Now that you have Hi-Jacked this thread..and disinegrated into a boring debate over dry facts and allegations. The damage is done. but I will continue hoping that this will be the end of this Academia vs the Real World debate.
lamar..you wrote..
Dear rangler;
Please, do not get so excited my overly compassionate friend. I was merely attempting to illuminate the terrain in which you currently find yourself traversing. Oddly enough, every statement that I have made is steeped in richly documented history, yet there seems to be a disporportionately large number of people who refuse to believe the facts at hand and they instead would rather believe something entirely different.
Well Lamar that does nothing to dispell my retort that secret agreements are still secret, even from your keen and far reaching research that you clearly are passionate about your self,,and over passionate as well when it comes to protecting and the deeds and or reputation of the Church, its minions and its 'adventures'.
It pains me to see you so distraught, my obviously very excitable friend. You've asked that I depart from this topic in no uncertain terms and I, being in a charitable mood tonight, wish to negotiate the terms of my withdrawl.
You Sir are mistaken in the thought that you perceive me as distraught, what you see is incredulousness, misdiagnosed! That is firmly anchored deep in the decades of hands on, boots on research out in the real world, not the cloistered ivory towers of Academe.
I only wish I could teleport you to the reality of Jesuit, yes Jesuit Treasure Monuments and Signs, with the aid of the Masons perectly crafted on boulders and stone. Just because this was the biggest State Secret of Spain and the Church, is NOT the reason why you so lemming like you follow the cover story over the cliff..I dont blame you what-so-ever. You however are unnecessarily absorbing the blame of the Mother Church and trying to Deflect, Defend, and Deny the acts and subsequent true history of the Jesuits and by association the Church herself. I understand, the subtle brainwashing, most of it voluntarily propelled by a 'wanting to believe' wanting to be a part of something of a 'higher nature' a Supreme Being...Not your fault really..we all are human.. I speak from personal experience, having found God first, way before the supplementary calling of following the Jesuits and there treasure craft
In order for me to leave your presence, I first require an apology. A heartfelt and sincere apology, as it were. This apology should make note of the crass and rude behavior shown towards myself and others who have participated in this topic, and the desire for forgiveness shall be of paramount importance.
Nothing crass or rude was intended to you, except for you wanting to be defending institutions that you had no connection with, by your own admission, so therefore it was inadvertent on your part as well as mine...With all due respect Father, I have my own spiritually intact and don't have to ask for forgiveness from other mere mortals. I and my conscious will bear the fruit of my deeds, personally, However, I will submit to your request IF you yourself apologize for trying to turn this happy go lucky fun treasure forum into a boring lecture on the percieved value of believing the 'company line' and dismissing anything that cant be proved by foot notes and annotations. While the whole time swallowing the cover stories and lies put forth all the players, then just because you found documents that were in effect lies, by their errors of omission,,you quote those as some kind of absolute truth..when is of course is not. OK..if you will I certainly will.
I ask for this in order to retain my dignity and sense of honor, and if you are an honorable man, then I feel that this should be but a trifle for you to comply with.
Sir, ah..My friend Lamar..your dignity was intact when you came here, and is intact now..and will be intact when and if you leave here.
I have no control over any of your attributes or perceived lack there of... Your honor is without blemish as well, your only fault Sir is that your Skill of Debating and your Academically trained mind, was misplaced on a forum about secrets of gold mining, smelting.shipping, monument building, division of spoils ie, the famous 80/20 split with the King of Spain., Spies in the Kings Court conspiracies, political intrigues, the Inquisition, the French Revolution, and many more interesting times in the true history of the key players.Most of it hatched behind closed chambers, writted in code, later destoyed, if it was written down at all...
Next, I desire that the lies and slanders leveled against the Jesuits and other innocent religious groups be retracted immediately, and not be restated in the future.
Well Lamar, you wish to change history by selective memory, but alas, my understanding is much different. The Jesuits were the 'foot soldiers' of the Pope, used albeit at arms length,. for plausible denibility, (which of course what YOU are invoking now!)used to ship tons of riches from the New World to the Vatican.
Remember the 80% went to the Jesuits , who as you know took the vow of Poverty..and the Fourth Vow to the ultimate allegiance to the Pope, beyond the loyalty to the King of Spain. That is where the bulk of the gold ended up. Period. Oh they were NOT charged with stealing minerals, as it was all legal under the contract with the King.
Being the magnimous and jolly sort of fellow that I am, I shall restrict my conditions to only these two salient points. Please consider my terms and if you desire to see me withdraw then it might behoove you to take heed of my conditions as I have set them forth.
I am sure that you are magnanimous and jollyu sort of fellow, and where that we were having a few brews, that you would like a jolly fellow buy every other round as gentlemen are wont to do...and I do not slander them, Sir, they slander them selves by their past actions and attributes. I wish it were not true for you sake, but the world is not the rosy world that the Institutions of Higher Liberal Education would have you to believe, and the early centuries, it was more brutal than can be accurately portrayed here in mixed company or in front of the faint of heart, brutal times, brutal acts, greed, mayhem, conquistadors, wars, intrigues and revolutions. The times required the acts performed, it was necessary the way all the actors saw it at the time..I am sure like you they all wish they had been more noble, more considerate, benign, more honorable, but this was not the case.
Only rose colored glasses and political correctness preached by the liberals of the University World, make what you wish to be, to be the truth.
The old expression of 'written in stone' true then as today..that is why I chose to believe what was written in stone as opposed to a revisionist view of the past..
Finally, Lamar, I dont hold you as a perpetrator of these facts of history , as much as a victim of them..as you have been mislead
like so many others, while you may be more articulate and have the propensity to annotate more than them - you all share the common misconception..you all believe the cover story and are helpless to change your minds, because the solution,needed to do that..are not written down or footnoted, or annotated, or documented and have vanished with the passing of those who held those secrets in their hearts as the last valiant act.......but friends what is left is the Legacy in Stone, that the Jesuits and the Masons left for us to decode. It is written in Stone! It is written in Stone...It is written in Stone
I rest my case
auferiously
rangler
"The moving Finger writes; and, having writ, moves on: nor all your Piety nor wit
Shall lure it back to cancel half a Line, Nor all your tears wash out a Word of it".........Omar Khayyam
