Zerzura

[kitab_geeks]

Thread for discussing the lost Oasis of Zerzura (the oasis of the Little Birds).

Discussion welcome! I will post on this thread from time to time.

Introduction:
Zerzura is supposed to be a lost city in an oasis of the same name, in the Western Desert of Egypt or Libya. It is supposed to have a gate with a carved bird that holds the key to the gate in its beak (why have a lock if you are going to put the key in such an obvious place? But then I guess lots of people keep the key under the doormat or nearby plant pot...)
If you follow just what is in Wikipedia, it is supposed to be either quite a bit to the west of the Farafra-Baharya road, or else on the road from the Nile to Kharga and Dakhla. These can obviously not both be true...
The Zerzura Club, a group of explorers from between the World Wars on whom the book and movie The English Patient were loosely based, thought it was southwest of Dakhla, and eventually declared it to be in Wadi Sura, on the southern edge of the Gilf Kibir - even though the site in no way fits the description.
There are various legends that refer to Zerzura, but the most reliable source is considered to be the Kitab al-Kanuz: the Book of Hidden Pearls. This was a medieval Egyptian treasure hunting manual compiled in the 1400s from various documents that appear to date back to the 900s AD.
In entry 369, it places the starting point for the trail to Zerzura in the Dakhla Oasis:
"In the city of Warde [Rose], located behind El-qala at Essoury [The Fortress at Essoury], you will see palm trees, vines, and springs. Enter the wadi and walk upstream; you will find another wadi extending westward between two mountains. From this wadi, a path will lead you to the city of Farzourah [Zerzura], of which you will find the gate closed; it is a city white as a pigeon, and on the door of which a bird is carved. Take the key from the bird’s beak with your hand, and open the gate to the city. Enter, you will find many treasures, along with the king and queen lying in the castle. Do not approach them, but take the treasures. The End" - from the English edition of the Kitab al-Kanuz: the Book of Hidden Pearls.

Walking "upstream" most likely means walking north, not south - towards the Libyan Plateau (north of Dakhla and Kharga), not the Gilf Kibir...

Next time I will post a translation of the same section from the Arabic edition, which is surprisingly different from the English edition...

 

[Crow]

Here is video clip. That tells the history of search for the lost story.

Zerzura

 

[kitab_geeks]

Here is video clip. That tells the history of search for the lost story.

Zerzura

Thanks for posting the link - it is a fun video (though a bit long), with lots of good historical reference. However it does not seem like the author has seen the actual Kitab al-Kanuz. He notes it is available on the web in Arabic - and it is. He does not note it is also available in French. However, the French version on the web is posted from very poor quality optical scans made in 1987 from the 1907 edition published in Cairo by the Imprimerie de l'Institut francais d'archaeologie orientale, and are nearly unreadably poor quality - this also goes for every copy of the French I have seen on Amazon. The scan of the French was done by the University of Ottawa using a copy of the 1907 edition that is in the University of Toronto library.
There is now an English version available, clean and easy to read, and it includes GPS coordinates for most of the sites named in the Kitab, as well as loads of useful annotations like a Glossary of some of the medieval Arabic terms used in giving instructions for finding the treasures.

 

[Crow]

I have no set opinion on the existence of Zerzura. However the topic is fascinating.

Robert Berg, an independent scholar, consults for US companies doing business in the Middle East. claiming the following.

The late 1920's saw the debate over Zerzura reach fever pitch. A number of articles about the "rather complex subject" aired strongly held viewpoints. Based on evidence he had found on his travels, de Lancey Forth thought the oasis could be found west-northwest of Dakhla. Ball felt that it could possibly be found within the Sand Sea, more likely to the west of Bir Terfawi. Harding King clung to his idea of a rain-fed "olive" oasis between Jabal 'Uwaynat and Dakhla. Douglas Newbold of the Sudan Service placed it west of the Selima Oasis. The Hungarian Count László Almásy believed it would be found in the area of the Gilf Kebir.

As you can see varying ideas. Which one if any are correct?

Crow

 

[Crow]

Maybe the lost city of Zerzura was never lost at all?

De Lancey Forth thought the oasis could be found west-northwest of Dakhla.

Could the answer be the legendary city of Zerzura is the The 26th-dynasty Temple of the Oracle sits in the northwest corner of the ruins of Aghurmi village? at the Siwa oasis?

