Stepped in bear poop yesterday at my prospecting area, advice?

[firebird]

I went back yesterday to the gravel area that I had posted about in another thread. Immediately I noticed a nasty smell and just right around the paydirt area was the unmistakable sight of black bear poop. Oh crap, now I finally understand why I was finding gold here and why it hadn't been taken by anyone else before. Have you ever had any experiences with dangerous animals while prospecting?

 

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[Lanny in AB]

I'll jump in here to just say that people are much more of a problem than any bear problem I've ever had and to get back to the original post and echo what others have said, find out what you need to do to dissuade bears from hanging out in your area; as well, keep your head on a swivel and try not to be out there alone.

Furthermore, I hope you find some good gold while you're at it.

All the best,

Lanny

 

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[spillercanyon]

I'll jump in here to just say that people are much more of a problem than any bear problem I've ever had and to get back to the original post and echo what others have said, find out what you need to do to dissuade bears from hanging out in your area; as well, keep your head on a swivel and try not to be out there alone.

Furthermore, I hope you find some good gold while you're at it.

All the best,

Lanny

Head on a swivel, I love that! I stand up every 15 minutes or so and do a 360 looking for anything moving or out of place. The whole idea that there is something to be aware of, two or four legged as well as environmental, actually makes the experience better. I was an adrenaline junky when I was young and though I don't like it in high doses like I used to, I still have a taste for it. I like the fact that I'm not in a secure environment with known surroundings, I like the fact that I need to keep my wits about me or the day could go to hell, I like it, it makes me feel alive. I probably would not prospect if it were not for the fact that everything could go wrong, has a good chance of doing so and I personally have 98% control over whether that happens or not. I love to find gold but if there was no risk, there would be no personal reward, that spiritual feeling when you reach the vehicle and home and feel you have lived to prospect another day.

 

[IMAUDIGGER]

Here's a really neat article on bear attack handgun efficiency via real life results. https://www.ammoland.com/2018/02/defense-against-bears-with-pistols-97-success-rate-37-incidents-by-caliber/#axzz5YN2sD92V

The stories were interesting.

What I took away is that if you are going to carry a handgun, you might leave your pistol at home and instead bring a high power revolver.

I think the author of that article would have a difficult time grasping that concept, which is odd considering his background.

It would have been more useful to analyze the data and look at bullet weights, energy, and number of center mass hits that were necessary to drop the bear.

 

[IMAUDIGGER]

45 ACP
Roy was up on the edge of his property tending his fence line, when out of the brush she was a coming straight at him with her ears back. Roy drew and put 3 rounds of 230-gr FMJ in her neck shoulder area, then took off away from the trail about 5 yards. Roy said the bear was still coming at him, and he fired 3 more rounds into her frontal area. And again took off another 5 yards off in another direction. The sow continued to follow coming at him, so Roy fired 3 more rounds into her frontal area and she dropped taking a dirt nap.

That’s very borderline failure. Scary stuff.

 

[brianc053]

I thought I'd share an East Coast perspective. Here in New Jersey we live with frequent visits from black bears. Apparently our bear density is pretty high (I'm told we have the most black bears per square mile).
In my town we see them a few times per year, but I've only read of them attacking and killing miniature horses (3 of them a few years ago). Never heard of a run-in with humans, though they've scared a few families. Check out this story about a bear swimming in a NJ pool (this wasn't too far from me):

https://abc7ny.com/news/bear-goes-for-a-dip-in-nj-familys-backyard-swimming-pool/1392805/

Here's video from my own back yard:


And a picture of the latest one crossing through the cul de sac earlier this year:


I really don't have a point to my post, other than to share a different perspective. Out here in the East I think the bears are less of a concern because they're more acclimated to living around humans.

- Brian

 

[Goldwasher]

No need to watch these I posted, just go to YouTube and search “bear attack”. Lots of exciting videos showing angry bears.

Watched one (that resulted in a dog and two men being killed by a sow).
The barking dog;
1.) Alerted the Sow that her cubs were being attacked.
2.) Led her quickly to the confrontation area.
3.) Heightened the perceived threat level.
4.) Led the charging sow directly to the men when the dog retreated.

I watched others where the dog served to chase off the bear once it decided it was not going to fight.

