USA button, reales, gold, and other relics

Tommy G

Bronze Member
Joined
Dec 5, 2015
Messages
1,575
Reaction score
1,564
Golden Thread
1
Location
Virginia
🥇 Banner finds
1
Detector(s) used
AT Pro
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
I just returned from a six day hunt yesterday, so this will be my longest post ever! I got permission to hunt an 1868 estate (100+ acres), original home and out buildings still standing. The property is documented back to the original 1660 land patent granted by King Charles II. The land boarders the Potomac River. The owner introduced me to a local archaeologist that has been documenting the area for the past 25 years. Before my hunt began, I toured the property with him for about two hours, soaking up the history this guy had accumulated. Probably the most important history shared with me was the fact that there used to be a large pier on the river that served as a major cargo port from the mid to late 1700's. He was even able to point out the path the wagons took as they ventured to and from port. In total, I spent six full days hunting the area and managed to pull together some nice finds, some of which you see the in the table wrap up photo below. Most of the finds were found along the old wagon road, others closer to the house which has been occupied and passed down through multiple generations. Because of the long, documented history of this land, I expected to find an lot of cross-generation relics, which was the case.

Finds.webp

Now to some close ups. This pewter USA button was found along the old road about 100 yards from the shoreline where the pier connected.

USA front.webpUSA back.webpUSA back 2.webp

Before l left on Saturday, I met again with the archaeologist to show him this button and a few other finds. After closely examining the button, he said he could find no reason to believe this was not an authentic Continental Army enlisted button. I even argued with him due to the remarkable condition it was in. He told me there were multiple patterns of this button produced, some of poor quality, others of much better quality. He then commented on the excellent soil condition as a contributing factor, and went on the point out the excellent condition of the 1781 reale that I found not 20 yards away from this button.

1781 reale front.webp1781 reale back.webp

In fact, I found a half real, a couple of cut reales and a cut copper as well.

cut coins.webp

I can barely make out part of a bust on the cut copper. The back has no detail. Would love to hear your ideas on this one.

half copper front.webphalf copper back.webp

Then I stumbled on to this beautiful dropped, 50+ caliber three ringer.

large bullet.webplarge bullet bottom.webp

And a smaller one, maybe in the .32 caliber range that may or may not be period. Opinions welcome.

small bullet.webpsmall bullet botton.webp

A nice convex sliver button with pattern.

silver button front.webpsilver button back.webp

A gold cuff link, both pieces found in the hole.

gold cuff front.webpgold cuff back.webp

Some mystery buttons. The shank tells me 18th century, but the finish is very odd. All are quarter size. Again, comments welcome.

Mystery buttons group.webpMystery button close up.webp

Several of these. All with Waterbury Conn on the back. The website refers to these as hat buttons. Not sure of age, but found three, this one being the best condition.

hat button front.webphat button back.webp

Several pieces of large caliber rim fire brass, these two being the best examples. Both have two strike marks on them, indicating a misfire on the first shot. I have an .40 S&W for sizing comparison, these a slightly larger.

casings.webpcasings 2.webp

Part of a colonial buckle frame and knee buckle frame.

buckle frame.webpknee buckle frame.webp

Not going to post close ups the tombacs and flat buttons, but multiple sizes were found. I will end this post with a real head-scratcher. What appears to be (according to my research) a King George VI Royal Engineers button (WWII era). I have found a couple of identical examples on the internet, one stating that it was made by C. Pitt & Co. However, I've not found any photos that show a back mark. In fact, I've not been able to find a single C. Pitt back mark example, leading me to believe they had none. Anyway, not sure of the authenticity of this one. All I can say is that I found it several inches deep on a high ridge line, overlooking the Potomac.

Engineer front.webpEngineer back.webp

I could go on forever, but will cut this short :laughing7: Thanks for checking out the post, and if you want a close up, or have any questions about the other finds in wrap up photo, just let me know.
 

Upvote 33
completely awesome finds... The reale and USA are some of the nicest I have seen myself. Nice post too
 

Last edited:
Wow, that's a great hunt!
 

Looks like you've enjoyed yourself over the past week. :notworthy: Awesome finds. The button is in amazing condition. I am a coin shooter at heart and would love to have dug those cut silvers as well as the others.
 

Those are great finds Tommy. Real or reenactment, it must have been an amazing feeling digging that button.

Great cut coins and buckles. That one reale is in great shape too. I believe that cut copper is a Geo 2nd. It sounds like you had an incredible week digging some very old dirt and rubbing elbows with archeologists. Cheers!
 

Wow you nailed all aspects of Fantastic hunt!
 

pretty much covered all the bases except for a Zincoln

Darn, I knew I was missing something! All kidding aside, the only zinc penny I found was a 1996 One Cent from the Commonwealth of the Bahamas. Go figure.
 

