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Indigenous Bolivians lay claim to £16bn shipwreck sunk by Royal Navy

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30 December 2025 3:13pm GMT
Qhara Qhara people say they are rightful owners of treasure mined by their enslaved ancestors

1767122533704.webp

Samuel Flores Cruz said he would ‘love to personally thank King Charles’ for the sinking of the San Jose

High in the Andes of landlocked Bolivia, the dilapidated mining town of Potosí is an improbable location for a statue of an 18th-century Royal Navy admiral.

But it is thanks to Sir Charles Wager that the indigenous Qhara Qhara say they now have a claim to £16bn of lost treasure at the heart of an international legal battle.

Dubbed the “holy grail of shipwrecks” and thought to be the most valuable in the world, the San Jose galleon was sunk by Wager while it was sailing in a convoy off the coast of what is today Colombia in 1708.

Wager’s plan was to seize the fleet’s hoard of silver, gold and gems. An estimated 80 per cent of it was mined by the Qhara Qhara’s ancestors who were enslaved by the Spanish empire at Potosí.

1767122581388.webp

Coins discovered on the wreck

Instead, it is believed that a stray cannonball detonated the Spanish flagship’s gunpowder store, plunging the lucrative cargo 2,000ft to the seabed along with all but 11 of the 600 crew and passengers.

The wreck was discovered in 2015 and Colombian scientists claimed they had identified it as the San Jose earlier this year.

In November, the first items originating from the Bolivian town – three silver coins, a cannon and porcelain cup – were dredged up from the galleon.

1767122620806.webp

A painting of Charles Wager’s sinking of the San Jose in 1708

The dispute over ownership involves the Colombian and Spanish governments, as well as Sea Search Armada (SSA), a US company that claims to have found the wreck first in 1982. Colombia says it discovered the wreck in 2015 in a different location.

The case spans venues from Colombia’s constitutional court to an arbitration panel in The Hague, as well as the claim by the Qhara Qhara.

Samuel Flores Cruz, the indigenous group’s leader, says he believes the treasure, as well as all the silver from Cerro Rico, should be salvaged and put in a travelling exhibition, which would be partially based in Bolivia.

He also wants the Qhara Qhara, who mainly live from subsistence agriculture and lack electricity and running water, to get a share of the exhibition’s revenue.

1767122656153.webp

Gustavo Petro, centre, the Colombian president, looks at a cannon recovered from the galleon

The Hague tribunal was due to rule on whether Colombia owes SSA a finder’s fee by the end of December. It has already rejected Spain’s request to be considered in the litigation.

But even if SSA wins, the government in Bogotá is likely to be ordered to pay the company damages, but not hand over the wreck itself, says Dr Michail Risvas, an expert in the Law of the Sea at Southampton University.

He describes the case as “extremely complex, legally, morally and historically”. That means that the Qhara Qhara’s claim to its cargo is likely to be unresolved.

Mr Flores Cruz wants to erect a statue of the Royal Navy admiral who sank the galleon. He says: “If it wasn’t for Wager, we wouldn’t even be talking about this treasure today.

“It’s thanks to him that the San Jose never arrived in Spain and we can now argue about who should get its cargo.”

Mr Flores Cruz fully understands Wager’s less-than-noble motives in attacking the galleon, but adds: “One day, I would love to come to Britain and personally thank King Charles.”

1767122711310.webp


Along with other Andeans and African slaves, Qhara Qhara’s ancestors mined Potosí’s Cerro Rico – or “Rich Mountain” – under a Spanish system of forced labour called “mita”.

“We’re still here and living the legacy of the Spaniards’ brutality. That money would be transformational for us. It would finally allow us to be free and independent,” Mr Flores Cruz says.

“The ship belongs to Spain. I don’t have a problem with that. But not its cargo. This should be about its cultural worth to humanity, and especially the Qhara Qhara, who were exploited for centuries.”

1767122741018.webp

Qhara Qhara working the fields

Dr Risvas says the Qhara Qhara’s claims have merit – but that the legal process will be messy and litigation unlikely to provide the clear answers the different parties are seeking, which will probably need to be negotiated out of court.

“International recognition of indigenous rights, rights to their land and culture, are much more advanced now than when the search for the San Jose began 40 years ago,” he says.

“Their claims do carry real weight, but, unfortunately, this process was not built to address indigenous rights.”
1767122768655.webp


By some estimates, a million slaves died in the bowels of Cerro Rico under the Spanish overlords.

