Silver ring with gold US coin

bentdiggin · Dec 17, 2013

This is my first post. I have been reading for months and decided this is a good place to get help. Everyone seems very knowledgeable and I feel like an idiot at times. Anyway, I dug a silver ring with a $1 US gold coin mounted on it. The ring has "Pure" stamped on the inside. There are some marks on the edges that are decorative I think. I would like help in finding maker and time period. This was found in a town noted for a Civil War battle. I have found some artifacts from the war close to where I dug the ring. Any help would be appreciated. Hopefully the pictures are clear.

Mackaydon · Dec 22, 2013

The coin you just posted in #40 is the same I and others ID-ed earlier.
Don...

bentdiggin · Dec 22, 2013

here is front and back of the large reale coin.

bentdiggin · Dec 22, 2013

I have to go to church will get front and back of smaller coin when I return this evening. Sorry for the delay.

Mackaydon · Dec 22, 2013

No delay indicated; take your time.
We'll appreciate seeing the pics whenever it's convenient to you.
Don....

bentdiggin · Dec 22, 2013

new pics added

Here are the new pics of the small coin and the ring. If you want anymore let me know and I will try.

Mackaydon · Dec 23, 2013

The small coin's date seems to be 178X; and the mintmark is obscured. I'll assume it, too, was minted in Mexico City.
If you can read the designation after CAROLUS, you can get a closer date range. If the designation is "III" the mint range (in the 1780s) was 1780 to 1789, but in 1789 the same coin design was minted with the exception; the monarch's name was CAROLUS IV. Also, after 1784 the content of silver slipped a tad from .9030 to .8960.
Don.

bentdiggin · Jan 2, 2014

I am trying to trace some history on this ring. Does anyone have any ideas on how I can possibly find the maker or when the ring would have been made. I do know the PURE stamp indicates it is possibly late 1800s. But I have gone to local historian with no luck.

detectahead · Jan 2, 2014

Yes, let's see some clearer pics! That is one heck of a find! Sweeettttt!!!!!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

MUD(S.W.A.T) · Jan 2, 2014

Why does the coin look silver on the edges in the first picture ? :dontknow:

The last pic looks legit though...

Keep @ it and HH !! :laughing7:

Breezie · Jan 11, 2014

Hey BentD, welcome to the forum. Let me first say, that is a GREAT find! From what I can see from your pics, your PURE silver ring looks to be handmade. I downloaded and enhanced your first pic, and could see the bottom left portion (8 o'clock) of the ring is smaller than the bottom right (4 o'clock.) The top left area looks flatter than the top right. I couldn't see the notches on the sides, but you can examine them under a magnifying glass to see if they are symmetrical; my bet is they are not, which indicates to me it is handmade.

As far as the gold coin is concerned, I would have a reputable coin dealer to verify its authenticity. It appears to be soldered to the ring. I would certainly be tempted to have it professionally removed to see if it is a key date or not IF it could be removed without any damage.

I'm sorry but I don't think we're going to be able to put an exact date on the ring, but judging by the style and PURE stamp with SERIF font, I'm thinking mid to late Victorian period (1860s-1880s.)

Breezie

bentdiggin · Jan 11, 2014

Thanks for giving your input. The marks are not identical from side to side. Your input is really appreciated. I did take to a jeweller and he could not remove the coin safely. I don't really want to remmove it though. Would love to link to a person, but with 50,000 troops in the area this may never happen. Thanks again for your thoughts and time.

bentdiggin · Jan 25, 2014

I have taken this ring to 2 local antique shops and cannot find anyone that can help me trace the maker of this ring. Anyone have any ideas

? Help!!!

Breezie · Jan 25, 2014

bentdiggin said:
I have taken this ring to 2 local antique shops and cannot find anyone that can help me trace the maker of this ring. Anyone have any ideas? Help!!!

BD, Since your ring does not have a 'makers' mark, it's going to be extremely difficult to determine 'who' made the ring. When dealing with silver items like candle sticks, trays, flatware, etc., most manufacturers in the early 1800's stamped their pieces 'Coin Silver' or 'Pure Silver.' This meant the item was made from either 'silver bars' or actual 'silver coins.' The purity was 900 out of 1000; the other 10% was generally copper. Colonial Silversmiths had to wait for silver bars to be shipped to them from England. Often this was a long process waiting for silver bars; therefore, Silversmiths would often take silver coins from their pocket to melt down and use to make their item. Also other silver items were melted down; for example many 1720s spoons were melted to make 1820's spoons. The first silver mine opened in the US was in 1859.

