🥇 BANNER Back in the Game - 1875-CC Twenty-Cent Piece!

Silver Tree Chaser

Bronze Member
Joined
Aug 12, 2012
Messages
1,371
Reaction score
2,993
Golden Thread
8
🥇 Banner finds
8
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Although I had been out detecting often enough, my finds so far this year had come slowly - a trickle off several corroded coppers over the past few months and a worn-out Barber dime. One of the coppers found a few weeks ago was particularly bittersweet; it was a 1795 or 1797 Liberty Cap half cent with lettered edging. Sorry - I didn’t have the heart to post it. Mother Nature and long exposure to New England’s acidic soil had done its worst to Ms. Liberty. Despite my best hopes, the corrosion was too much. :sad1:

On my last outing, I made one stop at an old mill site that offered nothing but a lamp top and hunks of ferrous material. I left after an hour or so. Lately, I’ve had some difficulty in scouting for new promising sites, but the sparse finds at the mill prompted me to try for new prospects. Back in 2017, I had recovered a rare Native American pewter trade pipe from the 17th century in a wooded area that surrounded a later-period barn site. Sadly, much of the area had been recently lost to a new residential development, :sadsmiley: but an adjacent property looked equally promising. I had stopped by several weeks before to enquire about permission, but had to follow-up for a definitive answer. I felt some reluctance as I knocked on the front door owing to my appearance after digging earlier in the damp thickets surrounding the mill site. Covered in dirt, I only needed an orange jumpsuit and the sound of approaching bloodhounds to present the perfect image of an escaped convict. Happily, the property owners remembered my prior visit and were very welcoming. They kindly gave me permission and wished me luck. :sunny:

I wasn’t expecting much in my search. I was just happy to be searching near the approximate area where I had recovered the pewter trade pipe two years earlier. After recovering only one plain button after a half-hour or so, I dug for a signal near an intersection of stone walls. Surprisingly, a Victorian-Period cufflink with gold gilt and a glass stone came out of the hole. It was missing its clasp end, but I soon found that as well only 12” away.

P6190661.webp

Instinctively, I searched further around the immediate area and came upon a solid signal (90 on the Deus) just a few feet away. I cut out a thick plug and pinpointed a clump of soil that produced a large silver coin. It had been a while since I’ve seen anything like that! I glanced at the dirt covered coin and could see a Seated Liberty figure. I was very happy having recovered my third Liberty Seated quarter in 30 years of detecting – or so I thought. I went on searching and recovered a 19th century tractor part, i.e., an ox shoe, an odd round disc of brittle pewter, and little else worth mentioning. The property owners were wonderful. I showed them what I had recovered and was invited into their home – straight to the kitchen sink to rinse the Liberty Seated quarter for a better look. I could barely discern the apparent date of 1875 on the coin. I was kindly invited to return another day to search further.

Upon returning home, I delayed examining the coin until I could do so with my 10-year-old son Matthew. When the time came, I grabbed a lamp and magnifying glass and explained to him the particulars of identifying old US coins. I verified that the date was 1875 and looked for the all-important mint mark, which was CC for Carson City, Nevada. I suggested that my son look for the mint mark as well by looking beneath the eagle on the coin’s reverse. Now I’m the king of wishful thinking :icon_king:, and I thought that the size of the coin looked a bit off. I had one or two fleeting thoughts of a 20-cent piece when first recovered but dismissed such notions as nothing more than a wishful thinking. Oblivious to the odd appearance of the eagle, (I think I was quite tired by the end of the day), I pointed out to my son that the mint mark was above the “cents” located near the coin’s rim – “CENTS” on a supposed “QUAR. DOL.” coin. I finally got it when I saw “TWENTY.” :idea1: I said to my son, “Oh my god, this coin is a twenty-cent piece!” My son replied in disappointment, “Wait a minute - this coin is only worth 20-cents?” :icon_scratch: I explained that it was the coin’s face value and then showed him its collector value in an old copy of Red Book.

P6190817.webp

P6190787.webp

I didn’t hesitate at cleaning the coin with a brief cook of electrolysis – 30 seconds on each side of the coin and an extra 30 seconds on the coin’s reverse. I was very happy with the results and the coin’s overall appearance – no significant scratches or dings and just enough “LIBERTY” visible on the shield.