Alexander the Great's symbolic bird was the eagle, particularly Zeus's eagle. This association stemmed from the eagle's long-standing role as a symbol of strength, authority, and divine power in Greek mythology. The eagle was frequently depicted on Alexander's coinage and other depictions, reinforcing his claim to divine lineage and military prowess. Perhaps Hamid Keila account with that the bird statue was in fact an eagle. And the fair skinned people he encountered there was a left over population from Alexanders the great time. They was not Muslims. They had straight swords. The descendants was still in existence in 1418 cut off from the outside world but over time they became Muslim.

Built in the 6th century BC, probably on top of an earlier temple, it was dedicated to Amun (occasionally referred to as Zeus or Jupiter Ammon) and was a powerful symbol of the town’s wealth. It is believed Alexander the Great was declared son of Amun in this temple. This might explain the bird, the eagle. this would tie into Hamid Keila's story.

An oracle is a person, place, or thing that is believed to provide wise counsel, insight, or prophecies, often attributed to a divine source. In ancient times, oracles were specifically associated with priests or priestesses through whom gods were thought to speak. The term can also refer to a place where such communication occurred, or even an answer given by an oracle. In modern usage, "oracle" can describe anyone or anything that is a reliable source of wise advice or information. Maybe the Oracle was a tomb of king queen revered by the then local population and Hamid Keila stole the ruby ring.


The local population spoke Arabic but still had infused Greek works in their local dialect. Probably suggested they had already became the process over time of assimilating into Arab population.

There are many stories about the foundation of the temple. One tells of two priestesses who were banished from Thebes to the desert. One founded the Temple of Dodona in Greece, the other the Temple of the Oracle here in Aghurmi. One of the most revered oracles in the ancient Mediterranean, its power was such that some rulers sought its advice while others sent armies to destroy it.

Was Siwa and Zerzura a mistranslated name from Siwa? Z and S in some languages sounds the same.

Although treasure hunters have been at work here over hundreds of years. Its not implausible that alleged ruby ring was plundered from one of graves or even the Oracle itself. The buttressed temple was poorly restored in the 1970s, it remains an evocative site, steeped in history. Surrounded by the ruins of Aghurmi, it has awesome views over the Siwan oasis palm-tops.

There is tombs in the hill top dating back thousands of years. The Account of Hamid Keila actually fits in with what he encountered and even with Ruby gem most like brought to Siwa via Greek solider that was once in Alexanders armies via Persia.

The ring was purportedly possessed by King Idris of Libya, who Muammar al-Gaddafi dethroned in 1969. Expert opinion had concluded that it was a highly valuable work dating to the 12th century and believed to have been of European origin. From this, people speculatively assumed that the Zerzurans were a lost army of crusaders either traveling to Jerusalem or returning from it. They had either lost their way or set up home purposely in the remoteness of the desert because, for unknown reasons, they did not want to be found. The Zerurans was not crusaders but actually the remains of parts of Alexander the great Greek army that control Egypt for a time.

Although much romance and mystery are attached to the legend of the lost city of Zerzura, there is extraordinarily little evidence supporting it. The existence of the ring is not substantiated, and experts consider Hamid Keila was the author of the “Kitab al Kanuz” if it had ever existed.

Yet Aghurmi village? at Siwa might well indeed be the fabled lost city of Zerzura that people searched for?

Crow

 

[Crow]

Here is more on the ruins. Which in its tombs had Greek, Roman and Egyptian influences.

The fortress from above was painted white plaster and traces of it can still be seen. A white city?

Siwa

Crow

 

[Crow]

And of curse in 1920s no one had luxury of Google earth at their finger tips.

The late 1920's saw the debate over Zerzura reach fever pitch. A number of articles about the "rather complex subject" aired strongly held viewpoints. Based on evidence he had found on his travels, de Lancey Forth thought the oasis could be found west-northwest of Dakhla. Ball felt that it could possibly be found within the Sand Sea, more likely to the west of Bir Terfawi. Harding King clung to his idea of a rain-fed "olive" oasis between Jabal 'Uwaynat and Dakhla. Douglas Newbold of the Sudan Service placed it west of the Selima Oasis. The Hungarian Count László Almásy believed it would be found in the area of the Gilf Kebir. They was all in essence incorrect.