Most of the time bears are no problem. Watching angry bear videos does serve to strip any sense of security you might have carrying a gun, especially a small sidearm (regardless of the fancy ammo).
These creatures can be crazy fast. Watched one vid where a guy is trying to outrun a large brown bear on flat ground while riding a mountain bike. That bear had very little problem keeping up.
Statistics show many fatalities when a sidearm was present, but was never even unholstered.
No getting around the fact that on very rare occasions, it can be dangerous for humans.

That's not what statistics show at all? The vast majority of people attacked or killed by bears are unarmed https://www.wideopenspaces.com/list-fatal-black-bear-attacks-north-america-last-20-years/

Bear Attacks | Wise About Bears

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/05/110511074807.htm

Notice the majority are killed after. By being shot.

When confronted with an aggressive engaged animal. Your only choice to to be the more aggressive animal.​

https://www.ammoland.com/2018/02/de...s-rate-37-incidents-by-caliber/#axzz5YRnPwbpd

You can not run. You need every chance you can get.

The fact is more people are saved by firearms in bear country than are ever killed because they tried to use a gun.

Meanwhile in Russia ​

The unholstered dead guy is an extreme rarity. The unarmed and ambushed are the reality. Ammo and weapon can be a deciding factor period. say what you want.

This video does make a compelling argument for stock hardball. Though he doesn't test ammo similar to what I carry. ​

This isn't Africa so, I pick the closest thing to FMJ with expansion I can. Put through a weapon that I can put all rounds on a paper plate out to 20 yards. Firing respectfully rapidly. With a chance to reload quickly if needed.

I practice with hardball. Carry mags loaded with the rounds I may need for any threat. I happy medium if you will.

If I was carrying a revolver. I would probably choose hard cast bullets. But, that would be because I was having to choose shot placement a little more carefully knowing I only have six (normally five) rounds available. Because the reload may never happen.

With my 1911 I can drop mags and reload in the dark. Hell I can even do it one handed. I am also ambidextrous with firearms from years of practice

They train the hippy hikers to use bear spray and fight back with a stick but.. if you use a gun your crazy ?? OK.

If I'm laying there getting an armed gnawed on and I can pump seven rounds into a rib cage or belly I have a better chance of survival than just being gnawed on or punching.

There are ample first hand survivor reports of what its like to be mauled by a bear while defenseless. It always amazes me how the people are fully conscious can run through what they were thinking the whole time etc.

If you get hit by a sow outta nowhere defending her cubs yep, you could get the worst of it.

Every bear I've run into was scared off by yelling. and throwing stuff. Other than the one at my house.

If you don't have a chance you don't have a chance.

I just want the best one I can. The fact that others didn't, doesn't make it an across the board thing.

The fact is based on statistics that a sidearm is an effective bear deterrent and defense tool.

Most bears shot in defense are brown bears and there is ample evidence that people win. Black Bears are not as big and tend not to charge like browns.

If you can keep your cool. You will tend to prevail. It's well documented.

I'm more concerned over the Skunk lion. Because I won't see it coming.​

Overall it is a very rare occurrence. I don't carry a weapon for "wild animals " I carry mainly because of people and the ability to keep other threats at a distance. To give them a chance to question messing with me.

But since I'm in a spot several days a week that is also the home territory of a big sow.. her new cubs and at least one Cougar. I have prepared as best as I can.

 

[Goldwasher]

Here's a really neat article on bear attack handgun efficiency via real life results. https://www.ammoland.com/2018/02/de...s-rate-37-incidents-by-caliber/#axzz5YN2sD92V

Posted the same didn't see your post.

 

[Goldwasher]

I've had the fun of dealing with a pack of timbershepards out small game hunting. Grandpa had my back with the shotgun, as I did the dirty work with the Mini-14. Dropped six before the pack broke and ran. Then the owner came out and found out what his dogs were up to in the National Forest, went back home and shot the other 8.

With black bears, the closest I've come was, coming home on the moped to find 2 cubs on the front porch of the deer shack. I dumped the moped, and bolted inside, and as I closed the interior door, mom pounded the wood shed door behind me. Then mom and the cubs tore the big metal cooler apart that was on the porch, and scattered it all over the yard. So much for all the fish! In the Guard, I couldn't make out what the ordinance unit behind us was shouting about. Then I saw the black bear running down the path I was on. He stopped at 10', and then bolted away towards the refuelers. One of our OH-58's was just coming in and saw it and chased it out of our area. But standing there face to face with an empty M16 is not where you really want to be.

