$1,000,000 for anyone who can dowse.

[musstag]

Well. I couldn't wait, so I did a mini test. I got my son to put a ring in one of 5 brown paper lunch bags, each also containing dirt from the same ground as they were placed on, and he laid them out 8 feet apart two different times, and I found the correct one both times. It was getting late and the evening dew was settling on the grass, so we stopped. We used 5 bags just to same some time testing. When the L=rods crossed over the bag, I went into the house where he was, and I did not let him tell me, and I never opened the selected bag, and I did not disclose my choice to him at that time, I just wrote the bag line up sequence down on a piece of paper, and had him go outside and shuffle up the order, did it again, and then reveal my chioces to him and both were right. I know this is not a full test as suggested, and it isn't double blind, and twice may not be enough yet to prove anything, but the L-rods crossed, that was my decission factor, not "well I'll pick this one".(But I am pleased with the results and smiling abouit it) Now if his brain is telling my brain the hidden ring bag line up sequence and my body was twitching ever so slightly that I can NOT feel it and thats making the rods cross, which I hold pointed tip down one inch and they have drilled plastic handles, and all this is happening by thought waves, well , that TOO, is a pretty hard thing to believe. Ok that'll be it for awhile, I will look into the challange and post progress towards taking it. Thanks again for the info ya'll.

 

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[aarthrj3811]

Hey Musstag...I know Dowsers that let the hands and wrist move all the time. They are good Dowsers. I don't allow my hands or wrists to move. There is a rod holder at http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,19537.0.html reply 9. This rod holder eliminates the Ideomotor Response as defined by most people. It may still be the mind that is controlling the rods but it is not by moving them with your arms and hands. There is a short clip on YouTube that shows the rod holder All you have to do is step on a coin...Art

 

[musstag]

Art, thats a great device, I will build me one, I also enjoyed the Video!! Thanks!! I'm glad I came back to this post and saw that. I came here to get (HeeHee, sorry I can't hep' it) everyone to go to www.amazon.com and key in the ISBN # 0595378285 into the search field.... its a kick!!
Something else, Art, I can't dowse good at night or late (heehee sorry, its still cracking me up) afternoon when dew is settling, is that usual? (hehehe Sorry, It just struck me as so funny, pro or con, thats funny, Everyone, be sure to take a look at Amazon.com)

 

[Carl-NC]

That book looks like a must-read... I'll have to order a copy!

The rods don't have to be over-bent. 90 degrees is fine. You should tilt them down a few degrees, to keep them from flopping around. I think it's been mentioned by many dowsers that they normally tilt rods downward 15 degrees or so. If you maintain this slightly downward tilt, the rods in the frame won't cross.

Art, it appears from the video that the right-hand rod (your right hand) is a little sluggish compared to the other rod. If so, this will make it very easy to get the rods to cross when you pull them up to a level position (or a positive tilt, as in the video).

I agree, how about a video of you holding the rods in the frame, tilted downward a few degrees, then stepping on a coin.

- Carl

 

[musstag]

Yep, thats quite a Tittle, you can do the ISBN search at www.bn.com and find the same, but with a customer review of the book. I was searching around for dowsing books, found a few, when I ran across this, and I can see the non-dowser, hitting the ceiling with "LOOK What Claims they have Come up with Now".... Its a little much for me as well, but... Any how, I have decided that ALL of us don't need to be dowsing, some good stuff would be found before I have a chance at it. Now I have learned some good points from this site. but I don't care whats thought about it so much, other than to learn something from the info people post. The Million BUCKS challange, yes I will look into, but I also believe it can be tampered with just as LRL's can be 'Jammed', as metioned by others. i also am testing a simple LRL, and that is enought for me, I can located gold with it, differnt methods somewhat that plain dowsing, but it works with the aid of a transmitter. I also have a metal detecor. I don't know enough electronics to prove jamming, but too me Its as simple as to say, a Gold-bug-2 can detect a gold nugget a few inches in the dirt, I think we ALL will agree on that, but a gold nugget doesn't stick to a magnet. My MD can tune out Iron Objects.... yet, in that setting, beep on solid gold, This type of performance was unheard of 50 years ago. So,Should we NOW close the PATENT Office, Any how Jamming, yes, it can be done. And if we can't explain non-electronic dowsing, or not do it correctly 10 of 10 tries, how do we know that in some way electronics, man made or natural is not a part of it!! or that it may alter its results!!! I am thrilled with doing it 2 times of 2 tries, in the 5 paper bag test!! any future test will use the bags 20 feet apart. It took a while and several attemps to make my choices to be sure, I think 8 feet was two close. I think at 8 feet the 45 degree angle of the target was making a reading near the adjoining bags. (Dowsers will know what I'm talking about)

