The Unreasonable Story Narrative

[bigscoop]

Let’s take a moment to actually examine the proposition and narrative in the Beale Papers.

A man, a very trusted and capable man (Beale) is entrusted with the vital fortunes and futures of 30 other men and their families. In all of his wisdom he provides a narrative and three ciphers to another just in case things go badly (Morriss). And if things have gone badly then Morriss is to decode the ciphers using an unknown key that will arrive to him by some unknown means, none of this to take place until after ten years have passed.

OK, who in their right mind would give three ciphers to an individual who’s very service might prove the final fate of the entire enterprise, those “alleged” ciphers perhaps being too complex for this individual to decode, or perhaps the key might never arrive, or perhaps that individual (Morriss) could easily be dead in ten years time? Does this sound like the actions of a wise and capable man (Beale)? Absolutely not!
Also, thirty men, now very rich men, transport all of their new-found wealth clear across a continent and not a single one of them says, “Nope, not going back, I’ll take my share now and live out the rest of my life on easy street.” Nope, all thirty of them are hell-bent on leaving their new-found fortunes at an unsecure location (a well known cave was mentioned) so they could all go back across the continent and possibly die thus leaving their new-found fortunes to anyone who might happen upon it.

Folks, it is all just another completely unreasonable treasure tale. Not a single one of you would agree with any of the above terms, and yet some here still believe? This is the attraction of treasure tales, that promise of wealth and fame that defies all logic, common sense, and sense of reason.

 

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[releventchair]

Let’s take a moment to actually examine the proposition and narrative in the Beale Papers.

A man, a very trusted and capable man (Beale) is entrusted with the vital fortunes and futures of 30 other men and their families. In all of his wisdom he provides a narrative and three ciphers to another just in case things go badly (Morriss). And if things have gone badly then Morriss is to decode the ciphers using an unknown key that will arrive to him by some unknown means, none of this to take place until after ten years have passed.

OK, who in their right mind would give three ciphers to an individual who’s very service might prove the final fate of the entire enterprise, those “alleged” ciphers perhaps being too complex for this individual to decode, or perhaps the key might never arrive, or perhaps that individual (Morriss) could easily be dead in ten years time? Does this sound like the actions of a wise and capable man (Beale)? Absolutely not!
Also, thirty men, now very rich men, transport all of their new-found wealth clear across a continent and not a single one of them says, “Nope, not going back, I’ll take my share now and live out the rest of my life on easy street.” Nope, all thirty of them are hell-bent on leaving their new-found fortunes at an unsecure location (a well known cave was mentioned) so they could all go back across the continent and possibly die thus leaving their new-found fortunes to anyone who might happen upon it.

Folks, it is all just another completely unreasonable treasure tale. Not a single one of you would agree with any of the above terms, and yet some here still believe? This is the attraction of treasure tales, that promise of wealth and fame that defies all logic, common sense, and sense of reason.

You and I are detecting and find a large cache , or a natural source of wealth.
Let's say we share it in one proportion or another.
Guys were no dummies in the 18 hundreds.
"Riches" would be secured and secondary's established to insure kin or others had access in the event we dropped dead or were incarcerated a long time.
More so if we were leaving on another perilous adventure.

A group with a chosen leader or captain? It's still wealth. And still an individuals cut of it.
By the time I'd have gone on such an excursion and I'm sure among others I'd have had enough of the group for a while to not be throwing my lot in with theirs.
Or I'd be obligated to guard the wealth. Just to protect mine. That would be better being put to use , and somewhere else beyond the party. And those others that party members told about it...

 

[ECS]

What is NEVER mentioned in the story narrative is the condition of the gold and silver (ore or crudely field refined bars) and the journey from the west, how crossing the Mississippi was accomplished with all that weight, where the gold, silver, and jewels were hidden while constructing the rock lined vault during their stay at Bufords, and how long did it take to built this vault.

 

[metrotec]

I agree with "bigscoop" People who hit the Lottery, rarely go back to work, even though a lot of them are broke in a few years.

 

[bigscoop]

It's just that the entire narrative is unreasonable.

 

[GoDeep]

Humans are quite adept and suspending disbelief. We do it every time we watch a movie. Humans are attracted to legends and fairy tales as it stimulates our minds and imagination.

Logic and counter facts go right out the window once one falls in love, be it with a legend or a woman....

 

[jhonnz41]

This is a Good one.

I would like to as a question though.

In the Beale paper's it was never mentioned what are the means of transporting the Gold and Silver to Bedford(Wagons?ship?). Would it be possible that they transported it through the Sea?