P6190833.webp

P6190852.webp

The twenty-cent piece coin was only minted for circulation for two years – 1875 & 1876; it’s the shortest lived denomination of all US coins. A few hundred were minted as proof coins in 1877 & 1878. The coins quickly became unpopular with the public, as the coin was easily confused with the quarter due to its identical liberty image and similar size, and I totally agree. It fooled me for a while, and I couldn’t be happier to have been mistaken! So I didn’t find my third Liberty Seated quarter in 30 years of detecting, but that’s fine by me. :icon_thumleft:

Good Hunting!
 

Last edited:
Upvote 161
CoinFetcher:

The edge is plain and smooth like a modern nickel. The difference between a smooth and reeded edge was not enough to satisfy the public, and I can see why in the below images comparing the twenty-cent piece and the quarter - identical obverse and similar reverse with slight variation in size. :icon_thumright:

View attachment 1726810
Which one is the quarter? :icon_scratch: Not as easy as it looks if you can't make a side-by-side comparison.

View attachment 1726812
Similar eagle design on the reverse.

View attachment 1726811


Another odd thing I noticed is that "LIBERTY" is embossed in the shield opposed to debossed on all the other seated Liberties. More of a plain, block font also.

Once again, spectacular.
 

Another odd thing I noticed is that "LIBERTY" is embossed in the shield opposed to debossed on all the other seated Liberties. More of a plain, block font also.

Once again, spectacular.

Sandchip - Great eye. Yes, the "LIBERTY" is raised; consequently, the grading standards for wear on the "LIBERTY" is less stringent by one grade. A condition of Fine with all the other denominations equals Very Fine for the twenty-cent piece. Thanks so much for the banner vote. :icon_thumleft:
 

Congrat's on some fantastic saves of History. Really cleaned up well with lot's of detail.

Thank you very much. I received a PM asking about the details on treating the coin, which I will post soon enough.
 

That medallion is awesome!! Looks exactly like my avatar, which, believe it or not, I found on Good Friday in 2004, right across the street from an old church- meant so much to me I had it tattooed on my arm! As for the Pine Tree Shilling, I had made a promise to the homeowner that we'd sell and split anything significant- obviously that beauty was significant! I asked if he'd take cash and let me keep the coin since I am a collector, but he had no idea of its value and wanted no part of it- so I kept my word, had it certified and sold it at a Heritage auction- just under 2K. Made the 2009 W & E Finds of the year issue- pretty cool. PM me, I have some info to share.... Jeff

I don't know about you, but giving this kind of thing up has always been tough for me. If it's not too personal, can you reveal what Heritage's percentage fee was? I've always felt that auction houses are taking way too much of the profit for the work they perform. And you should never get a piece certified from the same A. house that will list the item.
Thanks.
 

Thank you very much. I received a PM asking about the details on treating the coin, which I will post soon enough.

Great find and you have a nice spot for a long time. I was just going to ask about your technique of cleaning, and I was wondering if any kind of cleaning detracts from intrinsic value or auction value. If one is never going to sell it, then it would just be for their enjoyment and display and value wouldn't be a thing but bragging rights.

GL and hope to see more coming out of that great place.
 

QUOTE=Huntster54;6233624]Great find and you have a nice spot for a long time. I was just going to ask about your technique of cleaning, and I was wondering if any kind of cleaning detracts from intrinsic value or auction value. If one is never going to sell it, then it would just be for their enjoyment and display and value wouldn't be a thing but bragging rights.

GL and hope to see more coming out of that great place.[/QUOTE]

Huntster54 — I only use an electrolysis setup with a power adapter for cleaning coins; I’m unfamiliar with the technique using aluminum foil. I read online that a 6 -12 volts D.C. output is entirely sufficient. I simply took a power supply cord for a radio charger, stripped the wires, and attached alligator clips. I use a galvanized bolt for the anode (do not use stainless steel as an anode). I avoid attaching an alligator clip directly to the coin (cathode) to avoid any scratching; rather, the clip is attached to a flat spiral of stripped copper wire, similar to the much larger a coil on an older-style electric stove top. I fasten the coin to the spiral of copper wire with a wooden clothes line pin. Water with baking soda works well for the required electrolyte solution. The twenty-piece required 30 seconds on each side and an additional 30 seconds on the coin’s reverse as the buildup of toning was a bit heavier. After a minute or so, remove the coin from the solution and gently rub the coin with mineral oil and tissue/Kleenex. The results are amazing as the toning wipes easily off the coin. :hello2: The removal of dark toning by mechanical means would usually require scouring with baking soda paste. As seen in the provided photos of before and after images of a Liberty Seated dime with heavy, dark toning, the coin’s appearance is returned to a silver luster without any trace of wear to the coin after treatment. The use of mineral oil, which a detecting buddy suggested, results in a dull sheen to the silver in contrast to the harsh appearance of overly bright silver resulting in the use of a different solution for the final wiping the coin.

