A SAD DAY... Big Brother IS Watching...Some advice for you all.

[golden silver]

Today was a sad and alarming day for me guys. I know some of you have your own stories to tell but now I Golden Silver have one of my own. Are you sitting down? Today I was interogated by NCIS. To those who do not know that is the Military's form of the FBI. I will try and make this brief but it probably won't be.

At first I did not know why I was there but then I remembered another member of this forum telling a story about getting pulled aside at his bank and asked questions by the FBI. I have to be honest I am not sure I bought the story completely until now. They began by asking me my backround information and asked me if I handle a lot of money on the regular basis. I said that I did. Then they proceded to ask how many bank accounts that I have and I was up front and honest. I told them about 10 and where I had them. They asked me why I had them and I explained this hobbie. I am sorry but In this instance I think I am allowed to break rules #1 and #2 of CRHing. It is noteworthy to mention that they were stone faced and serious durring the entire questioning. I was very nervous but stayed straight faced and tried to appear calm because I knew if I was jittery they would be suspicious of my nervousness. They asked me how much a week I went through and how much money per year have I gone through. I said that I was not completely sure but it was over $200,000. Can you believe this guys but they new exactly how much I had gone through. They said it was more like $300,000. What they did next shocked me even more. They pulled out of a black bag a box full of torn wrappers. Lo and behold it was one of my boxes I had thrown away months ago in a dumpster. They had it in their possession. They then asked me if I had been to Harper Ferry West Va. and I said yes. Believe it or not they knew all the road trips I had been on and where. They asked if I had gone to Casinos and I said that I had not. They found it very odd that I did the amount of searching that I had done and that it was actually worth my time. I said that it was worth my time and that I plan on selling some for a down payment on a house. I explained my plans only because they asked what I was doing with the coin. I repeated over and over again that it was just a hobbie and that I am a sailor working to provide for my family and do this to help me save for the future. To show the extent of how much they know...they knew that when tellers asked me what I do with the coin I change stories and don't tell the truth like so many on this website. They knew that sometimes I would dump several thousand at different banks on the same day. All of this drew attention to them.

The Climax of the story and the most shocking part I think is that they followed me to my home. They wanted to come in and see my silver stash. I would not believe it if it did not just happen to me this morning. My wife is in disbelief and my Dad says we do not live in the same country anymore. It has not been the same country for a while now.

So a word of caution If this happened to me it is just a matter of time that someone is knocking on your doors. Be prepared. Another scary thing is that they showed me a law on paper that gives them the right to confiscate property (or in other words silver) if they feel you have carried out an illegal bank transaction which according to the law means several back to back transaction exceding $10,000 or more. I can provide the exact copy of this law and the wording to anyone who wishes to know it.

So what you thought they did not know about you they most certainly do.

...They know what you buy and when and where you buy it.

...They know where you search on the internet.

... They know where you live and work and where your family is.

... They can hear your phone conversations

... They can hear conversations inside your house via your cell phone even if you are not talking on your cell phone or when it is turned off. (So take your battery out if you want privacy at all).

This was a Sad and Scary wake up call of a day for me hope it does not happen to you. In the end they said they were satisfied that I was not a terrorist and would move on but I am still in shock. What a welcome back to the Great U.S of A!! God Bless.

Golden Silver

 

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[Oroblanco]

Tag post, please ignore.

 

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[Treasure_Hunter]

Tag post, please ignore.

 

[Oroblanco]

By putting in a post in this thread, I can easily follow the discussion by simply clicking on "replies" rather than having to hunt down the thread, which saves time and effort for me. Hence my use of the term "tag post" and before you ask, YES, I am THAT lazy!

Please do continue.
Oroblanco

 

[Rich Hartford]

Here is a re post from last April. Was it "Big Brother Watching"?