Mr Flores Cruz says that, according to colonial documents, seven out of every 10 men perished during their three-year stints underground.

Most who survived the mines eventually succumbed to silicosis, a lung disease, before they reached middle age. Cerro Rico became so feared that locals dubbed it “the mountain that eats men”.

Even now, with no other local economic opportunities, many Qhara Qhara continue to mine Cerro Rico for its last remnants of silver.
Chinese cups from the wreck of the galleon San Jose

Chinese porcelain cups from the sunken cargo

They do so even though it is now recognised as one of the world’s most dangerous mines and despite the government warning that the summit, at nearly 16,000ft, is collapsing after centuries of mining have left it like a Swiss cheese.

Helen Farr, a marine archaeologist also at Southampton University, is sympathetic to the Qhara Qhara’s demands.

“When you see that mountain, you never look at silver the same way again,” she says. “I don’t believe the answer is about the economic value of the treasure – which is almost always exaggerated when it comes to these shipwrecks – but about its cultural value.

“The question should be how do you use heritage to support health and education, and benefit an entire population?”


SOURCE:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-n...livians-most-valuable-shipwreck-british-navy/
 
I do hope the indigenous people get a good portion of that loot,
as their ancestors died digging it out of that mountain.

Such things are never easy, however, but at least there is a court system
to try and sort it all out.
 
It is greed masquerading as virtue signaling. Its the you owe me mentality. Yep, like at the beach, having some fries and seagulls fight over them.

Well, I want compensation for the English crown stealing my land in Ireland. And if I go back far enough, the Normans and Vikings also. The Norwegians are Vikings who need to pay me damages from their sovereign wealth fund. They should pay me and my descendants compensation for displacement. King Charles owes me money. So do Macron and the French apologize for the Normans invading my country 800 years ago. The English government pay back for lost revenue from confiscated lands since Cromwell's time.

I think they owe me at least 100 million, plus what is good for the goose is good for the gander, isn't it?

It goes both ways in the blame game.


Crow
 
Unpleasant as mention of anything from the mining or wreck is , wearing gloves before disposing of anything from the wreck might not be a bad idea to prevent the curses from rubbing off on someone.

IF the wreck gets divvied up among the decedents of those who labored around it as reparations...Someone document the results. Outside of a structured dispersal over time I don't see it ending well.
" Giving whiskey and car keys to teenagers " kind of a sudden wealth shock. Let alone the reaction of those not getting a share.
 
30 December 2025 3:13pm GMT
Qhara Qhara people say they are rightful owners of treasure mined by their enslaved ancestors

View attachment 2239085
Samuel Flores Cruz said he would ‘love to personally thank King Charles’ for the sinking of the San Jose

High in the Andes of landlocked Bolivia, the dilapidated mining town of Potosí is an improbable location for a statue of an 18th-century Royal Navy admiral.

But it is thanks to Sir Charles Wager that the indigenous Qhara Qhara say they now have a claim to £16bn of lost treasure at the heart of an international legal battle.

Dubbed the “holy grail of shipwrecks” and thought to be the most valuable in the world, the San Jose galleon was sunk by Wager while it was sailing in a convoy off the coast of what is today Colombia in 1708.

Wager’s plan was to seize the fleet’s hoard of silver, gold and gems. An estimated 80 per cent of it was mined by the Qhara Qhara’s ancestors who were enslaved by the Spanish empire at Potosí.

View attachment 2239086
Coins discovered on the wreck

Instead, it is believed that a stray cannonball detonated the Spanish flagship’s gunpowder store, plunging the lucrative cargo 2,000ft to the seabed along with all but 11 of the 600 crew and passengers.

The wreck was discovered in 2015 and Colombian scientists claimed they had identified it as the San Jose earlier this year.

In November, the first items originating from the Bolivian town – three silver coins, a cannon and porcelain cup – were dredged up from the galleon.

View attachment 2239087
A painting of Charles Wager’s sinking of the San Jose in 1708

The dispute over ownership involves the Colombian and Spanish governments, as well as Sea Search Armada (SSA), a US company that claims to have found the wreck first in 1982. Colombia says it discovered the wreck in 2015 in a different location.

The case spans venues from Colombia’s constitutional court to an arbitration panel in The Hague, as well as the claim by the Qhara Qhara.

