how the heck would it have ended up in the central Arizona desert? Ideas? Thanks!

 

[Red-Coat]

Very interesting. I've read about Maragondon, but wonder, if it is of Philippine origin, how the heck would it have ended up in the central Arizona desert? Ideas? Thanks!

No idea, but the word is in English (or perhaps Spanish). I would suspect it's not terribly old and was a souvenir brought back from that region by a US serviceman after WWII. That is of course just a guess.

 

[desertexplorer]

Mayagondon is Spanish but not sure what it means.
What are the other words on the shaft? First letter looks like a P or D but image isn’t good enough to make out the rest.

 

[AZEllen]

Mayagondon is Spanish but not sure what it means.
What are the other words on the shaft? First letter looks like a P or D but image isn’t good enough to make out the rest.

It's very difficult to try to read. The only part that's clear reads "Juan Riel." It's in script. There's more, but I simply can't make it out. . .

 

[Dougie Webb]

It looks like a spear point, and I think you'll find it says "Maragondon", which is in the Philippines.

I second. My family lived in the Phillipines from around 1920-1970 and we have a number of antiquities from there, and this certainly has that look and feel.

 

[unclemac]

there is a close and centuries old connection between the Philippines and Spanish America, Mexico in particular. A Philippine/Mexico provenance makes sense if this is indeed a period specific pike or lance point. If it is, the value seems it could be around 400/500 $. There are absolutely folk that deal in this sort of thing and can help out.

 

[Kenosha Kid]

It's very difficult to try to read. The only part that's clear reads "Juan Riel." It's in script. There's more, but I simply can't make it out. . .

There was a Juan Riel who was Governadorcillo of Maragondon 1869-1870. Plenty of that family name prior and after as Governor or Municipal President. Maragondon lists those holding similar titles back to 1727.

 

[Plug N Play]

I apologize. This info is so hard to put together ... sources need extensive translation ... and as the story unfolds, it twists and turns and goes up and down, and its all in foreign languages and I'm making excuses like crazy because I can't type enough s to clarify that these are only a few tidbits that may fit together or may entirely not. Oh, and I'm totally making up the conclusion based on nothing.
----------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------- ---------------------- ------------------------------------------
Now that that's clear:

José Honorato Lozano (1821-1885) was a Filipino painter during the time in question. (Juan Riel 1869-1870)

He painted a picture of a "CUADRILLERO".

What's a cuadrillero ?

1. m out of a gang.
2. m. individual in a gang of the Santa Hermandad.

What is Santa Hermandad?

("holy brotherhood") a type of military peacekeeping association of armed individuals, which became characteristic of municipal life in medieval Spain.

Anyway: The Santa Hermandad was like a police force. Designed to protect the rulers and do their "dirty work". Collect taxes, run the courts, civil disputes, oversee the rulers interests, etc. They had lots of power and were backed by the rulers. Sometimes they were loyal ... sometimes they were mercenary (gang) ... sometimes they were loyal to the people and turned against bad rulers. (many became thought of as gangs ... but it went all ways, always changing)

Going by the picture, a cuadrillero of the time, in the Philippines, might carry a pike. The rulers would only serve two years. Juan Riel 1869 and 1870. Perhaps the pike would carry the name of the current ruler and the city as a designation of sorts, to clarify the two years of authority the cuadrilleros would serve ? In 1871 and 1872 it would be someone else running things, with a "changing of the guard" ? And he would pass out new pikes to his guys ? I don't know ! So, what do you do with your old, useless pike? Take it to Arizona with you just in case there might be things there that need poking ?

 

[ANTIQUARIAN]

And he would pass out new pikes to his guys ? I don't know ! So, what do you do with your old, useless pike? Take it to Arizona with you just in case there might be things there that need poking ?

Great post Ellen, welcome to Tnet from Toronto.
I just love these types of mysteries of how do things get to be where they're found. I also loved the line above by Plug N Play, it made me laugh at 6am in the morning... "just in case there might be things there that need poking".

My first thought was, hold old was the tree that you found this spear point under?
I realize it was 25 years ago Ellen, but trees living in the desert must be hearty to survive, so that tree may very well have been hundreds of years old.

I think you might want to consider sending pics of your find to a museum for identification. The first museum that comes to mind is the ROM here in Toronto, but you might have a museum in the US that you prefer. But I do know that the ROM has a huge collection of antique arms and amour. I think if you were able to reach Justin Jennings, that would be a great place to start.
Dave

Royal Ontario Museum
100 Queen’s Park, Toronto, ON
M5S 2C6
Email: info@rom.on.ca
Telephone: 416.586.8000
Phone (10:00 am — 4:00 pm EST Tuesday to Sunday)

Justin Jennings - Curator (New World Archaeology)
Bio:
B.A., Archaeology & Anthropology, Tufts University, Boston, 1995
M.A., Anthropology, University of California, Santa Barbara, 1997
Ph.D., University of California, Santa Barbara, 2002
https://www.rom.on.ca/en/collections-research/rom-staff/justin-jennings

 

[AZEllen]

There was a Juan Riel who was Governadorcillo of Maragondon 1869-1870. Plenty of that family name prior and after as Governor or Municipal President. Maragondon lists those holding similar titles back to 1727.

That is absolutely fascinating information! In my searches online, I've not come across that, but will use your info as a new starting point. THANK YOU!

 

[AZEllen]

You just made my day, Antiquarian! Thank you so much!

 

[AZEllen]

Thank you so much for your insight! There are some truly amazing, knowledgeable people on this site, and I'm so happy to have joined!