why wont the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

[ClonedSIM]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

=af1733 art,I've yet to see a dowser post a link to a site that does not support their cause. Do you mean to tell everyone here that you purposely directed a skeptic to a test that did not support dowsing?
*********
Now that is a breathtaking statement, it caused me me to reflect upon how many counter links the anti fanatics have posted hmm, I was amazed, none?


Tropical Tramp

And again, Realde misses the very simple point of a post entirely. Give him a hand, folks.

 

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[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

=af1733 *********now that is a breathtaking statement, it caused me me to reflect upon how many counter links the anti fanatics have posted hmm, I was amazed, none? Tropical Tramp
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And again, Realde misses the very simple point of a post entirely. Give him a hand, folks.
***********************
So you are now down to swr' level, can't read posts correctly?

Tropical Tramp

 

[ClonedSIM]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

=af1733 *********now that is a breathtaking statement, it caused me me to reflect upon how many counter links the anti fanatics have posted hmm, I was amazed, none? Tropical Tramp
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And again, Realde misses the very simple point of a post entirely. Give him a hand, folks.
***********************
So you are now down to swr' level, can't read posts correctly?

Tropical Tramp

When I say you missed the pint of a post, I mean you missed the point of a post.

For the longest time Art saw the German barn test as some kind of proof that dowsing worked, and even posted links and portions of the post here at T'Net. Now he is saying the test was conducted badly and only proves that the results were incorrect. So I asked him why on Earth he would direct skeptics to a test that seemed to disprove dowsing.

So, as you may not be able to see, counter links do not come into play here at all.

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

[=af1733
=af1733 *********now that is a breathtaking statement, it caused me me to reflect upon how many counter links the anti fanatics have posted hmm, I was amazed, none? Tropical Tramp
\\\\\\\\\\\\\

And again, Realde misses the very simple point of a post entirely. Give him a hand, folks.
***********************
So you are now down to swr' level, can't read posts correctly?Tropical Tramp
\\\\\\\\

When I say you missed the pint of a post, I mean you missed the point of a post.

For the longest time Art saw the German barn test as some kind of proof that dowsing worked, and even posted links and portions of the post here at T'Net. Now he is saying the test was conducted badly and only proves that the results were incorrect. So I asked him why on Earth he would direct skeptics to a test that seemed to disprove dowsing.
**************

So what does this have with the context of my post?

Tropical Tramp

 

[ClonedSIM]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

Let's see. I directed a post to Art, you thought that was an invitation to add your two cents, you didn't understand the topic, and now you have no clue what's going on. If there was any doubt, you just removed it....

It's a dowser, ladies and gentlemen!

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

=af1733 link=]
Let's see. I directed a post to Art, you thought that was an invitation to add your two cents, you didn't understand the topic, and now you have no clue what's going on. If there was any doubt, you just removed it....

It's a dowser, ladies and gentlemen********************

Yep ? if you say so, i guess? Err comments about the followin post?

hi CARL, Yes to minimize, not "ELIMINATE" , hence all such tests are subject to question and intimate review, especially when the emotional/mental/physical aspects of the people are involved. In this type of case, it is impossible to do so. Even if all try to the best of their ability to be impartial or to succeed, it is still impossible, due to what you called "self delusional beliefs" triggered by perhaps the subconscience from a past experience or reading, or even in being subjected to a feeling of inferiority because of present surrounding and type or attitude of the testers. Hence any conclusions based upon pure statistics in this type of test, is at best a semi-educated guess.

For a dowsing test to be "VALID", the SAME dowser should be subjected to a large no. of tests in the same exact manner in many different conditions and under (A) all testers that believe in Dowsing , (B) All of those that do not, plus (C) an equally divided group. Only under these conditions can one draw a "reasonable" idea.

Anything less is completely unacceptable as true Scientific testing since we are dealing with a complex interwoven group of Psychlogical as well a Physiological feeds all modulating each other.. Any of which can be altered easily by the present testing conditions.

Topical Trmp

 

[ClonedSIM]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

Okay, say we accept what you say in the post as correct, which for the most part it seems to be. We must toss out all dowsers self-administered tests as also being invalid, since they did not follow this protocol. That surely simplifies matters.

I say for the most part because there is one major flaw with your post. You assume that a dowser will fail because they will feel inferior due to the audience, will fail because of past experiences, or for any other reason pertaining to performance anxiety.

If this is the case, then this must be a dowsing-related problem, because there are hundreds of people that must perform in front of audiences every day.

Did you ever see a football team lose because all of the opposing teams fans wanted them to lose?

Did you even see a teacher get sick the day before a big test because all of her students wanted a way out of the test?

Did you ever see a police officer crash his car during a pursuit because the person running willed him to do that?

As far as your testing specifics go, I'm sure if a dowser spoke to Carl or Randi and specifically laid out a testing method that was viewed by certain people over a number of repeated tests, it could be done, because both of them are rational and understanding. If that isn't enough for you, then try this.

Either Carl or Randi would much rather a dowser fail under his own protocol. It only makes the failure that much more meaningful.