I had a strange event occur at a former dump bank a couple of months ago.
I used to dump 2,3, and 4 thousand a week at a bank that had a coin counter. I had an account at this bank for years,but used a closer branch for my regular banking. The tellers operated the counter,and were very polite. I always chose a morning when the bank was not busy to dump my coins.
So on this one particular morning I'm at the bank reading the newspaper as they are counting the coins. The bank was empty of customers. After I was there 20 minutes or so a man entered the bank. He was dressed like a bum but was clean shaven, had a neat haircut and was wearing an expensive watch. The man had a deposit slip in his hand and was fiddling around,looking at brochures,but not approaching a teller.
In the mean time the manager approached me and told me that I cannot dump any coin there anymore because the volume I was dumping was more than his business customers, and was costing the bank money. He went on to say that the tellers would cash out some of my change, but I would have to take the remainder elsewhere. Although he was out of earshot I noticed the man dressed like a bum watching me. When I turned in his direction he averted his eyes, and went about,well, just hanging around with a slip in his hand.
After my talk with the manager I'm wondering about this bum. Is he here for me? Lets see. So I casually leave the bank,(the count is still going on) but once outside I split fast to a doorway of an adjacent building. Less than a minute later the man dressed like a bum comes outside and looks around the parking lot. He can't see me,but I can see him. After a couple of minutes he reentered the bank.
I went back in, hung around for the count to end, and left with my cash. But instead of going to my car I went back to the doorway of the other building. The man walked out just as I entered the doorway,looked around the parking lot,and walked to his car. At that point I stepped out and just stared at the guy,who I know saw me looking at him,but would not look at me.
Was he a Fed? Who knows!

 

[Scott (Mich)]

I am not sure Scott if you are implying that I am not telling the full truth. Well, I can't say I blame you.

Oops sorry I had not meant to imply anything. I had wondered why the expert NCIS people did not just believe the facts that they had gathered and still had to go and interrogate you. What I mean is if they are really good at their job then there should never have been any contact from them to you.

 

[mrs.oroblanco]

I don't know about that.

I think part of the Feds MO, is, every once in awhile - shaking someone up. That person will tell others, and then the fear spreads.

The more the fear spreads, the less they (the Feds) have to do. That old saying, kill one, scare a thousand.

Our government (some of it) wants fear - then the citizenry doesn't mind when they have to give up some rights to be "safer".

B

 

[giddyup99]

Honestly guys, this is not some deep conspiracy going on here. Bank noticed "odd" deposit behavior, reported it as they should. This behavior was investigated and here we are. Half this thread made me laugh out loud. I realize this country is not what it was, and is heading down the wrong path with the circus and ringleader we have right now, but let's just put away the tinfoil hats for a bit.

Nothing illegal is happening. The feds are satisfied of this, so continue to sort all you want. Banks must follow the laws that have been posted here previously...they HAVE to. This may not even have been a teller that reported it. Could have been just a desk jockey working some exception reporting software on his computer and came up with it and reported it. Although the deposits were coin, they all look the same on the computer, just dollar signs and numbers. There are no notes on your deposit stating they guy is just looking for silver. I worked at a large bank previously and they made every employee go through training to find "suspicious" transactions, and sign basically the same paperwork GS had to sign. Its not a big deal, although I'm sure it seems like it when you are being interrogated.

Many large cash deposits are VERY suspicious. Imagine a random person who makes $45k a year and has a list of deposit slips from 10 different banks totalling over $300k. That is gonna raise some red flags once someone starts connecting dots. Why did they ask if he frequents casinos? Cuz its a great place to launder money.

I should mention that if they didn't get to see a pile of silver, or a pile of receipts indicating you sold a pile of junk silver - things may have gotten more intense. For anyone who is selling their stash, take note of this and keep detailed records in the event this should happen to you. I'd rather be prepared with paperwork, than try and explain it to a couple of guys who don't want to believe you. Really its no different than explaining your deductions to the IRS.

You guys are making more out of this than it actually is.

 

[DigginThePast]

Welcome to T-Net giddyup99.

You do realize you may be accused of being a planted Fed now?

Is that you Dave?