Samuel Flores Cruz, the indigenous group’s leader, says he believes the treasure, as well as all the silver from Cerro Rico, should be salvaged and put in a travelling exhibition, which would be partially based in Bolivia.

He also wants the Qhara Qhara, who mainly live from subsistence agriculture and lack electricity and running water, to get a share of the exhibition’s revenue.

View attachment 2239088
Gustavo Petro, centre, the Colombian president, looks at a cannon recovered from the galleon

The Hague tribunal was due to rule on whether Colombia owes SSA a finder’s fee by the end of December. It has already rejected Spain’s request to be considered in the litigation.

But even if SSA wins, the government in Bogotá is likely to be ordered to pay the company damages, but not hand over the wreck itself, says Dr Michail Risvas, an expert in the Law of the Sea at Southampton University.

He describes the case as “extremely complex, legally, morally and historically”. That means that the Qhara Qhara’s claim to its cargo is likely to be unresolved.

Mr Flores Cruz wants to erect a statue of the Royal Navy admiral who sank the galleon. He says: “If it wasn’t for Wager, we wouldn’t even be talking about this treasure today.

“It’s thanks to him that the San Jose never arrived in Spain and we can now argue about who should get its cargo.”

Mr Flores Cruz fully understands Wager’s less-than-noble motives in attacking the galleon, but adds: “One day, I would love to come to Britain and personally thank King Charles.”

View attachment 2239089

Along with other Andeans and African slaves, Qhara Qhara’s ancestors mined Potosí’s Cerro Rico – or “Rich Mountain” – under a Spanish system of forced labour called “mita”.

“We’re still here and living the legacy of the Spaniards’ brutality. That money would be transformational for us. It would finally allow us to be free and independent,” Mr Flores Cruz says.

“The ship belongs to Spain. I don’t have a problem with that. But not its cargo. This should be about its cultural worth to humanity, and especially the Qhara Qhara, who were exploited for centuries.”

View attachment 2239090
Qhara Qhara working the fields

Dr Risvas says the Qhara Qhara’s claims have merit – but that the legal process will be messy and litigation unlikely to provide the clear answers the different parties are seeking, which will probably need to be negotiated out of court.

“International recognition of indigenous rights, rights to their land and culture, are much more advanced now than when the search for the San Jose began 40 years ago,” he says.

“Their claims do carry real weight, but, unfortunately, this process was not built to address indigenous rights.”
View attachment 2239091

By some estimates, a million slaves died in the bowels of Cerro Rico under the Spanish overlords.

Mr Flores Cruz says that, according to colonial documents, seven out of every 10 men perished during their three-year stints underground.

Most who survived the mines eventually succumbed to silicosis, a lung disease, before they reached middle age. Cerro Rico became so feared that locals dubbed it “the mountain that eats men”.

Even now, with no other local economic opportunities, many Qhara Qhara continue to mine Cerro Rico for its last remnants of silver.
Chinese cups from the wreck of the galleon San Jose

Chinese porcelain cups from the sunken cargo

They do so even though it is now recognised as one of the world’s most dangerous mines and despite the government warning that the summit, at nearly 16,000ft, is collapsing after centuries of mining have left it like a Swiss cheese.

Helen Farr, a marine archaeologist also at Southampton University, is sympathetic to the Qhara Qhara’s demands.

“When you see that mountain, you never look at silver the same way again,” she says. “I don’t believe the answer is about the economic value of the treasure – which is almost always exaggerated when it comes to these shipwrecks – but about its cultural value.

“The question should be how do you use heritage to support health and education, and benefit an entire population?”


SOURCE:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-n...livians-most-valuable-shipwreck-british-navy/
Samuel Flores is my very good friend . The Picture of him was made in Cartagena. Our film team was there when he said: the wood and the cannons are for Spain, but the treasure is ours. That to say was my idea and received standing ovations. Samuel is an expert reading old documents, translating them. So far we have 200 plus galleons investigated , via Casa Moneda de Potosi and Agi in Sucre. Our fight is not for the San Jose only, but for every coin and bars coming from Potosi. The Qhara Qhara are the living Incas.
And just in case someone is interested in where are some of the Inca treasure, start at the islands in the south seas. Regards , and buy a shovel.
 
The term Inca is a ambiguous term..


