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Who Was The Big Fat Liar?

Looking into Robert MORRIS, Mayor of Lynchburg, Va. in 1813; was HE a member of Marshall Lodge # 39...? Bet he was...
 

Was HE in New Orleans in 1812...? Mayor of Lynchburg, Va. in 1813...?
 

Rebel - KGC said:
Was HE in New Orleans in 1812...? Mayor of Lynchburg, Va. in 1813...?
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It dosen't matter. If one desires to turn the Beale Papers into an 1812 related affair then it renders the 1885 publication untrue and just another tall tale. And if the original and only source material is just another tall tale then there is no original true source at all. :thumbsup:
 

Robert MORRIS is very well documented in Lynchburg, Va. HISTORY; I am looking for MORE, whether YOU like it not. Getting ANNOYING for YOU to call EVERYTHING a LIE, if you do not agree with it. YOU are stuck in the BPP "box", AGAIN!
 

Rebel - KGC said:
Was HE in New Orleans in 1812...? Mayor of Lynchburg, Va. in 1813...?
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No Robert Morriss stayed home but his partner James Dunnington was over an outfit that went to New Orleans. If Robert Morriss was there he would have been with James Dunnington.
 

HA! Checking on Robert MORRIS, ex-Mayor of Lynchburg, Va. Robert MORRISS was/is a MYTH (MHO).
 

HA! That is "Rob MORRIS"... will read the letter, later.
 

Will let others decide... I have NEVER seen it like that.
 

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Only Rob Morris that I know of in Free-Masonry; he founded OES (Order of the Eastern Star); Ma was a 50 year(s) member & Worthy Matron.
 

franklin said:
There are only two characters in the story, Robert Morriss that owned the Washington Hotel and a Thomas J. Beale according to the story the author got from Robert Morriss a few months before Robert Morriss died.
The author is unknown.
Then you have the copyright application by James B. (Beverly) Ward. James Beverly Ward lived in the area of Lynchburg, Virginia as did Robert Morriss. But there has been no information found on which Thomas J. Beale was the true explorer named in the story?

Robert Morriss was a man of rich means up until the "Recession of 1819" He had made large investments in tobacco and the price of tobacco had it's bottom fall out. Still Robert Morriss had a lot of wealth left. He had over 30 properties in three different counties. He sold off about 20 of them advertised in the newspapers. He raised enough capital to open up the Washington House by purchasing it with a ten year promissory not to four wealthy Lynchburg citizens. He must have done well in the hotel business as he left the Washington House in 1826 and his contract must have been paid off as it terminated in 1828.

As for James Beverly Ward, he was a farmer that was in financial trouble ever since his grandfather, James Beverly Risque died in 1843. He had two saw mills in 1853 and he was forced to sell them in the 1870's to pay debtors. Later in late, 1876, the court put his land and his mother's farms up for sale. He had went to St. Louis after his grandfather passed away and was a pay clerk at Jefferson Barracks. He was also for a while paymaster at a Fort near Pensacola, Florida. Later returned home and died at the home of his daughter in Lynchburg.

As for Thomas J. Beale, no researcher has found any information on him, his thirty associates or whether the grand adventure ever took place in 1817 to 1822.
Nothing in the Spanish Archives, nothing in the newspapers.
So did it happen at all, I do not think so.
So no codes to solve as there is no treasure to find.
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James Beverly Ward's seems to be the impetus of the publication of the 1885 Beale Papers, and most likely, as his great grandson Gorhan Walker and Lt Thomas Fawcett believed, was the "unknown author".
 

bigscoop said:
"It has been ten years from the time I last saw you. You are receiving this letter as promised in 1822."

If the alleged TJB's last visit was in 1822 and 10 years have passed since, how can we still be in 1822? :laughing7:
Now he has the alleged TJB not even being able to do simple math...:laughing7: Not only this but the entire writing style and grammar has changed, spelling skills are also now seriously lacking....:laughing7: Obviously penned by a different and more recent hand.....:thumbsup:
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I have figured out how you could spend so many years on the Beale codes without ever finding answers. Apparently you don't understand what was said in the story.
Beale sent the letter, not to be opened until 1832, that was the 10 years he was talking about. Morriss was not supposed to open in until this 10 years had passed. As he said, THIS LETTER WAS PROMISED in 1822. Did you actually spent so much time on this without knowing that?
 