 

[quiksilver]

Dont wanna insult some of you but its time to get your heads out of your a$$e$ and pay attention to whats going on around you. the govt even without the patriot act does many illegal things , just watch the news. This country no longer follows its constitution.Our forefathers are turning over in their graves.

 

[golden silver]

giddy, I think you are spot on with many of your thoughts. The Alarming thing to me is the extent that they went through and the amount of time and man power used to follow, track and spy on little ole me. I mean they went through my garbage for goodness sake. It made me feel more unsafe than safe that this happened. To you it is funny but a guarantee you that if you were in the tiny room I was in having stuff that you thought was private layed out before your eyes you would be as shell shocked as I am. You laugh at some of these posts and think they are crazy and we wear aluminum hats (nice insult by the way) but the truth of the matter is that this is just scratching the surface of what can happen and what is coming down the pike.

Golden Silver

 

[placerman]

Welcome to T-Net giddyup99.

You do realize you may be accused of being a planted Fed now?

Is that you Dave?

I was thinking the exact same thing.

 

[giddyup99]

Welcome to T-Net giddyup99.

You do realize you may be accused of being a planted Fed now?

Is that you Dave?

I suppose one could think I am a plant. For the record, I'm neither a plant, or a Dave...lol. Just the first time I felt compelled to post. Personally I envy you guys that can search $1000's of dollars in halves a week. Everyone around here looks at me like I have 2 heads when I start asking for coin, even my personal bank, through which I have a mortgage, personal loan, and deposit account doesn't want to order any coin for me, or sell any meaningful amount.

I do some pennies here and there, and my job takes me out of town from time to time and I usually hit up the tellers for halves when I travel around. I've been in about 20 banks and maybe gone through a couple hundred in halves...total. I have 5 40% to show for my efforts. I'm the worst CRH'er in history....

 

[placerman]

Welcome to T-Net giddyup99.

You do realize you may be accused of being a planted Fed now?

Is that you Dave?

I suppose one could think I am a plant. For the record, I'm neither a plant, or a Dave...lol. Just the first time I felt compelled to post. Personally I envy you guys that can search $1000's of dollars in halves a week. Everyone around here looks at me like I have 2 heads when I start asking for coin, even my personal bank, through which I have a mortgage, personal loan, and deposit account doesn't want to order any coin for me, or sell any meaningful amount.

I do some pennies here and there, and my job takes me out of town from time to time and I usually hit up the tellers for halves when I travel around. I've been in about 20 banks and maybe gone through a couple hundred in halves...total. I have 5 40% to show for my efforts. I'm the worst CRH'er in history....

Sounds like a "likely story" to me if I ever heard one....lol

Is it a coincidence that g-man and giddyup99 both start with a "G"?

I think not....

 

[jim4silver]

giddy, I think you are spot on with many of your thoughts. The Alarming thing to me is the extent that they went through and the amount of time and man power used to follow, track and spy on little ole me. I mean they went through my garbage for goodness sake. It made me feel more unsafe than safe that this happened. To you it is funny but a guarantee you that if you were in the tiny room I was in having stuff that you thought was private layed out before your eyes you would be as shell shocked as I am. You laugh at some of these posts and think they are crazy and we wear aluminum hats (nice insult by the way) but the truth of the matter is that this is just scratching the surface of what can happen and what is coming down the pike.

Golden Silver

GS,

I have alot of respect for you as a poster here, but I really don't think the Gov gives a crap about CRHers. For whatever reason, they must have thought you were up to more than looking for silver coins. I don't know your lifestyle so I will not speculate, but something or things you do must have caught their attention.

If the Gov really wanted to punish CRHers or go after them, big volume guys like Silvercop and Mojo and others here would be getting waterboarded daily.

When I was getting boxes of coins regularly and dumping them the tellers at my buy and dump banks all knew why I was buying halves. Many would ask "have you found any keepers lately?" or they would ask me how much junk silver was selling for that particular day, etc. Since I was ordering boxes I did not worry the tellers would cherry pick my halves so I never had a reason to lie about why I was buying halves.