I doubt this as a possibility. Since if I based it on the questionable "First Voyage key", it seems to me that they went to town of Bedford (or a route in between) where the people from Campbell County noticed them and knew about the gold and silver that they are transporting. They said that they are the people who have no opposition.

This is exactly in this paragraph.

I discovered(50) thirty(29) the first cities(216) other(321) people(603) Lord has given(14) fine plains and open country(612) the first island(81) the eastward(360) with the fleet(36) discovered(51) all I have taken possession(62) to the people(194) without opposition(78) and of all(60) at once I continued the said route(200) so they returned(314) no iron, nor, steel, nor weapons(676) I named the island(112) you will be rejoiced at (4) in thirty(28).


Note that In my research I found out that Thirty was meant as the town of Bedford, The Eighteen means north.(18 and 30 is the Boundaries) This could also be noticed in "I named the Island you will be rejoiced at in thirty(In Page 2, he mentioned Bedford).

Why did they went somewhere in between Bedford and Campbell County with gold and silvers with them if they came from west?

Note that this is only one of the many coincidences using the Key First Voyage. If possible, check it number by number.

 

[bigscoop]

This is a Good one.

I would like to as a question though.

In the Beale paper's it was never mentioned what are the means of transporting the Gold and Silver to Bedford(Wagons?ship?). Would it be possible that they transported it through the Sea?

I doubt this as a possibility. Since if I based it on the questionable "First Voyage key", it seems to me that they went to town of Bedford (or a route in between) where the people from Campbell County noticed them and knew about the gold and silver that they are transporting. They said that they are the people who have no opposition.

This is exactly in this paragraph.

I discovered(50) thirty(29) the first cities(216) other(321) people(603) Lord has given(14) fine plains and open country(612) the first island(81) the eastward(360) with the fleet(36) discovered(51) all I have taken possession(62) to the people(194) without opposition(78) and of all(60) at once I continued the said route(200) so they returned(314) no iron, nor, steel, nor weapons(676) I named the island(112) you will be rejoiced at (4) in thirty(28).


Note that In my research I found out that Thirty was meant as the town of Bedford, The Eighteen means north.(18 and 30 is the Boundaries) This could also be noticed in "I named the Island you will be rejoiced at in thirty(In Page 2, he mentioned Bedford).

Why did they went somewhere in between Bedford and Campbell County with gold and silvers with them if they came from west?

Note that this is only one of the many coincidences using the Key First Voyage. If possible, check it number by number.

We can find "coincidences" in any suspected remedy we wish to pursue. i.e., "I found out that Thirty was meant as the town of Bedford, The Eighteen means north.(18 and 30 is the Boundaries)..." This is possible because it's what you desired to find from the onset. Likewise, I can take any book off of the shelf and I can create a solution for C1, etc., etc. Per example, one of the 90% clear text that was created for C1 used Disney characters and Disney stories as the key elements. So forget about all of this Columbus stuff until you can actually find conclusive evidences that actually support the tale in the Beale Papers, otherwise you'll just continue to manufacture remedies and solutions out of thin air, which is so darn easy to do......

 

[jhonnz41]

We can find "coincidences" in any suspected remedy we wish to pursue. i.e., "I found out that Thirty was meant as the town of Bedford, The Eighteen means north.(18 and 30 is the Boundaries)..." This is possible because it's what you desired to find from the onset. Likewise, I can take any book off of the shelf and I can create a solution for C1, etc., etc. Per example, one of the 90% clear text that was created for C1 used Disney characters and Disney stories as the key elements. So forget about all of this Columbus stuff until you can actually find conclusive evidences that actually support the tale in the Beale Papers, otherwise you'll just continue to manufacture remedies and solutions out of thin air, which is so darn easy to do......

The sad fact is that, I did not even try to make it based on my imagination.I simply wrote everything that I think will make a sentence based on the key and slowly figure it out month after month. I have my first draft done in last week of March 2020, at first I don't have any Idea what eighteen and thirty means until a friend (Who helped a lot) sent me a document that might be relevant to the topic. It was in that document that I found this Eighteen and Thirty- Stuff.

At first my thought is that, from Bedford they went 18 miles north. Then another 30 miles. That brings me to the area somewhere around Newcastle. I think I made a thread about it. Which I draw their possible route based on descriptions given. But I was wrong.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

AGREE!

 

[jhonnz41]

I can take any book off of the shelf and I can create a solution for C1... I would love to see, because I haven't tried to use any other key aside from this. I wonder If I used another key, there will be a full message.. I promise that I Just wrote everything down. Here is my first draft, without any Idea about the Harkening Hill or the names.


Here is my draft as of August 14,2020. You can see a lot of miscounting and errors on this.

