Silver / CRH as GoLd???

[blacoint]

nm

 

[Silver Stripe]

I've made two trades (really sell, then buy) into gold the last couple months as the ratio has been favorable to do that, have enough for one more if the ratio drops more. Also wanted to get out of stuff I can't sell locally for a decent price- dealers here rape you on 90% and don't even ask about 40%. If the ratio goes back high again next summer I will try to trade gold back for .999 silver- if not I got cheap gold. First trade was $500fv 90% and $200fv 40% for 7.5oz gold in 1/4's and a check for almost $500. Ratio is hanging around 47:1 now, hoping for closer to 40ish right before the summer duldrums (if they come this year). HH Mark
BTW if you haven't traded any yet it would be a good time, if you can only trade once maybe hold out for 45 but carefull you don't get greedy and totally miss the trade. There's something about holding a 1/2 bag in one hand and 1/2lb in the other and knowing they're equal $$$wise.

 

[JD-GA]

This is always interesting to me but i still feel like gold has to much room to drop compared to silver. I predicted silver would spike hard last year and it did. I dont see anything stopping it next year and it seems easier for it to go up higher percentage wise since it is so cheap. I was offered $100 a roll for my 40%s today and refused. That is how good i feel about silver right now.

 

[existentiallettuce]

I can't find any reasonable offers locally, but I am tempted to pull the trigger on ebay soon. I can't really decide if I want to build an interesting collection or hoard bullion. I think in the long long term the collection would be better for me. Ones gotta hope the economy turns soon

 

[fistfulladirt]

I can't really decide if I want to build an interesting collection or hoard bullion. I think in the long long term the collection would be better for me. Ones gotta hope the economy turns soon

Why not do both? That's what I'm doing, a nice balance.

 

[jim4silver]

This is always interesting to me but i still feel like gold has to much room to drop compared to silver.

I would have to disagree with you on that one. Don't get me wrong, I am a fan of silver. But silver has gone up way too fast in the past few months compared to gold. There might not be a correction in gold and silver, but if there is you watch and you will see silver fall much farther percentage wise than gold. That is just how silver is. It goes up faster and farther and falls the same way. Look back in 2008 when everything crashed and you will see silver went from 20 or so to 9. Gold did not fall that much percentage wise.

I think FFD is right about owning both and that is what I do. If you are a gambler than go with 100% silver and you might strike it rich if it keeps rising. Keep in mind if for some reason we do have a deflationary depression silver should not hold up as well as gold because silver is also industrial and the big money folks generally consider gold more monetary than silver, even though silver was used as currency more than gold in the past century.

One thing to remember is that what is fueling both gold and silver gains now is not average Joes buying PMs but big time money institutions speculating and putting lots of $$$$ into the futures markets. Also, from what I have read some countries are using the dips to buy tons of physical metal when they can.

Further, at some point if the big boy speculators decide to take some profits they can do it in an instant then decide to short the market and make some $$$$ on the way down. Never sell your physical core position to try and recoup at a lower cost. If you want to speculate, play the ETFs or miner shares. Keep a good core stash of physical PMs as insurance in case the world economy falls apart.

Just my 2 cents.

Jim

 

[Silver Stripe]

nice work, i move mine almost constantly from 40 to 90 to better. Holding out for 45 or even 40 is a big ballsy move, 47 is great considering a year or so ago it was 60 0r m0re; holding out will really thing will cause you to miss the boat. Keep in mind how you got what you got and only recently...."recently" is 40 even considered or accepted on the buying front. Silver is a vehicle to gold. Get to it...is my thought.

Imo, you did exceptionally well on your trade their sstripe.

Yea first one was great, 30 mins after I got off the phone the bottom fell out- ratio jumped back to 52, silver lost $1+ in a day, don't remember what gold lost but everybody and their brother was buying it up. When the ratio got back down to 47-48 I was itchin to convert some more weight but the stock was limited so I had to go for bigger pieces and a bigger check too. I check the ratio a few times a day and record it, it was 46.779 at 7AM 12/7/10 so I think 45 is quite doable with rising prices, falling prices and the ratio generally widens. My remaining 90% is mostly Bens, Walkers, Mercs, SLQ...etc that I'm in no hurry to trade, 45 would see some 999 traded, 40 would get the oldies too haha. HH Mark

 

[cjprice]

So What weighs more a 100 pounds of feathers, or a 100 pounds of bricks

 

[Silver Stripe]

I can appreciate and understand your method of thought. I guess that's the beauty of this crazy game. I'm rolling against that but only b/c I don't think it's going to happen, not like the big banks that are mega short. I hope everyone one on here figures it out and comes out ahead of the game. It's almost impossible if your crh'ed your junk. I still think the ratio is important but so is the fact that what you have is basically for free so you must capitalize on that as well.