Today we can explore the surface to see for ourselves in the luxury of not leaving our own homes. Sadly it takes the romance and adventure out of exploration. As with our technological futures grows so will the profession of human explorers. However such stories for me at least an old dinosaur from the 2oth century such as Zerzura fires the imagination and wonder in what secrets of the past we can discover.

Crow

 

[kitab_geeks]

Maybe the lost city of Zerzura was never lost at all?

De Lancey Forth thought the oasis could be found west-northwest of Dakhla.

Could the answer be the legendary city of Zerzura is the The 26th-dynasty Temple of the Oracle sits in the northwest corner of the ruins of Aghurmi village? at the Siwa oasis?

View attachment 2210033

Alexander the Great's symbolic bird was the eagle, particularly Zeus's eagle. This association stemmed from the eagle's long-standing role as a symbol of strength, authority, and divine power in Greek mythology. The eagle was frequently depicted on Alexander's coinage and other depictions, reinforcing his claim to divine lineage and military prowess. Perhaps Hamid Keila account with that the bird statue was in fact an eagle. And the fair skinned people he encountered there was a left over population from Alexanders the great time. They was not Muslims. They had straight swords. The descendants was still in existence in 1418 cut off from the outside world but over time they became Muslim.

Built in the 6th century BC, probably on top of an earlier temple, it was dedicated to Amun (occasionally referred to as Zeus or Jupiter Ammon) and was a powerful symbol of the town’s wealth. It is believed Alexander the Great was declared son of Amun in this temple. This might explain the bird, the eagle. this would tie into Hamid Keila's story.

An oracle is a person, place, or thing that is believed to provide wise counsel, insight, or prophecies, often attributed to a divine source. In ancient times, oracles were specifically associated with priests or priestesses through whom gods were thought to speak. The term can also refer to a place where such communication occurred, or even an answer given by an oracle. In modern usage, "oracle" can describe anyone or anything that is a reliable source of wise advice or information. Maybe the Oracle was a tomb of king queen revered by the then local population and Hamid Keila stole the ruby ring.


The local population spoke Arabic but still had infused Greek works in their local dialect. Probably suggested they had already became the process over time of assimilating into Arab population.

There are many stories about the foundation of the temple. One tells of two priestesses who were banished from Thebes to the desert. One founded the Temple of Dodona in Greece, the other the Temple of the Oracle here in Aghurmi. One of the most revered oracles in the ancient Mediterranean, its power was such that some rulers sought its advice while others sent armies to destroy it.

Was Siwa and Zerzura a mistranslated name from Siwa? Z and S in some languages sounds the same.

Although treasure hunters have been at work here over hundreds of years. Its not implausible that alleged ruby ring was plundered from one of graves or even the Oracle itself. The buttressed temple was poorly restored in the 1970s, it remains an evocative site, steeped in history. Surrounded by the ruins of Aghurmi, it has awesome views over the Siwan oasis palm-tops.

View attachment 2210032

There is tombs in the hill top dating back thousands of years. The Account of Hamid Keila actually fits in with what he encountered and even with Ruby gem most like brought to Siwa via Greek solider that was once in Alexanders armies via Persia.

The ring was purportedly possessed by King Idris of Libya, who Muammar al-Gaddafi dethroned in 1969. Expert opinion had concluded that it was a highly valuable work dating to the 12th century and believed to have been of European origin. From this, people speculatively assumed that the Zerzurans were a lost army of crusaders either traveling to Jerusalem or returning from it. They had either lost their way or set up home purposely in the remoteness of the desert because, for unknown reasons, they did not want to be found. The Zerurans was not crusaders but actually the remains of parts of Alexander the great Greek army that control Egypt for a time.

Although much romance and mystery are attached to the legend of the lost city of Zerzura, there is extraordinarily little evidence supporting it. The existence of the ring is not substantiated, and experts consider Hamid Keila was the author of the “Kitab al Kanuz” if it had ever existed.

Yet Aghurmi village? at Siwa might well indeed be the fabled lost city of Zerzura that people searched for?

Crow

You never know... Siwa seems a bit far away though, and was well known at the time, as was Farafra. Since the reference "starting points" are either Dakhla or Kharga, it seems more reasonable to be in that vicinity - and there are certainly lots of abandoned village bits in that region.

 

[kitab_geeks]

Thread for discussing the lost Oasis of Zerzura (the oasis of the Little Birds).

Discussion welcome! I will post on this thread from time to time.