I think your ring was handmade by a Silversmith from silver coins, thus 'coin silver' and was marked PURE like the other silver items of those times.

Breezie

Argentium · Jan 25, 2014

Breezie , I don't claim to have your knowledge history/collectibles, but having seen a number of mid 19th century spoons and numerous
other antique silver items which were marked "coin" - if this ring were in fact made of circulating coinage , wouldn't it be marked "coin"
rather than "pure" ? ( as you correctly noted in your post the difference between the .900 and the .999 ) I do think the ring appears to
be fine or pure silver - it has that soft white - more matte finish than either sterling or coin .

Jamesbondaka · Jan 25, 2014

lab rat said:
I'm not so sure the 'coin' in the ring is a real coin. Might be added as a design motif, possibly plated. The way to find out would be to take it to a coin dealer. Call around in advance and find a dealer in your area familiar with fractional gold. They would be able to compare the motif with period coins and verify whether it's genuine. One giveaway is the solid shank inside the ring. I'm thinking if the coin were real you'd be able to see the back through a hole in the silver.

Thats the proper way to do it but not for sure in all cases. Its a nice find but of the thousands of rings Ive looked thru/at...Ive never seen one marked "pure".

Breezie · Jan 25, 2014

Argentium said:
Breezie , I don't claim to have your knowledge history/collectibles, but having seen a number of mid 19th century spoons and numerous
other antique silver items which were marked "coin" - if this ring were in fact made of circulating coinage , wouldn't it be marked "coin"
rather than "pure" ? ( as you correctly noted in your post the difference between the .900 and the .999 ) I do think the ring appears to
be fine or pure silver - it has that soft white - more matte finish than either sterling or coin .

Hey Argentium,
I have no way of knowing for sure, and I was basically throwing out some different ideas. I really can't tell from pics. The ring could have been made from coin silver or a silver bar; and at this time, no one really knows except the person who made it. I do know during the early 1800's silver items like I listed above were marked 'Coin Silver' or 'Pure Silver,' and thought perhaps the ring was made by a Silversmith who only marked it PURE. :dontknow:

It certainly is a mystery, and I would love to know all the whos, whats, and wheres because it is such an unusual and pretty ring. I've never seen a ring marked PURE.

Breezie

dansalata · Jan 25, 2014

wow...

bentdiggin · Jan 26, 2014

Jamesbondaka said:
Thats the proper way to do it but not for sure in all cases. Its a nice find but of the thousands of rings Ive looked thru/at...Ive never seen one marked "pure".[/QUOTE. The coin has been verified as real. The 2 antique dealers and the jeweler have verified. I just wanted more history on ring maker. In hopes if finding original owner. All agree handmade and the reason date wasn't left visible was because it was not important at the time. The coin was probably new when made and rare or collectible was not a thought.

Jamesbondaka · Jan 26, 2014

bentdiggin said:
Jamesbondaka said:

Thats the proper way to do it but not for sure in all cases. Its a nice find but of the thousands of rings Ive looked thru/at...Ive never seen one marked "pure".[/QUOTE. The coin has been verified as real. The 2 antique dealers and the jeweler have verified. I just wanted more history on ring maker. In hopes if finding original owner. All agree handmade and the reason date wasn't left visible was because it was not important at the time. The coin was probably new when made and rare or collectible was not a thought.

Click to expand...

I did not say it was not legit, I just said I have never seen a ring marked "pure". I have handled thousands and thousands of rings over the years. By the supplied pics the ring looks a bit too "clean & structured" to be homemade and the coin was not attached the way it should be. I do think it was put together by hand but not handmade. Heres my rational....There appears to be some fine details on this ring as well as, some relatively precise cuts & angles etc. Why would someone spend so much time on the ring and then mount the coin in such a way? Its possible that one person made the ring and another person "soldered" the coin onto it. I would venture a guess that a very good jeweler COULD remove the coin with little or no damage, providing no damage was done when it was attached. Not ALL jewelers are the same....some very good and some not so. Likewise, a very good jeweler could know a lot about jewelry and know little or nothing of coins. Usually a jeweler is not a coin expert, as a coin dealer is not a jewelry expert. Coins are a specialty and it takes someone that has studied coins for a very long time to KNOW what they are talking about.

Whatever the case...its a nice ring and a nice find!