Gold Bars and Beaches

[Cappy Z.]

This is an open question for anyone from psychics to scientists, from idiot savants to scholastic geniuses...

How far up onto a beach would a hurricane or multiple hurricanes toss gold bars?

Are hurricanes strong enough toss gold bars over the dunes?

Thanks.

Happy Thanksgiving.

 

[petersra]

I have been to a beach in Maine, that is angled just right and the waves from Nor'easter come sweeping right up the cove. At the end of the beach is a 50 foot high pile of softball size rounded rocks. The waves push them in during winter storms. As I stood there and watched the small waves coming in at the time I was there, I could see small pebbles dancing in the surf. I think Gold is about 1200 lb/cf and rocks are about 120 lb/cf so it is a tough comparison between the two. Could waves be strong enough to throw gold bars over the dunes I wouldn't think so, but I guess it is possible. I guess it also depends on how high the dunes are. Maybe someone with an engineering mind could do a calculation of the force of hurricane force wind driven waves crashing into the beach. If the waves can move gold bars, I guess it can move them wherever it wants to. Good luck in your quest. HH. Ralph

 

[Cappy Z.]

Dear Petersra,

Thank you very much for responding. Your information is quite valuable to me. I have studied the processes of liquefaction and thyxotropic physics. Your attentiveness is appreciated.

I hope you had a great Thanksgiving.

Cap Z.

 

[47thelement]

I was with you right up until you said "thank you for responding". After that you just sounded like another treasure hunter.

 

[Aka Nameless]

Standard gold bar the U.S. uses weighs about 30 pounds each. Wind isn't moving those things.

 

[Smoogle]

A 6-20ft wave will almost certainly, depending on bottom contours, carry a lip weighing from 1 ton upwards and that is across a small section, when it smacks into the shallow sand a mere 10kg will be tossed easily - but not cartoon style to the dry sand, I'm 78 kg and surf regularly and I get tossed but not over the closest dune! Mind you it would be ok if that happened because scantily clad women frequent all areas where I hunt, they are in the dunes by droves... and everywhere I don't hunt too .
Boulders on the end of the beach have progressed / shaped / moved / etc/ over thousands / millions of years. The earth is old and the metals we detect are new.
My 20c

 

[ivan salis]

cappy z , i would think that hurricane type winds * (and the huge waves that go along with them) which caused most of the shipwrecks of ships carrying said gold bars . would be more than strong enough to push the ships riding on said waves over a sand dune --case in point for proof is the survivors account of the hurricane that struck the 1556 fleet at pensacola where hurricane strength waves drove a vessel ashore deep into the treeline according to the survivors records of the event.

nuff said

 

[Cappy Z.]

cappy z , i would think that hurricane type winds * (and the huge waves that go along with them) which caused most of the shipwrecks of ships carrying said gold bars . would be more than strong enough to push the ships riding on said waves over a sand dune --case in point for proof is the survivors account of the hurricane that struck the 1556 fleet at pensacola where hurricane strength waves drove a vessel ashore deep into the treeline according to the survivors records of the event.

nuff said

Thanks guys. Ivan I am talking not US gold bars but the smaller Spanish bars. I know coins have been found inland side of the dunes..question is how far up onto the beach would a gold bar be tossed? When the eye of the hurricane hits the beach..the water and sand have by then churned to the point only the bedrock stays in place. During the churning I wonder how far near the dunes heavier metals come to rest. We know heavier stuff tends to be on the bottom.

 

[stevemc]

If a gold bar was in a ship, and it wrecked in shallow water, and there was a sand bottom, or reefy bottom, it would either be blown ashore with the ship, or go to the bottom and work its way through the sand quickly, to hit bedrock. Like lead, it is very heavy, and its shape is not so that would catch the water well. I say unless it was a smooth hard bottom, and the waves were very large, exceptionally large, it would most likely stay where it was dropped, on bedrock. Things like sounding weights and lead bars, and gold bars are found on the bedrock. Not on a beach. Unless the whole wreck was deposited on the beach, or the bedrock is smooth and goes up to the beach. Even with the last part about smooth bedrock, it is unlikely to move it.