 

[dowser 501]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

Woops Realde, I am afraid I will have to correct you on your comment re testing dowsing under all conditions.

The reason why this forum is so busy and at loggerheads is that dowsing is almost a myth to most because dowsing cannot be tested under most conditions.

Its conditions for testing are so limited that you might have to wait several years for kosher dowsing conditions if you wished to personally accidentally experience mental dowsing. You might be an old man too old to dig by the time you fluked a good dowsing period. Max

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

Judy love that was beautiful and cute , living up to your name of B & B Beauty with Brains. heheheh.

I still think that your bait is fresher and nicer than jean's, sides you are more fun.. Where do I get a fishing licence?

Tro[ical Tamp

 

[Jean310]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

Okie Dokie AF.....let's look at the big picture chronologically.
Moral to this story............

" Life is harsh. You're tequila shouldn't be "

Judy

Ugh.

I think that's more information than my input buffer could handle.

Don't tell me, let me guess...... You're a retired History teacher, and just love looking backwards; thus, to avoid the reality of looking forwards.

Jean

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

JudyH eoooow.... guess again, kitty kitty. Judy
**************

(*****) fresh bait. Kudos again. heheheheheeehh

Tropical Tramp

 

[dowser 501]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

After trying to absorb the above, I reckon Judy H is Judy h. Our infiltrater who has been a skeptic since forums were invented lacks one characteristic, he has no sense of humour, I apologise Max

 

[ClonedSIM]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

Well, Judy I have to admit that it was one long and entertaining post, one which completely diverts all attention from my original point, that Art has flipped from believing the Barn test provided proof of dowsing to now saying that the test is garbage. Great try, though!

And this is great:

After trying to absorb the above, I reckon Judy H is Judy h. Our infiltrater who has been a skeptic since forums were invented lacks one characteristic, he has no sense of humour, I apologise Max

Apparently the skeptics have got the dowsers fighting among themselves.

 

[aarthrj3811]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

Well, Judy I have to admit that it was one long and entertaining post, one which completely diverts all attention from my original point, that Art has flipped from believing the Barn test provided proof of dowsing to now saying that the test is garbage. Great try, though!

Gee af1733....Read the real report . Randi and Carls reports are full of holes....Art

 

[ClonedSIM]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

Well, Judy I have to admit that it was one long and entertaining post, one which completely diverts all attention from my original point, that Art has flipped from believing the Barn test provided proof of dowsing to now saying that the test is garbage. Great try, though!

Gee af1733....Read the real report . Randi and Carls reports are full of holes....Art

Can you clarify what you meant here, Art? Are you denying my statement? Read what real report? The barn test, or do you mean Carl and Randi's reports? And which reports from Carl and Randi are you referring to?

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

=af1733
********

ANY test that does not include at least the data in the infamous posts #6 & #88 is invalid!.
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Operational definitions are inherently difficult — arguably, even impossible — to apply to mental entities, because these latter are generally understood to be accessible only to the individual who experiences them and are therefore not independently verifiable."
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Of course I can dowse! It's quite easy, just not very useful. - Carl
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Tropical Tramp

 

[ClonedSIM]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

=af1733
********

ANY test that does not include at least the data in the infamous posts #6 & #88 is invalid!.

Tropical Tramp

That's what I was looking for. Thanks, Realde!

 

[aarthrj3811]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

Well, Judy I have to admit that it was one long and entertaining post, one which completely diverts all attention from my original point, that Art has flipped from believing the Barn test provided proof of dowsing to now saying that the test is garbage. Great try, though!

Did I flip or is this more twist and spin...Art

 

[ClonedSIM]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

If you define flipping as believing that something is real then suddenly deciding it's not then, yeah, you flipped.

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Re: why won't the doubter discuss this post #6 or #88 and ohers?

[SWR linkThe only “disruption” I have seen is the dowsing proponent that refuses to use proper quote/reply protocol and makes massive repetitive posts in all the threads.
*************
sheesh, you have me pegged right swr, however if I were just a replication of my teachers, I would be in a secluded academic intitution patting my self on the back for somehing ? but contributing nothing..

Of course I could dedicate myself to being an unimaginative YES man similar to swr.

But since I am a social outcast, a tropical tramp, a rebel, unconventional clod, I studied the para-normal intensively, which if I were conventional , I would never have bothered to investigate, just accepted it as pseudoscience. As a result a whole new aspect of the universe was opened to me. I have seen and experimented with things that conventional science denies as existing. I am happy with the results, even if conventional peeps aren't.

No-one can take this away from me, I have had a glimpse of man's capabilities and his future. Man is fantastic in his yet untapped abilities. Frankly the females appear to be even further developed in this than the males.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Operational definitions are inherently difficult — arguably, even impossible — to apply to mental entities, because these latter are generally understood to be accessible only to the individual who experiences them and are therefore not independently verifiable."
=================
Of course I can dowse! It's quite easy, just not very useful. - Carl
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Tropical Tramp

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