Robert Morriss was to break the lock on the ironbox and open it in 1832. However, Robert Morriss being an honest and upstanding man waited another 13 years, broke the lock and read the letter with the sheets of ciphers in 1845. Robert Morriss almost died in 1843, when he heard that his sister in Kentucky had passed away. Yes there is a lot in the story to consider and think about but still there has never been any evidence to verify any of the story. As the story goes the TRUST that Thomas J. Beale had in Robert Morriss to do the right thing and then Robert Morriss let him and his men down by waiting an extra 13 years. Robert Morriss could have went to Paschal Buford and checked the story out. He passed through there many times to land he owned in Franklin County, Bedford County and Campbell County. Yet he didn't and that seems to indicate the story is nothing but a STORY.
 

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franklin said:
Robert Morriss was to break the lock on the ironbox and open it in 1832. However, Robert Morriss being an honest and upstanding man waited another 13 years, broke the lock and read the letter with the sheets of ciphers in 1845. Robert Morriss almost died in 1843, when he heard that his sister in Kentucky had passed away. Yes there is a lot in the story to consider and think about but still there has never been any evidence to verify any of the story. As the story goes the TRUST that Thomas J. Beale had in Robert Morriss to do the right thing and then Robert Morriss let him and his men down by waiting an extra 13 years. Robert Morriss could have went to Paschal Buford and checked the story out. He passed through there many times to land he owned in Franklin County, Bedford County and Campbell County. Yet he didn't and that seems to indicate the story is nothing but a STORY.
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How do we know for sure that RM didn't check out the story with Paschal Buford? A lot of things happen that aren't recorded. Anyway, I'm not claiming the story has to be true, it just seems funny the things people say trying to discredit it. If I were trying to make up my mind about it, I certainly wouldn't be on the side of these guys who come up with all these things that make no sense. To believe the opening post, you have to completely change the story to fit what bigscoop said. It seems to me that if you want to convince people of the falsehood of a story, you wouldn't completely change the story, as that is a dead giveaway that you're wrong.
 

Treasures2Find said:
How do we know for sure that RM didn't check out the story with Paschal Buford? A lot of things happen that aren't recorded. Anyway, I'm not claiming the story has to be true, it just seems funny the things people say trying to discredit it. If I were trying to make up my mind about it, I certainly wouldn't be on the side of these guys who come up with all these things that make no sense. To believe the opening post, you have to completely change the story to fit what bigscoop said. It seems to me that if you want to convince people of the falsehood of a story, you wouldn't completely change the story, as that is a dead giveaway that you're wrong.
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You do not have to change the story. Leave the story exactly as it is. Find something that makes the story truthful from an historic point of view. Find a Thomas J. Beale that was in Lynchburg, Va between 1815 and 1825? Find where the men were organized together as a group? Find where they made the trip out west? Find a hotel or house record or diary that says they stayed somewhere? Find where other parties that were trapping along the upper Missouri River saw them? Find it written in a newspaper in the St. Louis or Franklin Missouri Newspapers? Find among the Spanish Archives that were very accurate I might add saying this party of 30 men with their expedition leader's name which they always printed or wrote down in the Archives? There is no historic or documented records of any of this ever happening? If you can find anything to verify the story post it here?
 

franklin said:
You do not have to change the story. Leave the story exactly as it is. Find something that makes the story truthful from an historic point of view. Find a Thomas J. Beale that was in Lynchburg, Va between 1815 and 1825? Find where the men were organized together as a group? Find where they made the trip out west? Find a hotel or house record or diary that says they stayed somewhere? Find where other parties that were trapping along the upper Missouri River saw them? Find it written in a newspaper in the St. Louis or Franklin Missouri Newspapers? Find among the Spanish Archives that were very accurate I might add saying this party of 30 men with their expedition leader's name which they always printed or wrote down in the Archives? There is no historic or documented records of any of this ever happening? If you can find anything to verify the story post it here?
Click to expand...

Actually, there is some evidence for a few of those things. You have written about some of it yourself.
 

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