Before electrolysis treatment -

PB170375_01.webp PB170378_01.webp

After electrolysis treatment -

PB170383.webp PB170398.webp

I hope this information helps.
 

Outstanding find, CC coins are great pieces.....
 

breathtaking find.......worth celebrating a whole week

:occasion14:
 

Thank you that helped a lot.
I also noticed something else about your 20 center. Due to my tendency to look for error coins and defects, the claws of the 20 of the Eagle are not gripping the arrows but sitting on top of the objects, like the coin designer had done the eagle first then had to add the arrows after. Not that it's an error, but it's an detail that can make identifying a coin important for like limited issues and things.
Like on another more modern quarter, the eagles tail feathers rounded rather than sharp edged denotes a limited run and more valuable collection item.

It's interesting when compared side by side like sandchip had illustrated.

Now if you find another 20 center and the claws surround the arrows, you may have something even more valuable. Who knows, but I didn't really know about 20 cent coins either.
 

Last edited:
Thank you that helped a lot.
I also noticed something else about your 20 center. Due to my tendency to look for error coins and defects, the claws of the 20 of the Eagle are not gripping the arrows but sitting on top of the objects, like the coin designer had done the eagle first then had to add the arrows after. Not that it's an error, but it's an detail that can make identifying a coin important for like limited issues and things.
Like on another more modern quarter, the eagles tail feathers rounded rather than sharp edged denotes a limited run and more valuable collection item.

It's interesting when compared side by side like sandchip had illustrated.

Now if you find another 20 center and the claws surround the arrows, you may have something even more valuable. Who knows, but I didn't really know about 20 cent coins either.

Thanks so much for the comment. I can't discern much of a difference with my untrained eyes, but I'll keep your observation in mind.
 

Still Outstanding!!! Congrats!!!
 

.....and yet another one in a million find! Congratulations (again!) [emoji6]
 

Another odd thing I noticed is that "LIBERTY" is embossed in the shield opposed to debossed on all the other seated Liberties. More of a plain, block font also.

Once again, spectacular.

'Without Zooming '
I noticed "Liberty" on the shield looked ? Different???
 

QUOTE=Huntster54;6233624]Great find and you have a nice spot for a long time. I was just going to ask about your technique of cleaning, and I was wondering if any kind of cleaning detracts from intrinsic value or auction value. If one is never going to sell it, then it would just be for their enjoyment and display and value wouldn't be a thing but bragging rights.

GL and hope to see more coming out of that great place.

Huntster54 — I only use an electrolysis setup with a power adapter for cleaning coins; I’m unfamiliar with the technique using aluminum foil. I read online that a 6 -12 volts D.C. output is entirely sufficient. I simply took a power supply cord for a radio charger, stripped the wires, and attached alligator clips. I use a galvanized bolt for the anode (do not use stainless steel as an anode). I avoid attaching an alligator clip directly to the coin (cathode) to avoid any scratching; rather, the clip is attached to a flat spiral of stripped copper wire, similar to the much larger a coil on an older-style electric stove top. I fasten the coin to the spiral of copper wire with a wooden clothes line pin. Water with baking soda works well for the required electrolyte solution. The twenty-piece required 30 seconds on each side and an additional 30 seconds on the coin’s reverse as the buildup of toning was a bit heavier. After a minute or so, remove the coin from the solution and gently rub the coin with mineral oil and tissue/Kleenex. The results are amazing as the toning wipes easily off the coin. :hello2: The removal of dark toning by mechanical means would usually require scouring with baking soda paste. As seen in the provided photos of before and after images of a Liberty Seated dime with heavy, dark toning, the coin’s appearance is returned to a silver luster without any trace of wear to the coin after treatment. The use of mineral oil, which a detecting buddy suggested, results in a dull sheen to the silver in contrast to the harsh appearance of overly bright silver resulting in the use of a different solution for the final wiping the coin.