Where I grew up was relatively rural for a while. When I was young there were occasional packs of feral dogs.

Probably the scariest animals I can imagine.

They are smart get each other riled up and will actually kill each other in the moment.

They attacked our pigs one night. Killing our nursing sow and several piglets. My dad dropped a few with a 7mm mauser through the back window.

Basically cutting a few in half it was a sight after the fact.

Crazy mix of mutts and a big sheppard. I honestly would rather deal with a bear.

 

[rodoconnor]

I had a white trash neighbor move and he forgot to tells dogs. Starving, they came to my place one night and savaged several sheep. They can be very bad news. I killed them all.

 

[IMAUDIGGER]

That's not what statistics show at all? The vast majority of people attacked or killed by bears are unarmed https://www.wideopenspaces.com/list-fatal-black-bear-attacks-north-america-last-20-years/

Bear Attacks | Wise About Bears

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/05/110511074807.htm

Notice the majority are killed after. By being shot.

When confronted with an aggressive engaged animal. Your only choice to to be the more aggressive animal.​

https://www.ammoland.com/2018/02/de...s-rate-37-incidents-by-caliber/#axzz5YRnPwbpd

You can not run. You need every chance you can get.

The fact is more people are saved by firearms in bear country than are ever killed because they tried to use a gun.

Meanwhile in Russia ​

The unholstered dead guy is an extreme rarity. The unarmed and ambushed are the reality. Ammo and weapon can be a deciding factor period. say what you want.

This video does make a compelling argument for stock hardball. Though he doesn't test ammo similar to what I carry. ​

This isn't Africa so, I pick the closest thing to FMJ with expansion I can. Put through a weapon that I can put all rounds on a paper plate out to 20 yards. Firing respectfully rapidly. With a chance to reload quickly if needed.

I practice with hardball. Carry mags loaded with the rounds I may need for any threat. I happy medium if you will.

If I was carrying a revolver. I would probably choose hard cast bullets. But, that would be because I was having to choose shot placement a little more carefully knowing I only have six (normally five) rounds available. Because the reload may never happen.

With my 1911 I can drop mags and reload in the dark. Hell I can even do it one handed. I am also ambidextrous with firearms from years of practice

They train the hippy hikers to use bear spray and fight back with a stick but.. if you use a gun your crazy ?? OK.

If I'm laying there getting an armed gnawed on and I can pump seven rounds into a rib cage or belly I have a better chance of survival than just being gnawed on or punching.

There are ample first hand survivor reports of what its like to be mauled by a bear while defenseless. It always amazes me how the people are fully conscious can run through what they were thinking the whole time etc.

If you get hit by a sow outta nowhere defending her cubs yep, you could get the worst of it.

Every bear I've run into was scared off by yelling. and throwing stuff. Other than the one at my house.

If you don't have a chance you don't have a chance.

I just want the best one I can. The fact that others didn't, doesn't make it an across the board thing.

The fact is based on statistics that a sidearm is an effective bear deterrent and defense tool.

Most bears shot in defense are brown bears and there is ample evidence that people win. Black Bears are not as big and tend not to charge like browns.

If you can keep your cool. You will tend to prevail. It's well documented.

I'm more concerned over the Skunk lion. Because I won't see it coming.​

Overall it is a very rare occurrence. I don't carry a weapon for "wild animals " I carry mainly because of people and the ability to keep other threats at a distance. To give them a chance to question messing with me.

But since I'm in a spot several days a week that is also the home territory of a big sow.. her new cubs and at least one Cougar. I have prepared as best as I can.

I read that somewhere that many people killed had a firearm or bear spray, but that there was evidence it had not been deployed due to lack of advance notice.

I’m with you..guns are good.
It appears there are a large number of people killed while sleeping in a tent.
In that instance a dog would be very good protection so as to wake you up before you are mauled.

Here is an odd graphic generated from statistics..
.
Look at the number of deaths due to bears in capitivity?!

 

[A2coins]

If I ran into a grizzly he would be stepping in my poop also.

 

[delnorter]

Old Billy Bruin messes with me and I put the meat in the freezer and his hide on the wall. Ha ha


Maybe someone can rotate this photo for me.

Mike

 

[Clay Diggins]

Here you go Mike.



Billy is happy now.

