A strong start - season 6

[will7782]

Let me understand this . . .

Now we are to believe someone constructed a waterproof vault (for lack of a better term) and submerged it in a much larger flooded chamber 150 feet below ground and it is able to bob around in there freely?

no. that is all your imagination. throwing out an absurd idea and then suggesting that it is someone else's idea, is trolling. you're playing the mole game.

 

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[n2mini]

I for one I'm not saying that is how it happened. Just saying it is possible for "something" to be down there and be moved around in the muck. Could be a vault and doesn't have to be water tight, or just be a big rock...

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

no. that is all your imagination. throwing out an absurd idea and then suggesting that it is someone else's idea, is trolling. you're playing the mole game.

Is that your answer? Sounded more like an accusation. And not on-topic.

Who's trolling now?

I asked a pretty valid question based on what I had read in the prior few posts. Still don't understand how it could be so.

Do you know how much force it would take to displace, say, a four foot cubic object in mud or "quicksand" (presumably in over four atmospheres of pressure if it is 150 ft deep)? An anchor with four square feet of area buried under two feet of mud will hold about 6,000 pounds pressure if pulled at about 20 degrees angle (like trying to tip a "vault" in the muck). How much does that drill bit exert?

 

[will7782]

I did read what you wrote.. The "vault/chest/box" was "allegedly" 7 foot high!.. There is NO WAY you can push a 7 foot high square concrete box into solid ground or clay without displacing what ever it is being pushed into. This is not cake... Cake is not solid it can be compressed.. Solid ground/clay/mud cannot be compressed.. You try it.... It must have somewhere to go in order to move out of the way of something large being pushed into it...

The land they are digging in is tightly compressed glacial till.. This is very dense earth..



https://www.oakislandcompendium.ca/blockhouse-blog/10x-and-glacial-till-and-dan-henskee

Further highlighted by the problems they were having when diffing 10x



They did not speculate that they had broken a section of the box off as they did not find any evidence in the tailings... I agreed with you in the sense that the drill would of smashed the box to pieces if it came into contact with it.... However the Laginas speculated they had pushed a 7 foot squarish concrete box of into the solid earth...This is what I have said is not possible...

you DID NOT read what I wrote. i said NOTHING about 7' boxes. feel free to not respond to my posts, as you clearly do not read what i say. you read what you want to hear.

 

[will7782]

Is that your answer? Sounded more like an accusation. And not on-topic.

Who's trolling now?

I asked a pretty valid question based on what I had read in the prior few posts. Still don't understand how it could be so.

Do you know how much force it would take to displace, say, a four foot cubic object in mud or "quicksand" (presumably in over four atmospheres of pressure if it is 150 ft deep)? An anchor with four square feet of area buried under two feet of mud will hold about 6,000 pounds pressure if pulled at about 20 degrees angle (like trying to tip a "vault" in the muck). How much does that drill bit exert?

read what i wrote. you are trying, unsuccessfully, to put words in my mouth.

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Actually, there were several other mouths who had mentioned something displaced by the bit. Whether water, mud, "cake" or quicksand surrounding the vault, rock, ice-cube or apple.


To take you literally I believe we can dismiss it is a rock buried cake as unlikely.

Unless it is like THE ADMIRAL's fruitcake, and then the core drill would have jumped into the rock with great relief.

 

[will7782]

actually, I take responsibility for what ONLY I say. you have not taken the time to think of what I posted.

the "rock in a cake" was a way to visualize that a solid object could get shoved around in a less dense environment. to say otherwise is just foolish.

 

[gazzahk]

actually, I take responsibility for what ONLY I say. you have not taken the time to think of what I posted.

the "rock in a cake" was a way to visualize that a solid object could get shoved around in a less dense environment. to say otherwise is just foolish.

Will the point is that under oak Island where the Laginas are digging is not quicksand or something similar... All the core samples they have brought up show solid earth. Not one of them has shown "quicksand" like material... What they recovered from the claw grab at that depth was solid earth not some big mass of loose watery ground. You are theorizing that a 7 foot high concrete box could be pushed into solid earth (At most solid clay). But even then the clay has only been from the bottom of the shaft Much deeper not the 150 ft level. Not at the side of the shaft where they are digging. This material is glacial till (this is well documented in the links provided).. Even if there was wet clay at this depth it could not just have a 7 foot concrete box pushed into it without the clay having somewhere to go. There has been ZERO evidence of any other soil type found. NO ONE has found voids down there full of loose watery sand..