Before electrolysis treatment -

View attachment 1729327 View attachment 1729328

After electrolysis treatment -

View attachment 1729329 View attachment 1729330

I hope this information helps.[/QUOTE]

These coins look great to me , I do wonder what "Opinion" the grading Co's would have . I despise "details" labels.
Thanks for sharing.
 

Huntster54 — I only use an electrolysis setup with a power adapter for cleaning coins; I’m unfamiliar with the technique using aluminum foil. I read online that a 6 -12 volts D.C. output is entirely sufficient. I simply took a power supply cord for a radio charger, stripped the wires, and attached alligator clips. I use a galvanized bolt for the anode (do not use stainless steel as an anode). I avoid attaching an alligator clip directly to the coin (cathode) to avoid any scratching; rather, the clip is attached to a flat spiral of stripped copper wire, similar to the much larger a coil on an older-style electric stove top. I fasten the coin to the spiral of copper wire with a wooden clothes line pin. Water with baking soda works well for the required electrolyte solution. The twenty-piece required 30 seconds on each side and an additional 30 seconds on the coin’s reverse as the buildup of toning was a bit heavier. After a minute or so, remove the coin from the solution and gently rub the coin with mineral oil and tissue/Kleenex. The results are amazing as the toning wipes easily off the coin. :hello2: The removal of dark toning by mechanical means would usually require scouring with baking soda paste. As seen in the provided photos of before and after images of a Liberty Seated dime with heavy, dark toning, the coin’s appearance is returned to a silver luster without any trace of wear to the coin after treatment. The use of mineral oil, which a detecting buddy suggested, results in a dull sheen to the silver in contrast to the harsh appearance of overly bright silver resulting in the use of a different solution for the final wiping the coin.

Before electrolysis treatment -

View attachment 1729327 View attachment 1729328

After electrolysis treatment -

View attachment 1729329 View attachment 1729330

I hope this information helps.

These coins look great to me , I do wonder what "Opinion" the grading Co's would have . I despise "details" labels.
Thanks for sharing.[/QUOTE]

This ultra-rare Willow Tree shilling was dug from a garden in Plymouth, MA, years ago. It was sold at auction without any type of treatment for its dark, uneven toning. It was slabbed as a no grade - VF details and environmental damage. The winning bid was $37K. These shillings usually go for six-figures. Grading services, don’t clean a coin, and all that other advice? No thanks. A coin needs eye appeal more so than some third-party opinion about a coin’s appearance and adhering to conventional wisdom about cleaning coins.

0456c_1652_Willow_Tree_Shilling_PCGS_Genuine_VF_Dtls_32589_l[1].webp
 

Last edited:
@Silver tree - I definitely believe that electrolysis is the true way to go. I think a lot of the pre conditioned thought about cleaning coins is using physical means such as a stiff scouring brush or even steel wool.
I've seen people do this and arguably ruin their coin value by leaving scratches and haze of fine burnishing. You cannot deny that if you had a uncirculated coin and you clean it (why they would is beyond me) stupidly with abrasives and leave a rubbed finish, it's no longer uncirculated. That's an extreme example of course, but the thinking isn't all archaic.

However with proper electrolysis the argument can be made that no metal of the original coin is effected. The treatment removes particles due to the solutions attempt to transfer metal. But electrolysis does transfer metal as in baby shoe plating. But that's all acids and sulfuric chemicals with higher amps. Remember that? My first home biz was plating shoes and mementos, even leaves and bugs. So you're quick zap probably would improve the value of the item.

But I will say this, I always cringe when I see someone pull a coin or ring and start rubbing the dirt off right there to get a better look at it. THAT could permanently mar your find. I put things in my pouch without rubbing or handling any more than I have to get it put away.
If I think I have something valuable, the pouch gets dumped into a sink with hot water and dish soap. That's it, and I use the sink spray to clean things. My laundry tub is set up for this.
I will be setting up a small electrolysis spot as soon as I get my basement sorted out from our recent move to a new house. My old set was a Wagner I think and would be 40 years old today. I have an old working Lyonel train power unit that I think could work.
 

Last edited:
Twenty center is one coin that has eluded me for 50 years! That is an AWESOME find!
 

An ultra rare find - a big congrats !
 

Top Member Reactions

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top Bottom