 

[ron lord]

1 cubic foot of Gold, weight 735 lb. 250 lb of Gold is not the same as 250 lbs of man . A Gold bar is not the same as a round Rock. Hurricane wind or wave can't move Gold Bars. If a tidelwave 1000 feet high a Gold Bar it might move it 2 to 3 feet and would bury it deeper in the sand.But pick up the put it over the sand dune ,No way . Gold is very Dense thus very heavy.

 

[Aurora64blue]

Good question Cap Z

I would tend to agree with Ron Lord on this one. The high density of gold, and the rather compact shape of a Gold Bar wouldn't lend itself to be able to be picked up by wave action. A coin is flat and gives the wave a large area per capita to move it, much like a human body. I would think that a very large wave might be able to move it a few feet maybe but it would then just quickly sink back down to the bedrock layers once again. But, if there ever was a wave big enough to move such an object up onto the beach, it would probably move all of the sand in the water right up onto that same beach as well.

And as for that gold bar, well it would find itself once again covered with 10 feet of new sand.

Ralph

 

[ivan salis]

spanish gold from treasure fleets is exactly what I was talking about --the wood hulled treasure vessels that carried the smaller gold bars , carried inshore on the huge waves caused by hurricanes * depending upon the wind direction , wave size and vessel size and how much it was carrying (depth /draft of the vessel) and the size of the sand dune at the time --it could have been blown over the top of a sand dune * the spanish colony fleet (1556) that was supposed to set up at pensacola (florida) was wrecked by a hurricane --one of their vessels was recorded to have been blown a good ways inshore by the storm. --so yes it is possible in my veiw that a spanish treasure vessel carrying smaller gold bars of the type the spanish made known as "finger bars" -- so called finger bars of gold could be washed ashore a good bit along with the vessel or wreckage debris from a vessel ( like a person's private wooden chest or such)

 

[finderzzs]

In Hawaii, there are giant boulders weighing tons, UP on the coastal ledge 20-30 feet above the water. S I would think it easy to toss around a gold bar under the right circumstances.

 

[bigscoop]

It would be something like - Mass & Surface area VS the/enough pressure of a liquid force (none compressible). So, since we're actually talking hydraulics here, the answer would be "yes". It would be possible under the right circumstances, but probably not all that likely in general. In other words, a lot of "freak" natural circumstances would probably have to be in place in order to create enough force and angle to toss something so dense very far.

 

[SharkHunter]

In Hawaii, there are giant boulders weighing tons, UP on the coastal ledge 20-30 feet above the water. S I would think it easy to toss around a gold bar under the right circumstances.

I would think that they were there when the island was formed

 

[stpauli914]

I don't think you have to worry about Spanish gold bars making their way over the dunes due to wave action. During Spains recovery efforts of the sunken treasure galleons, many salvors CARRIED gold bars over the dunes and buried them so they could return later and salvage them for themselves instead of Spain. Many of those gold bars/coins/treasure/Jewelry etc. still lie buried somewhere "over the dunes". There are also salvors camps that have been discovered where loot has been found.

If that doesn't keep you dreaming.....

Aaron

 

[oxbowbarefoot]

The waves might not need to move the gold. The waves just need to move the sand and gravel around the gold, gravity might do the rest. Also, wet pebbles work like a lubricant under large objects. Maybe a wave can push a gold bar over wet, loose gravel. Of course, it would be sinking deeper and deeper the whole time.

 

[Cappy Z.]

Thanks y'all.

I remember reading how Kip Wagner's cabin had to be moved back a hundred feet or more...this would indicate the old dune line is now under the beach. I suspect there might be a treasure trove located in specific spots.

 

[Randyd]

using a dredge for gold, rocks go right up the hose along with the sand, etc. when you get down to bedrock, sometimes you can see nuggets as small as 1/4" sitting there. You can use your hand to move them and the nozzle will pick them up. (but then you hope it went all the way and doesn't drop out once you point the nozzle down again. the point is that gold is heavy and it takes a lot to move it.

If this same size gold is in the overburden, you won't see it, but it will go right up the hose and you will find it in your box.
So maybe if the gold was in rocks, clay, etc and a hurricane moved all of it , it could move along with tons of other material.
As for going up and over a sand dune, I don't see how. Were the dunes deposited later?
R

 

[trsrseeker]

All depends what the gold is attached to. The way I see it, in the right circumstances the right hurricane could put anything in its path over the dune line.