OH, Art, the video asked for, I don;t know if they will cross as easy or not with your device, I will test it some day, but whats to say that some natural electrial resposne is not sent to make the hand or arm muscles twitch enought to make the rods cross over a target.... example if you grab both leads of a 120 volt live 2 wire circuit, YOUR MUSCLES will surely twitch!! (don't try that one at Home... hehehee)

AND while I'm in a good mood, I gotta tell ya'll this quick story, We kept our grandsons for two nites, while my son and his wife went on an over nite trip for the 10th wedding annv., He TOOK Her on a guided airboat NITE Swamp tour... and she Loved it!!!
Ok, enjoyed it ,I'll check ya later.

 

[aarthrj3811]

You guy's say that dowsing doesn't work because of Ideomotor Effects. If you would make the frame you would know for a fact if Ideomotor Effects were controlling the rods. I see nothing wrong with letting the ideomotor effects control the rods if it works for you. I choose not to let that part of my sub-conscious mind control my rods as it is wrong to often. This frame is a good tool for training you mind not to respond to the ideomotor response. Come on and tell me how you got the rods to cross while in the frame. I can't make them cross unless I am on a signal. Carl...The right rod was sluggish as I had just had a cast removed that morning and it hurt...The reason I didn't make a movie of them crossing is pretty simple...I didn't want to...I put this here for the Dowsers who want to learn more about their skills...

Musstag...Get a couple of bar magnets. Don't look at which pole your using. Put one of the magnets in your right hand with the rod. Step on a coin. Now put the other pole up and step on the coin. Put the magnet under you belt cross ways and try the coin. Try a magnet in both hands...Very interesting if your using non-magnetic rods ..Art

 

[musstag]

Art, SWR, I added a couple of topics to my previous post , several post above this one, so several of you may need to re-read by previous post. Ok, I'll try the magnets soon.

You, know what, that grabbing of live wire, its interesting that it will make the hands clinch the wires even harder that when you first grabbed them, a slight clinching of the hands will most likely make the L-rods cross if you are hold ing them. So a persons millivots reacting to gold might give the hands or arm muscles a twich.....!

 

[aarthrj3811]

If you have access to a volt meter that will read millivolts you can check the voltage between your hands. The rods seem to work better for those with around 100 millivolts. If you have a regular digital volt meter you can tell which hand is positive and which is negative. This works for most people but not all...Art

 

[jeff of pa]

Please to Keep the Peace here

Do not use, or Discuss "LRL" in the Dowsing Forum.

the Proper Terms here are "Dowsing Rod" "Coat Hanger"
"Forked Stick" "Thing on a String" Etc.

Electronic Devices, or anything that is Supposed to be Electronic,
are Not to be Discussed here.

Only Inexpensive, meaning "FREE" Devices.

Thanks

 

[jeff of pa]

I have no Problem with your Post beale.

This was Just a Comment, Because I don't want the thread to turn into an LRL thread, Forcing me to Delete it.

Yes Dowsing Rods are LRL's, However we all Know what Others Think of when LRL is posted.

and one of the Rules here is.

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,14075.0.html

This forum is limited to the discussion of simple, inexpensive (or FREE!) devices and techniques. That means NO discussion of electrical devices of any kind.? Feel free to discuss L-rods, Spanish dip needles, map dowsing, and other dowsing related subjects.

and Even tho the Electronics in LRL's are Not real.
they are also "not inexpensive (or FREE!) devices"

I Don't want to Take this Thread off Course.
So Feel Free to contact me Via PM if you have Fruther Concerns.

JEFF

 

[jeff of pa]

Where you's left off

If you have access to a volt meter that will read millivolts you can check the voltage between your hands. The rods seem to work better for those with around 100 millivolts. If you have a regular digital volt meter you can tell which hand is positive and which is negative. This works for most people but not all...Art

And If your Post Disappeared, Remember

Please From now on,

No mention that any Member who posts in the Dowsing forum,

Makes & sells Products.

This is Free advertising.

So if you suggest any Dowser here Makes (made) & or sells (sold) Anything,
your post Will Disappear.

I'm not open to Debate on this, So DON'T TRY.