Introduction:
Zerzura is supposed to be a lost city in an oasis of the same name, in the Western Desert of Egypt or Libya. It is supposed to have a gate with a carved bird that holds the key to the gate in its beak (why have a lock if you are going to put the key in such an obvious place? But then I guess lots of people keep the key under the doormat or nearby plant pot...)
If you follow just what is in Wikipedia, it is supposed to be either quite a bit to the west of the Farafra-Baharya road, or else on the road from the Nile to Kharga and Dakhla. These can obviously not both be true...
The Zerzura Club, a group of explorers from between the World Wars on whom the book and movie The English Patient were loosely based, thought it was southwest of Dakhla, and eventually declared it to be in Wadi Sura, on the southern edge of the Gilf Kibir - even though the site in no way fits the description.
There are various legends that refer to Zerzura, but the most reliable source is considered to be the Kitab al-Kanuz: the Book of Hidden Pearls. This was a medieval Egyptian treasure hunting manual compiled in the 1400s from various documents that appear to date back to the 900s AD.
In entry 369, it places the starting point for the trail to Zerzura in the Dakhla Oasis:
"In the city of Warde [Rose], located behind El-qala at Essoury [The Fortress at Essoury], you will see palm trees, vines, and springs. Enter the wadi and walk upstream; you will find another wadi extending westward between two mountains. From this wadi, a path will lead you to the city of Farzourah [Zerzura], of which you will find the gate closed; it is a city white as a pigeon, and on the door of which a bird is carved. Take the key from the bird’s beak with your hand, and open the gate to the city. Enter, you will find many treasures, along with the king and queen lying in the castle. Do not approach them, but take the treasures. The End" - from the English edition of the Kitab al-Kanuz: the Book of Hidden Pearls.

Walking "upstream" most likely means walking north, not south - towards the Libyan Plateau (north of Dakhla and Kharga), not the Gilf Kibir...

View attachment 2209180
Next time I will post a translation of the same section from the Arabic edition, which is surprisingly different from the English edition...

So I promised to post a direct translation of the Arabic version of entry 369 in the Kitab al-Kanuz: the Book of Hidden Pearls.

"369 - City of Warda and its Surroundings. The city of Warda lies to the east of the Syrian fort. When you reach it, you will find grapes and flowing springs. Follow the wadi path and enter into it, ascending until you reach a tall peak, in a strange and isolated wadi. Continue to a fork in the road. Take the right path, and it will lead you to the city of Zerzura. You will find its gate locked, but above it, there are images of birds carved into the stone. Take the keys hanging above, open the gate, and enter the city. Inside, you will find a large palace and a king ruling over it. You will triumph only by greeting him, for he does not harm those who greet him with peace.”

Notice that the starting point is the same - the Syrian fort. But instead of Warda being "behind" the fort, it is "to the east" of the fort - this suggests the fort is east of Warda. In the translated French version, you walk upstream in the wadi, in Arabic you walk uphill - not much difference there. Then the wadi and path both fork, you keep right, and end up in Zerzura. But in Arabic the second wadi branches off to the west, while in English, you simply keep right.

Since the terrain in the region of Dakhla is such that going uphill almost certainly means going more or less north, turning west would be turning left, not right - so the two versions appear on the surface to disagree. The only way for turning west to be turning right would be if the first wadi drains from south to north - which few in that region do, and none of any length or size.

The perhaps more interesting interpretation is that the directions are in fact mirrored. There is indeed lore to that effect - that specifically for this entry, you must look in a mirror. That would mean the fort is west of Warda, not east, and the wadi that starts the trail still further west - which makes sense, as the fort is near the west end of the oasis, so Warda would most likely be east of it. Then you go up a wadi, between two mountains (perhaps on the road to Abu Minqar, between the escarpment and a prominent butte). The you turn right up another wadi...which likely means north or even east. It so happens that once you get past that butte, there are two large embayment-like wadis in the escarpment, either one of which could have easily harboured Zerzura during a wetter period such as was known to have occurred in the past, like the Little Ice Age. The second one of these does appear to have many ruins in it...

Still, it is curious to find such a difference between the Arabic, compiled and published by A.B. Kamal in 1907, and the French, translated and published also by A.B. Kamal, also in 1907. He does not really explain these discrepancies... and this is not the only entry with such a difference.

I think that since Kamal was working from three different manuscripts, the Arabic and the French may not be based on the same versions in all cases.