✅ SOLVED Solved: British-made Enfield model-1853 rifles buttplate

[cdsieg]

Solved: British-made Enfield model-1853 rifle's buttplate

If it is a grenade cap, any ideas on the age of the item? Also any thought on the other items. Thanks!

 

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[BuckleBoy]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Your last item is a GREAT find! It is a brass butt plate from a musket. Most likely this musket saw some military use if it shows a cabinet number or something similar. I am not certain of the style, but I am guessing it was flintlock originally, 1700s or early 1800s time frame.

 

[cdsieg]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Your last item is a GREAT find! It is a brass butt plate from a musket. Most likely this musket saw some military use if it shows a cabinet number or something similar. I am not certain of the style, but I am guessing it was flintlock originally, 1700s or early 1800s time frame.

awesome! Is it suppose to be bent like that? I will google flintlock and see what kind of photos come up. thanks for the feedback!

 

[GpSnoopy]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Your grenade cap looks like the bearing cap from a driveshaft u-joint. Yours may not have the groove as some caps just had a rubber dust boot.

 

[BuckleBoy]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Your last item is a GREAT find! It is a brass butt plate from a musket. Most likely this musket saw some military use if it shows a cabinet number or something similar. I am not certain of the style, but I am guessing it was flintlock originally, 1700s or early 1800s time frame.

awesome! Is it suppose to be bent like that? I will google flintlock and see what kind of photos come up. thanks for the feedback!

No it is not supposed to be bent like that. Probably happened due to plowing a field, etc. It is not a piece I would try to straighten myself though. Are there any other markings or designs on it? It could be that it is later than flintlock, but usually a serial number is stamped in rather than hand engraved. My hunch is still that it is from a really old gun.

-Buckles

 

[doublet2a]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Your grenade cap looks like the bearing cap from a driveshaft u-joint. Yours may not have the groove as some caps just had a rubber dust boot.

 

[BosnMate]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Definitely a butt plate of either a shot gun which could be from the cap lock era, or a musket as far back as the flint lock era. Cap locks were invented in the 1830's, and lasted until cartridge firearms around the 1870's. Of course there was a lot of overlap in both directions, flintlocks were converted to cap locks and people used muzzle loaders well into the cartridge era, still do as far as that goes. Flintlocks date from most all of the 1700's, and before that there were wheel locks and match locks. Your butt plate is cast brass, and will probably break if you try to straighten it out. It looks to me to be too wide for a rifle butt plate, muskets tended to have a heavier stock than that of the Kentucky long rifle.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Thats a really cool musket buttplate. Could you please clean it up and post some more pics of the cool engraving? Use only water and soft toothbrush.

Here are a few links on engraved buttplates. http://www.collegehillarsenal.com/shop/product.php?productid=287

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

I think I see an A on the bottom. Could this be Confederate? 6330-A

View attachment 602195

..."we do know that these guns were the most inventory controlled pieces, as all but the very last purchases so marked were engraved with a number in their brass buttplate, or stamped with one in the wood behind the trigger guard in the case of iron mounted rifles. The numbering system on the buttplates apparently started with 0001 and proceeded to 9999, at which point a letter suffix was added so the numbers could be used again. Thus the second ground of 10,000 muskets were numbered #### / A, the next 10,000 as #### / B, etc. This numbering system allows us to make some educated guesses about when a particular gun may have left England bound for the Confederate coast. Unfortunately, due to the fact that most of the guns were delivered to trans-shipment ports like Bermuda, prior to being loaded on a blockade runner for final delivery to the Confederacy, it is hard to know how long a particular gun may have sat on a dock or in a warehouse, prior to delivery."

 

[TheCannonballGuy]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Your guess is correct, the brass buttplate is definitely from a British-made .577-caliber Enfield Model-1853 rifle, imported by the Confederacy through the yankee naval blockade. (However, the yankees also imported many thousands of them.) Here's a photo of one marked similarly to yours, from my photo-folder of civil war era gunparts.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Is this a banner find?

 

[cdsieg]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Is this a banner find?

What does that mean?

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Is this a banner find?

What does that mean?

The banner of all the best finds are at the top of the page.

It may not be a banner find but I think its cool. I dont know if anyone else at TN ever found one engraved with these numbers.. It appears to be the Confederate number system but I am not knowlegable enough to say but I think we IDed it for you.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Your guess is correct, the brass buttplate is definitely from a British-made .577-caliber Enfield Model-1853 rifle, imported by the Confederacy through the yankee naval blockade. (However, the yankees also imported many thousands of them.) Here's a photo of one marked similarly to yours, from my photo-folder of civil war era gunparts.

Did the Yankees use the same number system with the A underneath?

 

[BosnMate]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Your guess is correct, the brass buttplate is definitely from a British-made .577-caliber Enfield Model-1853 rifle, imported by the Confederacy through the yankee naval blockade. (However, the yankees also imported many thousands of them.) Here's a photo of one marked similarly to yours, from my photo-folder of civil war era gunparts.

Note that on the right hand of the numbers on your example of the .577-caliber Enfield Model-1853 rifle butt plate, there is a screw right in the bend of the tang, and I can't see this screw hole in the found butt plate. Unless that screw hole is there, I question if it is in fact an off of an Enfield.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Your guess is correct, the brass buttplate is definitely from a British-made .577-caliber Enfield Model-1853 rifle, imported by the Confederacy through the yankee naval blockade. (However, the yankees also imported many thousands of them.) Here's a photo of one marked similarly to yours, from my photo-folder of civil war era gunparts.

Note that on the right hand of the numbers on your example of the .577-caliber Enfield Model-1853 rifle butt plate, there is a screw right in the bend of the tang, and I can't see this screw hole in the found butt plate. Unless that screw hole is there, I question if it is in fact an off of an Enfield.

I noticed that.

Cdseig, after you clean the mud off, how many holes are in your buttplate?

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Cdseig, after we have positively identified it, post this cool find in Todays Finds with a story of how and where you found it.

 

[coinmaster2db]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Yep. 1853 Enfield. Very cool find!

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,388921.msg2766319.html#msg2766319

HH!
Cm2db

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

I searched TN and found several others but this may be the first with the Confederate serial numbers engraved.
Cindy, you should be thrilled.
http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,270520.0.html

 

[BuckleBoy]

Re: Grenade Cap? Bent thing with holes and numbers

Great ID work, Cannonball Guy!!!

I wouldn't clean this with much more than a dry toothbrush, in order to keep the engraved number clear and crisp. If you use water, you risk losing the detail of the engraved number and letter.

Toothpick method is also a possibility.

Cheers,

Buckles