So what exactly is the point you are trying to make... You seem to be arguing that this very large box can just be pushed into the ground. There is No evidence a box even exists. The Laginas have found NO EVIDENCE that a box/chest /vault even exists... No one that has drilled the multiple holes there since 1897 has EVER FOUND any evidence of "Chappels Vault" No one drilling there has found evidence of "Quicksand" like substance buried there..

Even Chapel was never able to find any other evidence of what he thought was a vault with the multiple other holes he dug...

There is zero point talking about what substances can be moved by what. The discussion needs to be about what actually exists and what has been found by the Lagians… The Laginas are not claiming "quicksand" like substances there.. They are claiming the vault "may have been" pushed into the solid earth... This would not be possible...

So forget the 'theoretical" of what can be pushed into cake/water/quicksand. Do you really believe a 7 foot concrete box can be pushed into solid earth or at most solid clay buy a rotating caisson?

Then you take issue when others say this is not possible by coming up with substances where you believe it may be possible to push this very large box off to the side by a couple of feet (as illustrated with the Laginas computer generated images) ie about a third of the chest is pushed away on their graphic.. That is 2 feet of box.

So I ask you do you believe that a previous undiscovered cavity of quicksand like stuff exists around the "vault" or not. If not what is the point you are trying to make?

 

[etex]

They used a coconut fiber boat to bring in the quicksand

 

[b3y0nd3r]

Will the point is that under oak Island where the Laginas are digging is not quicksand or something similar... All the core samples they have brought up show solid earth. Not one of them has shown "quicksand" like material... What they recovered from the claw grab at that depth was solid earth not some big mass of loose watery ground. You are theorizing that a 7 foot high concrete box could be pushed into solid earth (At most solid clay). But even then the clay has only been from the bottom of the shaft Much deeper not the 150 ft level. Not at the side of the shaft where they are digging. This material is glacial till (this is well documented in the links provided).. Even if there was wet clay at this depth it could not just have a 7 foot concrete box pushed into it without the clay having somewhere to go. There has been ZERO evidence of any other soil type found. NO ONE has found voids down there full of loose watery sand..

So what exactly is the point you are trying to make... You seem to be arguing that this very large box can just be pushed into the ground. There is No evidence a box even exists. The Laginas have found NO EVIDENCE that a box/chest /vault even exists... No one that has drilled the multiple holes there since 1897 has EVER FOUND any evidence of "Chappels Vault" No one drilling there has found evidence of "Quicksand" like substance buried there..

Even Chapel was never able to find any other evidence of what he thought was a vault with the multiple other holes he dug...

There is zero point talking about what substances can be moved by what. The discussion needs to be about what actually exists and what has been found by the Lagians… The Laginas are not claiming "quicksand" like substances there.. They are claiming the vault "may have been" pushed into the solid earth... This would not be possible...

So forget the 'theoretical" of what can be pushed into cake/water/quicksand. Do you really believe a 7 foot concrete box can be pushed into solid earth or at most solid clay buy a rotating caisson?

Then you take issue when others say this is not possible by coming up with substances where you believe it may be possible to push this very large box off to the side by a couple of feet (as illustrated with the Laginas computer generated images) ie about a third of the chest is pushed away on their graphic.. That is 2 feet of box.

So I ask you do you believe that a previous undiscovered cavity of quicksand like stuff exists around the "vault" or not. If not what is the point you are trying to make?

We cannot know what is there. All we have are vague descriptions like the three blind men and the elephant. It's best to just look at the information as puzzle pieces(some don't even belong to this puzzle).

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Two blind men, anyhow.

And the elephant in the room is that they should be talking to archeologists, geologists and local well drillers instead of crackpot theorists.

But then it would have been a 45 minute single episode show (maybe even a documentary) instead of stretching six or seven(?) seasons.

 

[MikeN]

Even if there was wet clay at this depth it could not just have a 7 foot concrete box pushed into it without the clay having somewhere to go. There has been ZERO evidence of any other soil type found. NO ONE has found voids down there full of loose watery sand..

Unless the object was located in a water cavern, as in the cavern at 10X - the diver reported about a foot of muck at the bottom of a chamber of water.

 

[n2mini]

and they have found plenty of voids in most of the drill holes. Just saying, it's not all solid earth under there...

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Possibly caused by trapped glacial ice, that eventually melted, allowing the surface to subside some, giving the impression (depression?) of a pit.