Qhara Qhara are a Quechua-speaking Indigenous group in Bolivia, specifically residing in the mountains near Sucre. While they are not the central Inca rulers from Cusco, they were a distinct ethnic group, sometimes allies or subjects, who fought alongside the Incas against the Guaraní in the early 16th century. They are a distinct ethnic group (ethnic group/nation) that maintained their identity while within the Inca sphere of influence. Historical accounts, such as those by Bartolomé Arzans de Orsúa y Vela, describe the Qhara Qhara fighting alongside the Incas, specifically in the Battle of Cantumarca (c. 1500–1510) against the Guaraní.

While the Qhara Qhara had a wonderful history in their own right As for the old Incas who reigned before the Spanish conquest, their name Inca in the Peruvian language meant properly and literally lord or emperor , and royal blood . The king was called Capac Inca , that is, most excellent lord; the queen was called pallas , and the princes simply Incas.

Not every Indigenous person in Bolivia or Peru is Inca. While Bolivia has a high percentage of Indigenous populations (roughly 48% to over 60% depending on the estimate) and was partly within the Inca Empire, the country is home to 36 recognized distinct Indigenous ethnic groups. Largest Groups: The majority of Indigenous people in the Andean highlands are Quechua (approx. 49.5%) and Aymara (approx. 40.6%). The Qhara Qhara are an indigenous nation of approximately 28,000 people from Bolivia's Potosí region, not directly the Incas themselves, but a group that was incorporated into the Inca Empire and later colonized. So not quite Inca living Inca as claimed.

In the 1570s, Viceroy Toledo assigned the Qullasuyu Indians to forced shift-labor in the so-calledmita system, within the mines of Potosí system. Some studies indicate that in the 17th century, the percentage of Qhara Qhara Indians who went to Potosí was very low, because their authorities left this obligation without effect by hiring other Indians, thus protecting their own population. This claim by the Qhara Qhara over the San Jose shipwreck could be claimed by other ethnic groups.

However, this strategy by the Qhara Qhara could not be extended to other services, such as the transport of silver bars and quicksilver to and from Arica, or the guarding of the southern border. These mandatory shifts and the demographic losses due to epidemics, coupled with the phenomenon of Indians fleeing their communities in response to excessive tax obligations during the 17th century, impacted the ethnic structuring of the Aymara lordships throughout the region.

The Potosí region in Bolivia was historically inhabited by various indigenous groups, most notably the Aymara-speaking peoples. During the Spanish colonial period, this area was heavily impacted by the mita system, which forced indigenous labor, including many mitayos, mingas, and wage earners from surrounding regions, to work in the silver mines. The Qhara Qhara are an indigenous nation of approximately 28,000 people from Bolivia's Potosí region but they was not the only indigenous groups that could challenge ownership of the treasure from the San Jose.

Crow


.
 
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The system of international law is quite similar to the mountain of silver - many tunnels have hollow it out and it is basically crumbling down burying those who still believe they can get one more silver nugget out of it.

Forget it. The times have changed.
 
I would go by whatever contract SSA had with those governments involved. Treasures lost during war is just part of the spoils that the victors gained. When you lose a war, you lose all claims to what you had. Otherwise, everything on Earth belongs to whoever the first people were.....which were relatives of us all, right? It's ridiculous talking about reparations from acts of people long dead that were inflicted on others that are now dead too. Dividing people into groups for special treatment is a fools folly, and only fosters more division and hate.
 
I would go by whatever contract SSA had with those governments involved. Treasures lost during war is just part of the spoils that the victors gained. When you lose a war, you lose all claims to what you had. Otherwise, everything on Earth belongs to whoever the first people were.....which were relatives of us all, right? It's ridiculous talking about reparations from acts of people long dead that were inflicted on others that are now dead too. Dividing people into groups for special treatment is a fools folly, and only fosters more division and hate.
It’s complicated. And we don’t have to walk back to Adam and Eve to rattle the cage. The only way to have peace on this planet is clearly the consequences you bear for your doings.
And it’s clear now more than ever. In this forum many people have a profound knowledge of History. And also clearly they see all was made on bones of the vulnerable. All the gold and silver. And emeralds and pearls. Today it’s lithium and oil and land and water. Somebody has to pay with life and property. I am sure you hope it’s not going to be yourself and your family.
On the 8th June will be a meeting with some rather interesting personalities in Cartagena de las Indias. The day when the San Jose sank. You are Wellcome.
IMG_7150.webp
 
The gold coins (8 escudos) visible shown here (from the wreck of the San Jose) were minted at the Lima, Peru mint, not at the Potosi mint. Potosi never minted gold coins in that era. The Cero Rico mountain did not produce gold. These coins are easily identified as Lima, as the waves flow downward under the date (Potosi's "Pillars & Waves" design have the waves flowing upward under the date). Also, Lima assayer Francisco Hurtado's initial "H" is visible, in the correct position.