But to address your statement above, that's all good and nice and could certainly happen...but weather or not dealers step up and agree to it, vs premiums or simply ignoring it is a big issue. There are always great dealers that sell the spot no matter what, then there are those...others.

If its a hobby your junk is basically free (hobbies cost $$$- this one pays you back). For ME its business and I need to do the best I can getting paid. I've been supplementing my income the last couple years off 40% sales- FV costs, gas, candy... and time is a big one (but thats hobbytime). I agree there are costs in trading, reason I want the lowest spot ratio I can get. Already made a couple trades so I didn't miss the boat entirely- last year I did waiting for a ratio that didn't materialize. I still think silver is the one to be holding but not in 90% form for ME- I need to be more liquid cause $hit happens. Maybe there is still time to trade the ratio back and forth and gain more oz's while getting into more liquid material. HH Mark

 

[Rich Hartford]

Does anyone use they're finds to convert to gold or anything better than 40's. Like converting 40's to 90s or 999 or the whole lot to gold. I kinda see silver as a step to gold and this hobby, while still able to be done would be a great way to get cheap gold. Anyone?

Here is what I do. I never sell my CRHing finds simply because I will have to pay taxes on the profit,and I already pay enough taxes.
So I trade it. Out of the thousands of coins I have recovered,I probably have less then two hundred(which I may trade this weekend).
I have traded silver for gold only because gold makes a great barter item for expensive items.
My last haircut I payed the barber a 90% Kennedy. He was happy,I was happy.
HH
Rich

 

[ArkieBassMan]

Here is what I do. I never sell my CRHing finds simply because I will have to pay taxes on the profit,and I already pay enough taxes.
So I trade it. Out of the thousands of coins I have recovered,I probably have less then two hundred(which I may trade this weekend).
I have traded silver for gold only because gold makes a great barter item for expensive items.
My last haircut I payed the barber a 90% Kennedy. He was happy,I was happy.
HH
Rich

Very good point Rich. By trading you avoid taxes. I hadn't thought of that.

 

[jerseyben]

I don't know where you guys are making these incredible trades but I went to 3 dealers today... First had a WORN 1911 $5 Gold Eagle coin for $450 and was buying 40%s at 1.25 each. 2nd dealer would only give me $30 for a roll of 40%s. 3rd dealer was offering 7 times face on 40%s and tried to sell me an 1898 $20 Gold in AU for $1550. I even asked about 2010 Silver Eagles and those were $38/each.

 

[jim4silver]

I don't know where you guys are making these incredible trades but I went to 3 dealers today... First had a WORN 1911 $5 Gold Eagle coin for $450 and was buying 40%s at 1.25 each. 2nd dealer would only give me $30 for a roll of 40%s. 3rd dealer was offering 7 times face on 40%s and tried to sell me an 1898 $20 Gold in AU for $1550. I even asked about 2010 Silver Eagles and those were $38/each.

The third dealer is not too bad for $3.50 per coin on the 40%ers. 1898 is a fairly scarce date in the $20 Liberty coins. I believe the mintage was just over 170K coins. After seeing your post I did some checking and saw that an MS60 went for $1950 in an auction this month at one of the bigger auction houses (AU coins would grade between AU 50-58, so an MS60 is not far off from that). If the coin definitely is an AU (not cleaned or polished), that is not a bad price. This is true especially if it is graded AU by a respected third party grader.

Just my opinion.

Jim

 

[clovis97]

I find this to be a very interesting thread. I always enjoy learning from different people's viewpoints.

I have very little silver, but I'm hanging onto it at least until spring. This is odd for me; I am generally into fast flips. Since I have so little invested into what I do have, I think it is worth the chance.

 

[ArkieBassMan]

taxes huh...in what capacity? Where I am pm's have no taxes. If i sell to a dealer, he gives me cash. If i buy from the dealer he tells me spot + x and i pay him cash. End of story. Are you talking a sales tax? If so, that would really suck since large amounts of pm's bought could add up to several hundred in taxes.

Income tax. Anything sold for a profit must be reported as income and taxed accordingly.

 

[quiksilver]

Forget feebay and hoard your 40s untill you can make it to a decent show even if you have to drive 2 hours. Shows are the place to trade ,theres no paper trail and you can hit a few banks along the way.