Heavy Pans

 

[mikep691]

We have a few bears hanging out near our claim as well. Usually after that first beer, some rocks go in the can. When we hear sounds that have the dog's attention, we rattle that beer can. Seems to work as the bears on our claim are not domesticated like the Tahoe bears are.

 

[Goldwasher]

I read that somewhere that many people killed had a firearm or bear spray, but that there was evidence it had not been deployed due to lack of advance notice.

I’m with you..guns are good.
It appears there are a large number of people killed while sleeping in a tent.
In that instance a dog would be very good protection so as to wake you up before you are mauled.

Here is an odd graphic generated from statistics..
.View attachment 1656778
Look at the number of deaths due to bears in capitivity?!

Interesting on the captivity stat.

We were at Six Flags In November. went to watch the tiger show. Trainers in the pen throwing big chunks of steak to get them to jump, Milk bottle to show what a tiger looks like stretched to ten feet..

You couldn't pay me enough to get in a cage with a "trained " bear or tiger.


Yes, when you read discussions it sounds like people are killed while trying to defend.

But, research and stats tell a different story. man prevails the majority of the time and its the animal that is most likely to die.

Not much you can do if you get bear piled in your sleep.


Slight tangent but, related.

Has anyone heard of theses books or stories? Talk about heebee geebies. https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/05/110511074807.htm

Read a little deeper. before chalking these up to normal animal attacks. Some crazy stuff.

 

[tahomatom]

Well I ran across a lot of fresh bear poop out fishing in the fall but I always remembered an old story that went along with that...

The National Park Rangers are advising hikers in Glacier National Park and other Rocky Mountain parks to be alert for bears and take extra precautions to avoid an encounter.
They advise park visitors to wear little bells on their clothes so they make noise when hiking. The bell noise allows bears to hear them coming from a distance and not be startled by a hiker accidentally sneaking up on them. This might cause a bear to charge.
Visitors should also carry a pepper spray can just in case a bear is encountered. Spraying the pepper into the air will irritate the bear's sensitive nose and it will run away.
It is also a good idea to keep an eye out for fresh bear scat so you have an idea if bears are in the area. People should be able to recognize the difference between black bear and grizzly bear scat.
Black bear droppings are smaller and often contain berries, leaves, and possibly bits of fur. Grizzly bear droppings tend to contain small bells and smell of pepper.

 

[rodoconnor]

Ha ha, an oldie but a goody

 

[Capt Nemo]

Here's what I'm using in the AKM's in Alaska. A bear will have a real bad day if he messes with us, as we're going to keep shooting till the mags are empty.

 

[Duckshot]

Captain Nemo, I don't know about that Russian 7.62x39 as a bear cartridge. It looks pretty close to 30/30 Winchester in terms of velocity and energy, and the 30/30 is a medium range deer cartridge. Not really a bear cartridge, unless you are shooting black bears out of trees.

If it were me going to Alaska to fight bears I would take a pump 12 gauge loaded with foster slugs, just my opinion.

The guy in your video got one thing right, those 8M3 hollow tips are not designed to expand. I have sectioned one of these exact bullets. They are made with a copper washed steel jacket, not a copper jacket. The purpose of the hollow tip is to help them tumble after impact which creates more stretching at the expense of penetration. They made a dum-dum but it ain't against the Geneva Convention cause it has a hole in it. If I was going to use a 7.62.39mm to defend against bears, I'd go with FMJ instead.

 

[IMAUDIGGER]

Captain Nemo, I don't know about that Russian 7.62x39 as a bear cartridge. It looks pretty close to 30/30 Winchester in terms of velocity and energy, and the 30/30 is a medium range deer cartridge. Not really a bear cartridge, unless you are shooting black bears out of trees.

If it were me going to Alaska to fight bears I would take a pump 12 gauge loaded with foster slugs, just my opinion.

The guy in your video got one thing right, those 8M3 hollow tips are not designed to expand. I have sectioned one of these exact bullets. They are made with a copper washed steel jacket, not a copper jacket. The purpose of the hollow tip is to help them tumble after impact which creates more stretching at the expense of penetration. They made a dum-dum but it ain't against the Geneva Convention cause it has a hole in it. If I was going to use a 7.62.39mm to defend against bears, I'd go with FMJ instead.

Bout the same as a hot 44 mag. But semi auto.