Proclamation to the people that the Illustrious King and a boat with a master name of San Salvador of the success that our Island discovered I gave. The Mainland on the side our Sovereigns. Commemoration extensive possession Biscay since with that of the most accessible for the kingdoms of Castile. The Islands castellanos of pure gold Lord has given, the illustrious king have taken possession. How in thirty, the first name when I came to see I have taken possession of San Salvador. Are most Ingenious men at the glorious success that our Lord has given me in my voyage. Know fifth Isles of India the illustrious King of our men arrive.

And lovely Hispaniola appeared, and that the coast led northward incomparably higher than in centre isle. Vast mines of gold and other metals in this island. There are many kinds of birds, and a great variety of fruits that isle toward the west. To make for the south find out wheter there was any king or large city but with no kind of government. And that the coast led northward the fourth fail to see some great cities or towns and lovely as trees.
Many leagues that nothing new appeared, island like all the others. The success that our Lord has wonderfully granted, people without name. When I came it was impossible to speak to the people. Me in my voyage to the Indies with the fleet the name of San Salvador I could not speak. I followed the coast of that isle toward the west as I know commemoration of His Divine Majesty, Display of the Royal Standard excelling any. Proceeding I determined. In thirty covered with blossoms, were palm trees. I saw another isle to the eastward, Santa Maria gave a new name, towns, and finding at the end how in thirty no towns nor villages.
And thus glorious success that so high. To tell you how and lovely in my voyage, incomparably higher than taken possession I discovered. At once I continued the said route to find Maria, other Indians new name when fleet that the illustrious king excelling any sent two man to has given me proclamation and display. Of many leagues that nothing new appeared, a new blancas Queen given me island that the illustrious king the name of San Salvador of all. And that I write this to tell you, to find out one I gave a new name, Salvador.

I have taken possession set in lovely as trees nor are they fit for them. Rejoiced at the illustrious king and finding at the end of a few small the eastward succeded me in my voyage I have, They seem to touch that they thus to each one, that I thought it might be the mainland opposition to the display of the island discovered In my voyage have taken. and there the Indies Highness fifth, Juana, which I gave the name. So high that they seem to touch me in my voyage.
The first island I discovered I gave that our Lord has given all this, and are losing all I have taken possession of Santa Maria. Divine Majesty who has wonderfully granted. All this, the Indians show so much love that they would give by proclamation and display and of all, I have taken possession a galley. Have been told that trees I could not fail to see, the third Fernandina. I forbade worthless things being given to them. Came to the end with the fleet that isle toward the west. People, wonderful pine woods and open country our Lord has given. Concepcion the third I have taken and finding true Hispaniola where the remaining gold mines this is worth having. In my voyage I write this to gave whether it be anything of great or small value has given in thirty of Cathay; and the name you will be rejoiced.

Days I sailed. Queen named in my voyage. The coast of that isle toward the west incomparably higher the people. Other Indians the fleet that the third named be rejoiced when I came at the glorious Concepcion. People without number, King and Queen, numberless people High Queen Indians countless small communities.

Our Lord has given extensive nor weapons. In commemoration I gave the name of Month first. Wonderful, the glorious success granted all this. Fleet that the excelling name of San Salvador proclamation and display cities or towns.

I give more confidence and I know that the people has given me this land of that isle toward the west. Led northward in my voyage inhabited by numberless people, to each one I led northward. At eighteen they will be to the first for pasturage where new blancas voyage. I write this to tell you how in to the Indies glorious success that I have been to distance to which I gave Salvador, the Name. Sea – coast certain to the end. I continued thinking I could gave the fleet finding that so generous not seen taken possession this land was an island my voyage. Where I Fernandina, I gave the Cities or towns and find out whether as if they show so much love that this land was an island. Spun cotton the coast led northward. Have taken their highness that the coast led northward with many mountains for a new blancas. I discovered thirty the cities other people Lord has given fine plains. The first the eastward with the fleet discovered all I have to the people without opposition, and of all at once, I continued the said route so they returned no iron, nor, steel, nor weapons.

I named the islands you know how in thirty. In my voyage, of all I have gave in confidence and they were the finest which seem given glorious success. Be rejoiced at the glorious success, possession for their highness, de Concepcion, the Third, Fleet that the illustrious king and Queen our Sovereigns gave me, where I discovered people, large flowing rivers, new blancas small communities, and they explored for three days it be anything of great or small value without opposition. Lord has given this second. Guanaham the second. All days covered with this fear, cities or towns sent two men, the indies to tell that in return I thought it might be whether my voyage I write Given me hundred.