I find it hard to believe though that federal agents would follow you and photograph you for two years for CRHing alone. With all the real crime going on in the world, why would they waste manpower for that much time going after a coin collector.

Something is just strange about all this.

Jim

 

[giddyup99]

giddy, I think you are spot on with many of your thoughts. The Alarming thing to me is the extent that they went through and the amount of time and man power used to follow, track and spy on little ole me. I mean they went through my garbage for goodness sake. It made me feel more unsafe than safe that this happened. To you it is funny but a guarantee you that if you were in the tiny room I was in having stuff that you thought was private layed out before your eyes you would be as shell shocked as I am. You laugh at some of these posts and think they are crazy and we wear aluminum hats (nice insult by the way) but the truth of the matter is that this is just scratching the surface of what can happen and what is coming down the pike.

Golden Silver

I guess I should have indicated what posts I felt were funny. I don't think what you went through was funny in the least. Its a very serious matter, which was dealt with very seriously.

You think, Oh its just little ole me - but they don't know you, they don't - and can't - treat you as a non-threat until they can confirm it. What if you were a terrorist or part of some kind of organized crime? They can't tell just looking at numbers and talking to tellers.

I do laugh at some of these crazy, end of the world/country posts. One guy was leaving for Japan! I do think that this country is becoming a circus and the ringleader is driving the bus off the cliff. But I don't think that a follow up investigation on a SARS report is a huge deal. They are obligated to do so and quite frankly, given what could be going on, I am thankful to hear they do actually follow up on these things. (Now you guys are really gonna think I am a plant)

 

[placerman]

giddy, I think you are spot on with many of your thoughts. The Alarming thing to me is the extent that they went through and the amount of time and man power used to follow, track and spy on little ole me. I mean they went through my garbage for goodness sake. It made me feel more unsafe than safe that this happened. To you it is funny but a guarantee you that if you were in the tiny room I was in having stuff that you thought was private layed out before your eyes you would be as shell shocked as I am. You laugh at some of these posts and think they are crazy and we wear aluminum hats (nice insult by the way) but the truth of the matter is that this is just scratching the surface of what can happen and what is coming down the pike.

Golden Silver

I guess I should have indicated what posts I felt were funny. I don't think what you went through was funny in the least. Its a very serious matter, which was dealt with very seriously.

You think, Oh its just little ole me - but they don't know you, they don't - and can't - treat you as a non-threat until they can confirm it. What if you were a terrorist or part of some kind of organized crime? They can't tell just looking at numbers and talking to tellers.

I do laugh at some of these crazy, end of the world/country posts. One guy was leaving for Japan! I do think that this country is becoming a circus and the ringleader is driving the bus off the cliff. But I don't think that a follow up investigation on a SARS report is a huge deal. They are obligated to do so and quite frankly, given what could be going on, I am thankful to hear they do actually follow up on these things. (Now you guys are really gonna think I am a plant)

Its a good thing they sent you to calm us down officer.

Someone might have hired a lawyer or written a letter to a senator or something and we cant have that can we?

BTW I am only half joking.

 

[giddyup99]

giddy, I think you are spot on with many of your thoughts. The Alarming thing to me is the extent that they went through and the amount of time and man power used to follow, track and spy on little ole me. I mean they went through my garbage for goodness sake. It made me feel more unsafe than safe that this happened. To you it is funny but a guarantee you that if you were in the tiny room I was in having stuff that you thought was private layed out before your eyes you would be as shell shocked as I am. You laugh at some of these posts and think they are crazy and we wear aluminum hats (nice insult by the way) but the truth of the matter is that this is just scratching the surface of what can happen and what is coming down the pike.

Golden Silver

GS,

I have alot of respect for you as a poster here, but I really don't think the Gov gives a crap about CRHers. For whatever reason, they must have thought you were up to more than looking for silver coins. I don't know your lifestyle so I will not speculate, but something or things you do must have caught their attention.