Indigenous peoples were not the only group forced to work the mines. Slaves from Africa, as well as some European & Spanish colonial prisoners also died in the horrific conditions in the Potosi mines.
 

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The gold coins (8 escudos) visible shown here (from the wreck of the San Jose) were minted at the Lima, Peru mint, not at the Potosi mint. Potosi never minted gold coins in that era. The Cero Rico mountain did not produce gold. These coins are easily identified as Lima, as the waves flow downward under the date (Potosi's "Pillars & Waves" design have the waves flowing upward under the date). Also, Lima assayer Francisco Hurtado's initial "H" is visible, in the correct position.

Indigenous peoples were not the only group forced to work the mines. Slaves from Africa, as well as some European & Spanish colonial prisoners also died in the horrific conditions in the
 
Correct. Those coins are from Lima. But in potosi also gold was mined, but way smaller quantities. Gold was found and mined near La Paz area too.
 
Correct. Those coins are from Lima. But in potosi also gold was mined, but way smaller quantities. Gold was found and mined near La Paz area too.
More gold was mined from Latin America by US companies in the last decades, than by the Spaniards over four centuries. Yet the Indigenous peoples from LATAM are always demanding that we "return" "their" gold.
 
More gold was mined from Latin America by US companies in the last decades, than by the Spaniards over four centuries. Yet the Indigenous peoples from LATAM are always demanding that we "return" "their" gold.
Yes but the modern gold was mined with their permission, not taken in the form of religion artifacts melted down and forced slave labor.

Also not all of those gold mines are ran by US companies.

"Latin American gold mining companies are not owned by just one country. They belong to a mix of local South American nations, international corporations from Canada, the United States, China, South Africa, and the United Kingdom, as well as public stock investors from around the world."
 
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Yes but the modern gold was mined with their permission, not taken in the form of religion artifacts melted down and forced slave labor.

Also not all of those gold mines are ran by US companies.

"Latin American gold mining companies are not owned by just one country. They belong to a mix of local South American nations, international corporations from Canada, the United States, China, South Africa, and the United Kingdom, as well as public stock investors from around the world."
You are right about American companies not being the sole exploiters. It was a lazy generalization on my part.

However, the people who authorized Westerners to extract mineral resources in LATAM post-emancipation were the snow-white elites in the capital cities. Those are about as similar to Indigenous peoples as a snail to a cat. I highly doubt they had the permission of the natives to sell their wealth -often for pennies on the dollar- on their behalf.

If you don't believe me, look up the history of the United Fruit Company and the banana republics. Land expropriation and slave labor at its finest, with an American flair.
 
You are right about American companies not being the sole exploiters. It was a lazy generalization on my part.

However, the people who authorized Westerners to extract mineral resources in LATAM post-emancipation were the snow-white elites in the capital cities. Those are about as similar to Indigenous peoples as a snail to a cat. I highly doubt they had the permission of the natives to sell their wealth -often for pennies on the dollar- on their behalf.

If you don't believe me, look up the history of the United Fruit Company and the banana republics. Land expropriation and slave labor at its finest, with an American flair.
My reply was mostly about the "in the last decades" part of your post, that hasn't been the case for several or more decades now, I know what you say is true prior to that.
 
My reply was mostly about the "in the last decades" part of your post, that hasn't been the case for several or more decades now, I know what you say is true prior to that.
Yeah, should have written over the last century and especially during its first half. However, I can think of the CIA-backed coup against Arbenz as a good example that illustrates my point. And that took place in the 1950s.

As for treasure hunting, the American-backed dictator of the Philippines, Ferdinand Marcos, used his power to deprive treasure hunter Rogelio Roxas of Yamashita's gold in 1971. It's an interesting story, as told by Sterling Seagrave in his book The Gold Warriors. Totally worth reading.
 
TOTALY WORTH THE READING , ABSOLUTLY !! There was a show featured on PBS (ch9) on this event and the results of this event ! get seris ! I only wish it had continued addition !
 

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