My voyage the winter had already set in. I discovered coast led northward name marvel. Island to the Indies. Was impossible to speak for their highness. This I gave a great many islands. The name of San Salvador given to the third, their Highness by proclamation. His Divine Majesty Fernandina. Cities or towns peculiarities. His Divine Majesty success that our Lord has given. Once I continued the standard leagues. Towns have taken possession Gold and other metals, I forbade northward, contrary west and fail to see glorious success. Majesty the Indies de Concepcion inhabited by numberless cities. De Concepcion proclamation, town of the natives. That provinces allow as many discovered that the illustrious king not with know my voyage. Trees of six or eight varieties that the coast led northward write I came are rich and fertile for planting. I discovered king or large city to the Sovereign thinking I could not fail many that thirty fleet Sovereigns, gave me. And as I found discovered to the people that was against my proceeding or eight varieties them, for In my voyage to see some great excelling any.
The fifth was my voyage I write you. I have taken His Divine Majesty that our Lord wonderfully granted in Christendom given me. When I appeared so were my voyage, How in the name fine plains hundred was sharpened stick at a certain harbor of the island I discovered success. The land there is elevated, name of San Salvador. And display I discovered and master since at the end to each one, the illustrious granted all this.

The Indies give their very hearts. Castellanos of pure gold I have been received, I discovered given without opposition. This given, the third already taken. This island were as much pleased how in thirty for a leathern strap of a thousand islands. I gave the Indies and Queen, to see some call His Divine Majesty, so I determined not to wait there longer. To us, they had already taken that this land was an island. There is elevated and innumerable people. Continued the said route, the fourth of his cities since I know of be rejoiced widely. And I know countless small communities I named, no towns nor villages see some great proclamation and display of His Divine Majesty. I continued the Indies glorious success.

I know you will be rejoiced at the illustrious king and Queen Santa Maria de Concepcion. I discovered at the end of many leagues that nothing new appeared, ashore to some. And the success that our Lord has given, and of all arrive.

Without knowing anything, I slowly work it out day by day. There are many errors on this version. If possible, please try it using this method using the key. Or try another.

 

[jhonnz41]

Can we at least check if who made that version? Who published it and When? I am very interested. I don't have data about the key.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

"Made" by Virginia Job Print on Main Street, Lynchburg, Va.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Written by John William Sherman, writer for Lynchburg, Va. LYNCHBURG DAILY NEWS on Church Street; one street up from the JP, in the same BIG building, THE VIRGINIAN (now a BIG Hotel... THE VIRGINIAN in Lynchburg, Va. $$$$.

 

[bigscoop]

Can we at least check if who made that version? Who published it and When? I am very interested. I don't have data about the key.

Sure you can, but this is a Beale Papers/Treasure forum. You'd probably be better off disassociating all of this with the Beale Treasure and then try one of the historical based sites/forums. Right now you're sort of in that "apples VS oranges" situation.......they're just not from the same tree or same fruit at all.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

There is NO "Key"...

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Sure you can, but this is a Beale Papers/Treasure forum. You'd probably be better off disassociating all of this with the Beale Treasure and then try one of the historical based sites/forums. Right now you're sort of in that "apples VS oranges" situation.......they're just not from the same tree or same fruit at all.

AGREE!

 

[bigscoop]

Look, try this yourself. Take any adventure story, any old adventure diary, even other tales of treasures, and do the same thing with those writings that you are doing with this Columus stuff, you will find "circumstantial evidences" that will "create suspicions" with any of them. Just look at Eldo, he's managed to connect just about every treasure tale and every adventure story on the planet to the Beale Papers, up to and including a bogus Paralta Stone. That's the whole point to the Beale Papers tale, it's what makes it such a brilliantly penned treasure tale, because it leaves readers with endless possibilities and endless suspects. And over the years we have witnessed this playing out time and time again, just as you are doing now with this Columbus stuff......

 

[Singlestack Wonder]

Folks attempting to create relevancy by leveraging fiction.....

 

[jhonnz41]

Look, try this yourself. Take any adventure story, any old adventure diary, even other tales of treasures, and do the same thing with those writings that you are doing with this Columus stuff, you will find "circumstantial evidences" that will "create suspicions" with any of them. Just look at Eldo, he's managed to connect just about every treasure tale and every adventure story on the planet to the Beale Papers, up to and including a bogus Paralta Stone. That's the whole point to the Beale Papers tale, it's what makes it such a brilliantly penned treasure tale, because it leaves readers with endless possibilities and endless suspects. And over the years we have witnessed this playing out time and time again, just as you are doing now with this Columbus stuff......

Give me an example key please,a link of something you want me to try.I will try it promise.