If the Gov really wanted to punish CRHers or go after them, big volume guys like Silvercop and Mojo and others here would be getting waterboarded daily.

When I was getting boxes of coins regularly and dumping them the tellers at my buy and dump banks all knew why I was buying halves. Many would ask "have you found any keepers lately?" or they would ask me how much junk silver was selling for that particular day, etc. Since I was ordering boxes I did not worry the tellers would cherry pick my halves so I never had a reason to lie about why I was buying halves.

I find it hard to believe though that federal agents would follow you and photograph you for two years for CRHing alone. With all the real crime going on in the world, why would they waste manpower for that much time going after a coin collector.

Something is just strange about all this.

Jim

I sincerely doubt he was being followed around for 2 years. They probably had paper records going back that far, but I bet the investigation probably occurred over a couple months at the most. Banks keep great records and will supply them when asked to or required to.

These interrogations are structured and the language is such that they portend to know more than they do. I've taken the Wicklander-Zulawaski training. Everything is set up to make it look like they have been in your back pocket for years. Truth is they were on to you for weeks, and brought you in to interview after the initial investigation and rather than waste time and money for years of surveillance; they decided to talk to you about it.

 

[Rich Hartford]

Welcome to T net Giddy. Always good to get a fresh opinion.
I think the wanna be coppers that were wasting our tax dollars investigating GS are a couple of effing morons,that probably spent most of their careers investigating who was polishing wood in the head of a carrier.
I have the gut feeling that these two couldn't catch a crook if one bit them on their a$$. What do you think ?
HH
Rich

 

[placerman]

Welcome to T net Giddy. Always good to get a fresh opinion.
I think the wanna be coppers that were wasting our tax dollars investigating GS are a couple of effing morons,that probably spent most of their careers investigating who was polishing wood in the head of a carrier.
I have the gut feeling that these two couldn't catch a crook if one bit them on their a$$. What do you think ?
HH
Rich

I THINK you just insulted him.....

 

[placerman]

giddy, I think you are spot on with many of your thoughts. The Alarming thing to me is the extent that they went through and the amount of time and man power used to follow, track and spy on little ole me. I mean they went through my garbage for goodness sake. It made me feel more unsafe than safe that this happened. To you it is funny but a guarantee you that if you were in the tiny room I was in having stuff that you thought was private layed out before your eyes you would be as shell shocked as I am. You laugh at some of these posts and think they are crazy and we wear aluminum hats (nice insult by the way) but the truth of the matter is that this is just scratching the surface of what can happen and what is coming down the pike.

Golden Silver

GS,

I have alot of respect for you as a poster here, but I really don't think the Gov gives a crap about CRHers. For whatever reason, they must have thought you were up to more than looking for silver coins. I don't know your lifestyle so I will not speculate, but something or things you do must have caught their attention.

If the Gov really wanted to punish CRHers or go after them, big volume guys like Silvercop and Mojo and others here would be getting waterboarded daily.

When I was getting boxes of coins regularly and dumping them the tellers at my buy and dump banks all knew why I was buying halves. Many would ask "have you found any keepers lately?" or they would ask me how much junk silver was selling for that particular day, etc. Since I was ordering boxes I did not worry the tellers would cherry pick my halves so I never had a reason to lie about why I was buying halves.

I find it hard to believe though that federal agents would follow you and photograph you for two years for CRHing alone. With all the real crime going on in the world, why would they waste manpower for that much time going after a coin collector.

Something is just strange about all this.

Jim

I sincerely doubt he was being followed around for 2 years. They probably had paper records going back that far, but I bet the investigation probably occurred over a couple months at the most. Banks keep great records and will supply them when asked to or required to.

These interrogations are structured and the language is such that they portend to know more than they do. I've taken the Wicklander-Zulawaski training. Everything is set up to make it look like they have been in your back pocket for years. Truth is they were on to you for weeks, and brought you in to interview after the initial investigation and rather than waste time and money for years of surveillance; they decided to talk to you about it.

Jeez.... you ARE a cop!!!!!!