Do Long Time Buried Objects Detect Deeper?

[Michigan Badger]

I tested my DeLeon in the coin garden when it was new and I was totally disappointed.

However, after using it for some 50 hours I'm constantly saying to myself "How did it reach this?"

Now that I'm doing foundations and ghost towns I'm working over deep grass and digging deeper than ever. I'm finding bullets (30-06, 30-30, etc.) at depths of 7 to 10 inches. Have you ever seen how small a 30-06 bullet is when flattened?

My experience in field has shown me that long time buried objects detect much deeper than air or even coin garden tests. And I believe this is so no matter what brand VLF machine you use.

From what I've seen so far this summer, when it comes to coin garden testing, you can figure at least 50% more depth for long time buried silver and at least double for copper. With very old iron you can figure triple or more the depth of fresh buried pieces.

Last year I used the Minelab Excalibur 1000. I could only detect a freshly buried copper penny at about 5 3/4 inches. Later I dug an old wheat cent (ca. 1920's) at 9 inches with a loud signal (landfill area). The coin was badly corroded.

Well, what do you say?

 

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[Lowbatts]

hollowpointred, I can't resist telling you how NOT to take the corrosion off coins. The first really good coin that I found was a 1809 large cent. My buddy sounded on it with my old Garrett. We were totally noobies. He says "come over here, I got a good signal!".

I take my cz over the hole and pinpointed it and pulled it out. It was about 5" deep. We didnt know what it was, but we could see 1809 on it. The coin was so strange to us. We didn't know jack diddly poo about old coins or anything about the hobby. Anyway, we took it over to my dad's sandblaster and cleaned it up real good. That's after I bought the red book and found out what it really was. Much wiser now.


It "was" an 1809 large cent, good condition.

Yeah, but it's a prettier large cent now, right?
For the most part with no stats available, I'm guessing that the dug coins we find are so seldom in the quality range to bring a good price, clean 'em or not is dependent on whether or not you want to show them off or scrap them.

The fact that "dug" coins were not a very respected part of the numismatic community not so long ago as an aside.

It does however pay to know the raw value of a find before making any decision. But to think you're gonna go md'ing to get saleable coins to begin with may be a bit more dreamy than realistic.

 

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[gleaner1]

I didn't really mean the 1809 coin cleaned up real nice, we totally ruined it of course.

It's too bad about the low chances of finding really good condition coins. Out of about 200 silvers that I found, I can only think of about 3 or 4 that I dug in MS condition. One is a 43 merc that really is outstanding with full split bands, no scratches, absolutely mint. I also got a 1911 Canada dime, absolutely mint, except I scratched it, and I kick myself in the arse every time I look at it. I have found a couple barber dimes in very near MS condition. So, I guess about one in 50 silver coins will come out really nice.

Sorry about getting off track from the original subject. I'm thinking of a good topic for the next post. Maybe this is a good topic, to get an idea of past finds of really nice MS silver??

 

[Michigan Badger]

Michigan Badger, sorry if I sounded off-key about LuckyLarry's reply to my post Wet vs Dry. No offense intended to either you or LL.

Don't worry about offending me. I don't even view this (or any other) forum that way anymore.

Most of us don't even know one another anyway. And too, that's probably a good thing

The internet is mostly used for information and when I can I share a little too.

I liked your statements about hunting dry soil.

MB

 

[Michigan Badger]

I didn't really mean the 1809 coin cleaned up real nice, we totally ruined it of course.

It's too bad about the low chances of finding really good condition coins. Out of about 200 silvers that I found, I can only think of about 3 or 4 that I dug in MS condition. One is a 43 merc that really is outstanding with full split bands, no scratches, absolutely mint. I also got a 1911 Canada dime, absolutely mint, except I scratched it, and I kick myself in the arse every time I look at it. I have found a couple barber dimes in very near MS condition. So, I guess about one in 50 silver coins will come out really nice.

Sorry about getting off track from the original subject. I'm thinking of a good topic for the next post. Maybe this is a good topic, to get an idea of past finds of really nice MS silver??

Don't worry about getting off topic...it's a way of life around here.

The biggest mistake THers make is rubbing the dirt off their fresh dug coins. You can see this all the time up in Today's Finds. You see the telltale scratches on the coin which lower it in value anywhere from 50% to 90% (or so).

Smart diggers carry a cotton lined box in which to place potentially valuable coins. When home they place the coin in water and allow the dirt to just fall off.

As for your sandblasted LC, ha! I've done a lot worse. Ever try hydrochloric acid?

Lots of finders blast the crap out of their otherwise beautiful LC's using electrolysis. They come out looking like the surface of the moon and to most collectors--worthless (other than early types but even these are reduced in value).

There is a "dug coin" collector group today and they go for that "lost coin" corroded look.