 

[StevoCBR]

I'm all silver. I know there are some arguments against but a lot more for. Comex silver inventories all time low, gold all time high, traded 5 times as much as gold daily...Mmmm why is that? Silver has doubled the return this year of Gold's return. Industrial demand and so on, but we all have been reading up on e subject and know the facts. We just decipher the data differently. When the general public makes a run on PM. Silver will do far better than gold....Poor man's gold and more affordable for the average American. Just my 2 cents.

 

[fistfulladirt]

I'm all silver. I know there are some arguments against but a lot more for. Comex silver inventories all time low, gold all time high, traded 5 times as much as gold daily...Mmmm why is that? Silver has doubled the return this year of Gold's return. Industrial demand and so on, but we all have been reading up on e subject and know the facts. We just decipher the data differently. When the general public makes a run on PM. Silver will do far better than gold....Poor man's gold and more affordable for the average American. Just my 2 cents.

Do you really believe the general public will ever make a run on PM's? You are giving them WAY too much credit.

 

[jim4silver]

I'm all silver. I know there are some arguments against but a lot more for. Comex silver inventories all time low, gold all time high, traded 5 times as much as gold daily...Mmmm why is that? Silver has doubled the return this year of Gold's return. Industrial demand and so on, but we all have been reading up on e subject and know the facts. We just decipher the data differently. When the general public makes a run on PM. Silver will do far better than gold....Poor man's gold and more affordable for the average American. Just my 2 cents.

Do you really believe the general public will ever make a run on PM's? You are giving them WAY too much credit.

Exactly. By the time Joe Public learns that PMs are a good investment, he will be too concerned about paying the rent and groceries, and won't have any extra money for PMs. I think 75% of the population might fit into that category in the next few years if things keep going like they are. That is why you need to get your PMs now if you can in my opinion, whether it is silver or gold.

Jim

 

[StevoCBR]

I'm all silver. I know there are some arguments against but a lot more for. Comex silver inventories all time low, gold all time high, traded 5 times as much as gold daily...Mmmm why is that? Silver has doubled the return this year of Gold's return. Industrial demand and so on, but we all have been reading up on e subject and know the facts. We just decipher the data differently. When the general public makes a run on PM. Silver will do far better than gold....Poor man's gold and more affordable for the average American. Just my 2 cents.

Do you really believe the general public will ever make a run on PM's? You are giving them WAY too much credit.

Exactly. By the time Joe Public learns that PMs are a good investment, he will be too concerned about paying the rent and groceries, and won't have any extra money for PMs. I think 75% of the population might fit into that category in the next few years if things keep going like they are. That is why you need to get your PMs now if you can in my opinion, whether it is silver or gold.

Jim
[/quote
I certainly understand your points but think about this. How many people do we all know that are on both sides of the isle politically that are educated smart people that don't have a clue of what is going on. Sure the people that are broke, dependent on government and or others, agreed they will be in bad shape. But the people that actually care that are smart and understand more than your average bear, those people are going to wake up one day.. I know and am family with smart, successful, affluent people that think I'm crazy and have this ignorant blind faith that everything the government does is in all our best interest and that the government would never let a fiat currency collapse. Yet as we talk about this we here all know what really is going on and thus a big draw for us to this particular hobby and site.

But once real harsh inflation starts to hit hard. I believe that will jolt of lot of people into a oh my gosh moment that will begin to trigger these people to dig into the subject matter and take action. I mean I'm sure you have all read the headlines. India prefers silver to gold now and have and is the largest consumer of Gold in years past due to their religious traditions of giving gold and increasingly now silver. Or how China just legalized silver ownership for it's citizens. Those are 2 huge markets that will continue to grow.

Couple that with a looming cloud in the individual US states fiscal health and the fact that the cash coming in is slowed and municipality debts going unpaid in several cases..ie IL, and CA. There are a lot of cities and states that are in deep trouble and looks like headed for defaults on there municiple debt. We haven't seen anything yet of potentially what we face in the future. Once you start to really see the birth pains of what we have created in our "Clower and Piven" live outside of our means society. That's when the run will begin, when people start to wake up. Which by the way if there is a SINGLE reader that doesn't know who "Clower and Piven" are? Please Google and read about them.

And on the whole note of silver has gone up to fast. Read up on JP Morgan chase and silver manipulation. Silver should have been at $30 10 years ago. and should be $80-$90 right now just based on the gold to silver ratio that has been historically in place until we took our currency off the gold standard...

As I have told some friends that recently have got into PM and silver in particular. Your still early to the party.

Great debate none the less!