Long before people started messing around on the island.

That would be the simplest answer.

 

[Robot]

Oh Charlie...Elephants Were Not...Indigenous ...To Oak Island?

Two blind men, anyhow.

And the elephant in the room is that they should be talking to archeologists, geologists and local well drillers instead of crackpot theorists.

But then it would have been a 45 minute single episode show (maybe even a documentary) instead of stretching six or seven(?) seasons.

 

[will7782]

you are wrong. I have never theorized about a vault, prove me wrong. please pay attention to what I SAY, NOT WHAT YOU WANT TO HEAR.

 

[Stretch Da Truth]

Wow, what did I start here?
I just thought it was absurd to follow along with the cartoons of the caisson pushing the vault to the side. Others here have offered up info on how hard that is, how much force is needed and other useful info.

If you have been watching the show, they have had many, many, many core samples where we SEE them go through them and I don't recall ever seeing anything soft enough to displace "the Chapel vault". Hard glacial till & hard clay, maybe some granite in there too? Don't forget all the searcher tunnel wood scraps they find and that "Metal Hinge" that was from a buried treasure chest!

Didn't the sonic blast map come up with nothing? The big void over the latrine was sand so we cant really trust that data.... plus they kinda dismissed it on the show.

Mainly I was bringing up how the Displaced Chapel vault cause a disturbance and when Searcher 6 collapsed all the goodies from the MP settled in a huge debris field that they have pulled NOTHING up from all the holes and Hammer grab pulls. Yet, they like to show that cartoon of all the goodies that "could" be there. Makes me laugh when I watch.

So, is the Chapel vault the same thing as the Money Pit? Or is the Money Pit a separate entity?
Or is the Money Pit the area and the Chapel vault is hidden in the Money Pit? I am soooooo confused!

 

[gazzahk]

I just thought it was absurd to follow along with the cartoons of the caisson pushing the vault to the side.Others here have offered up info on how hard that is, how much force is needed and other useful info.

Yep... You are correct it is absurd... Some people just do not want to listen....

 

[gazzahk]

So, is the Chapel vault the same thing as the Money Pit? Or is the Money Pit a separate entity?
Or is the Money Pit the area and the Chapel vault is hidden in the Money Pit? I am soooooo confused!

The legend has Chappel digging in what he thought was the original money pit and hitting what he speculated was a 7 foot high vault... Reports written 30 years later then suggested that Chappel "may have" found gold traces on the drill.

Another discovery made during that excavation only came to light many years following the summer of 1897. As indicated by Lamb, during that fateful excavation, drill operator William Chappell found traces of gold sediment on the auger after drilling into the Money Pit..... Chappell hid his valuable discovery from fellow crewmembers. It was not until 1931 that Chappell's findings would come to light.

https://www.oakislandmoneypit.com/

It is also questionable as to whether Chapels group was actually digging in the actual pit as shown on this diagram



The most plausible explanation is that Chapel just drilled through an earlier searchers shaft. This would explain the 7 foot high void.

Therefore I would have to say the actual documented history would have the 'vault' separate from the pit as it seems that Chappel group was not actually digging in the pit (by 1897 no one new the actual location of the original pit it had been lost.) Chappels group of treasure searchers were just guessing when sinking there multiple shafts looking for the pit/treasure..

It is just later newspaper reports that have drawn the picture like everything ever found there (or reported to have been found) have all come from the same hole. This is not the case...

Chappel (or anyone else that was involved in the drilling operation at the time) did not say at the time he found something that looked like gold on the drill. This was allegedly kept secret by Chapel and only reported over 30 years later (In relation to raising money for another search)…

No one else since then has found any evidence of a 7 foot high concrete box with the hundreds of drill holes sunk before the Laginas arrived.

The Laginas pattern drilling never found any evidence of a 7 foot high concrete box even though they drilled the whole area where Chappel was drilling (This location was known)... All anyone has found is wood from previous search tunnels...

 

[MikeN]

Not a bad episode tonight - we got to see another exciting day dawn on Oak Island. The alien ship that is parked in the void at the bottom of H8 sent out damaging waves that broke the watertight seals on the sonic surveying unit. But the brief sonic survey showed a shaped void near the 180 mark. Bring on the hammer grab!

And is the 'concrete wall' just the concrete injected by Robert Restall in 1961 in an attempt to plug the flood tunnels, and formed into a wall by the box drains as it blew out to sea?