MB

 

[Jason in TN]

The Halo effect on Iron Yes Gold, Silver and Copper it just aint gona happen enough for a metal detector to pick it up.
A detector will not pick up the amount of metal that would leach out of a gold silver or copper object. Some body prove this to be wrong.
All you have to do is leach some metal out of copper or silver and then show us that your detector will pick it up.

 

[Michigan Badger]

The Halo effect on Iron Yes Gold, Silver and Copper it just aint gona happen enough for a metal detector to pick it up.
A detector will not pick up the amount of metal that would leach out of a gold silver or copper object. Some body prove this to be wrong.
All you have to do is leach some metal out of copper or silver and then show us that your detector will pick it up.

Good post.

I doubt many experienced hunters even believe in the so-called "halo" effect anymore. This was really big throughout the 90's and some still hold to it but it can be easily disproved.

For starters, just because an object is somewhat larger doesn't mean it always will detect significantly deeper. I have tested this many times and with some brand machines a nickle will detect as deeply as a silver half dollar. My Nautilus IIB loves the copper alloy and will detect a copper penny as deeply as a silver dollar.

One can even demonstrate these things in air tests.

This subject has been argued over and over and over again since the beginning of this forum. In actual ground tests there is no such thing as a "halo" affect.

What has happened is guys have dug rusted away cans, etc., and seen the darkened soil were the original can was and this gave them the idea of a leaching bigger target.

Depth is determined by conductivity, solid physical size, soil analysis, moisture, and presence of trash metals.

Under perfect conditions a detect will get it's air distance in the ground. The distance a machine can air test is its maximum buried target depth.

For instance, my Nautilus IIB with 10" coil can detect a copper penny at about 14-16 inches by air test (subject to settings). This then would be its absolute maximum possible depth on a buried penny. However, in the real world things are rarely ideal. To get 14-16 inches I'd have to find a long time buried copper penny in mild soil with no nearby trash in very wet soil. This just doesn't happen all that much.

In the real world I'm looking at a depth of maybe 10 inches. This is due to some level of discrimination, ground masking trash, and mineralized soil.

 

[BuckleBoy]

Man! this thread was started back in 06!   Youse guys sure like the oldies.

Not really. A member brought this thread back to life who has a personal vendetta against SWR. I do not know why the “moderator” allows such personal attacks, anyways.

Tnet Member Rusted Iron, where are you?  You're the only one who has ever Successfully shut SWR down.   

Nobody “shut SWR down” in this thread, as it is/was as an exchange of ideas, thoughts and personal opinions.

At the end of the day, it is all just speculation. There is no hardcore scientific data (with peer-review) that supports what we do with our metal detectors (pro or con) when it comes to these types of discussions.

Will my Bounty Hunter, Fisher, Compass or Minelab detect ions that are supposedly escaping from buried coins or jewelry?

Nope. But then again...i'm not shut down or leaving TreasureNet with a pacifier in tow   

SWR, I have absolutely No vendetta against you.  I found this post and thought it was entertaining and unusual, because you are Usually Right in what you post, and your opinions are well-justified and well-defended.  But in the case of this thread...  


I just thought it was a fun post to read--so I bumped it.    



No offense meant--and hopefully none taken.

But you need to recant the Pacifier part, my friend. No jabs given--and Certainly none needed!




-Buckles

 

[LuckyLarry]

excal, a bit off-subject but (maybe) somehow (extremely) remotely related...


The reason gorillas have big nostrils...

is because they have big fingers.

Gorillas that is, but not humans.

My daughter told me that one.



LL

 

[NGE]

Oh I am going to get myself into trouble with this reply. Has anyone studied the phases of the moon in relation to the better signals produced? Back when Fisher first introduced the first of the 1260-X machines, I bought one, as well as the people I was hunting with at the time. We noticed that when the moon was ( full ) and still in the sky during the daytime, that we would get better signals on coins and jewelry, than any other time of the month, wet or dry soil. We started to study this occurrence. we found that the same areas that produced no significant ( or very weak ) signals, would give better signals two days before, ,during ,and after a full moon. So we started looking for answers, of course everyone we told of our theory, thought we were NUTS! But when we went to our good spots, we would not go until the conditions were right. When the conditions were not right, we would go anyways, just to prove to ourselves that there just may be some truth to what we discovered. Since then I have read, that geologists will tell you that large rocks deep in the ground, can move up to 2 feet from the gravitational pull of the full moon, so we figured that if something that heavy can move that far, why not small coins? After all, they are much lighter, I have no doubt that they don't move that far, but why not an inch or two? Look what the moon does to the tides. This still works for me, even with my My-nelab XS. Try it sometime in the secrecy of your secret areas, away from who is hunting with you, after all, you wouldn't want to be called a nutcase ........NGE

 

[extractor]