Thank You
JEFF

 

[Captain Trips]

... it looks like the best advice to be given here is, unless you really do have super natural powers don't think you are good enough to win Carl Morland, or James Randi's, publicity gimmick. There is no precedent to prove that it can be won. Dell

As to this mis-understanding, it has already been answered. Of COURSE there is no precedent to prove it can be won -- no one who has attempted to win it was able to demonstrate being able to do what they claim they can do. And until someone steps forward and CAN do what they claim, then the prize will remain unwon.

I do wish you would stop referring to it as if it were a lottery. It is more like the Ansari X-Prize, a motivation for any and all to actually demonstrate any "para-normal" actions. And yes, dowsing DOES qualify -- read the JREF site, it is clearly specified. Just because you don't think it's "super-natural" doesn't mean they think that, so they will (repeat, WILL) pay out when someone actually comes forward and successfully dowses!

 

[Sandsted]

I don't see the advantage in using 2 rods. I only use one. Then one hand is free for sensor boards and markers and other tasks.

Also, once I get them, if you want them I can post pictures of things I've located through dowsing, but you wouldn't believe that anyway. Just last Thursday I went to a tractor show and I did some...something I'm trying to develope dowsing without rods, anyway I located 2 perculiar stones I'll post on here somewhere to get them identified. One has a deep groove all the way around the stone, actually 2 grooves, one is very large, then there is another above it that isn't so deep. I found another stone also that has 2 grooves but it doesn't go all the way around, just 3 sides of the stone.

I'll post pictures, anybody know anything about stones like this? These were also found in Central Minnesota if that is of aid.

 

[Captain Trips]

Capt. trips, You said you wanted to learn to Dowse. We shared information to help you get started. You showed no further interest in learning. What else can we do for you? Dell

And just how do you know I have "no further interest in learning?" You didn't share that information until AFTER I said I wanted to learn. Okay, thank you for sharing. You gave me the information, and I didn't bother posting anything again asking for it. (It would be like if I kept looking for something after I found it.) But how can you determine that I have no further interest? Have you been reading my mind? I thought you didn't have any para-normal abilities like that.

You want to know what you can do for me? You can provide me with proof that your method works. PROOF. Not anecdotes, not maybes. The best way to prove it is to take the JREF challenge, and win the money. Which you refuse to do, so why ask what else you can do for me? I've already answered THAT question, by starting this thread!

 

[Rich NY]

Anyone who is considering taking Randi's challenge should read this. http://www.psicounsel.com/marius/victims.htm I don't think it's worth it.

 

[Carl-NC]

I don't think it's worth it.

The prize is a million bucks, and to see if Randi will agree to a reasonable test proposal all you need to do is fill out an application. Doesn't seem to be an overwhelming effort, and you have absolutely nothing to loose.

 

[musstag]

Can you use an LRL in Randis' test, or only Carls? I thought Carls was LRL and Randis was without the aid of special devices. L-rods would be allowed in both, right?. It seems to me that special steps need to be installed by the Dowser against jamming of various sorts, and Rands is surely work the effort, but I find it much more easy with an LRL, So I'm thinking of Carls test.
BUT I would want to consider this for Randis test also.
I have a 15 bag test in mind, in a nutshell, 10 of them Carl would controll, the doswer assistant would control the other 5, and 3 would have an identical targets in them. ( 1 in the 10 bags and 2 of the Dowser 5 bags) Switching his 5 in and out from behind the Test target, as the dowser operator focuses on that one of the 10 targets. The assistant would make the call, as only he would know when he has 2 of his dud (no target in it) bags next to the Prize target and what the dowsers reading was. If he leaves one of his goldbags at the target and the reading is dropped or gone, then HE Knows a foul or interferance of some type has occurred.

 

[Carl-NC]

Randi's challenge is broad and includes anything he considers paranormal... ESP, telekinesis, remote viewing, levitation, spoon bending, etc... and dowsing. Randi considers any kind of "looks like a duck" LRL devices to be dowsing, and will accept them for the challenge. You don't have to believe it is dowsing, Randi doesn't care.

My challenge is primarily for commercial LRL devices, and is really targeted at the manufacturers of those devices, not the average user. However, I will allow anyone to apply, including ordinary dowsers. But I do limit the challenge to discrete mineral samples, preferably gold. I don't test water dowsers, because I don't have the facility or the money to do it fairly.

 

[ClonedSIM]

So, Dell, do you admit that your seeking methods are akin to random guessing?

 

[aarthrj3811]

Hey AF....Can you tell me where I can get all the information on Random Guessing? Is there some kind of rules or laws of physics that are followed?...Art