Tommy here are two shanks from pewter USA buttons.
The shank on your USA looks like a reenactment button.
Gary

View attachment 1378892

Thanks, GAP. I've seen a lot of photos of these. I can't help but wonder why a replica would not have a similar shank if the purpose is to maximize the detail of the real version. I am now taking a different research approach and looking on line for makers of replica buttons to see if I can match this one.
 

Those are great finds Tommy. Real or reenactment, it must have been an amazing feeling digging that button.

Great cut coins and buckles. That one reale is in great shape too. I believe that cut copper is a Geo 2nd. It sounds like you had an incredible week digging some very old dirt and rubbing elbows with archeologists. Cheers!

Thanks, Scrappy. It was a six day metal detecting orgy! I hope to go back some day.
 

Looks like you've enjoyed yourself over the past week. :notworthy: Awesome finds. The button is in amazing condition. I am a coin shooter at heart and would love to have dug those cut silvers as well as the others.

Thanks, Loco. I was trying focus the post on the older relics and unknowns, but I also found 3 GW quarters (two 1964 and one 1938); and a 1954 Rosey dime. Also a dozen or so of each - memorials and wheats. I confess that with all the period relics and early silver, the more modern stuff just got tossed in the pouch for later clean up and didn't make the table round up photo. I too love to coin shoot. Something about those "tight and bright" signals that get me excited.
 

Hi Tommy
Sorry to say, but that USA is a reproduction.
And so are some of the small ones.
Are you sure there hasn't been some Reenactors on the property?
 

I was also concerned about the "look" of the USA button. I have only dug one but it had a big honking cast in loop shank like others I've seen. But there are lots of variations of this button.

The wife and I usually visit Williamsburg, VA during Christmas season. The next time I go, I'm going to see if I can bend the ear of one of their archaeologists about these buttons. I've seen several variations on-line, but nothing in person that I can confidently say is the real thing.
 

GAP metal has it right. Wedge shanks are normally found on reenactor's buttons. And there are a lot out there. My USA's are all like those shown in GAP's post.

Not arguing the fact that it could be a reenactment button, but that is easy to say and hard to explain. One has to wonder how something like this finds its way to a remote area of private property and gets buried 4 inches in the ground where no known reenactments have ever taken place. Add that to the fact that the Spanish silver dug all around it is certainly not fake, the tombacs, and flat buttons are not fake, the buckle frames are not fake; but one lone button among all these real artifacts is a replica? I'm sure I'm not the only one that's asked that question.
 

Hi Tommy
Sorry to say, but that USA is a reproduction.
And so are some of the small ones.
Are you sure there hasn't been some Reenactors on the property?

Thanks for chiming in, Brasco. No, this is private property that is pretty far off the beaten path. No known reenactments.
 

Outstanding Relic, Jewelry and Coin hunt! Congratualtions! :notworthy:
 

What an enjoyable, classy post: outstanding finds, great pics and rich description, and an easy going approach to your expertise. So cool that you are donating, too...far too few detectorists do.

I don't have anything to add to the button debate, but hope it ends up legit.
 

Incredible week Tommy! That's more Spanish silver than I find in multiple years. :headbang: That really sounds like an amazing property and I hope you can continue to hit it.

Those cartridges are not misfires, but fired from a rifle with a firing pin that strikes the rim in two spots 180 degrees from each other. There were only a handful of rifles with firing pins like that, but the one that comes to mind are the original Henry .44 rifles. I measured them with your .40 cal cartridge and they look like .44 caliber to me... so most likely fired from a Henry rifle.

casings.webp

Anytime the pin marks are directly across from each other, it was most likely fired from a rifle with a pin that strikes in two spots at once. Although possible, not really probable that by chance they would rotate a cartridge exactly 180 degrees after a misfire for its second strike... but I'm sure its happened! Somewhere I have a dual pin misfire with 4 strike marks on it!
 

I have dug over 100 marked regimental Rev War buttons, most years ago. None ever had a wedge shank. Wedge shanks have been used since the 1960's-1970's by reenactors. I belong to one reenactment group, a year ago at Gettysburg we lost a "CSA" coat button off one of the jackets. And in a muddy area (it had been raining), I'm sure it sunk a few inches in just a day or so. So if somebody finds it in a few years they will think they have an old button, which is reasonable, but the manufacture style changed and someone knowledgeable will be able to tell. These days the button makers are trying to put on "correct" shanks for the reproduction coats, but unless a pewter button is in a fire pit (lots of ash), the pewter will never stay that nice. This guy sells some with the wedge shanks, and there are a lot of others out there. Almost all of the "NY" buttons found on ebay are 1970's manufacture. Najecki Reproductions (Continental Buttons)
 

Top Member Reactions

Users who are viewing this thread

Latest Discussions

Back
Top Bottom