Great Seal Button Backmarks Help

[Bigcypresshunter]

I am assembling a list of US Army Great Seal button backmarks 1902-present.. This seems to be the most complete list available anywhere. With the help of TN members, I am occasionally adding and improving upon it. So far I have over 100 different backmarks. Anyone with a Great Seal button backmark or backmark variation not listed please post the pic and Ill add it. The thread is already so long its not necessary to add anything already pictured. Thanks.

This is how it all started:


I bought 2 bags of small Great Seal of US buttons for a buck at a flea market. Can someone help me date these backmarks? I believe they are all post 1902. I cant find anything else online.

1- Top row SCOVILL MF'G CO WATERBURY (back ungilted)
2- SCOVILL MF'G CO WATERBURY
3- Bottom CITY BUTTON WORKS - N.Y.
4- WATERBURY BUTTON CO.

 

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[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Button Date Help

no replies?


My City Button Works may be WWI but the Scovills have me confused. According to internet research, this backmark is documented as a 1850-1865 production mark.

http://cgi.ebay.com.my/SCOVILL-Mf-g...1850-1865_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQitemZ250355537335


I am pleasantly surprised that these NY buttons may be "rare" WWI and mine are mint.

http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache...BUTTON+WORKS+-+N.Y."&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=8&gl=us
http://cgi.ebay.com/WWI-VINTAGE-MIL...temQQimsxZ20090109?IMSfp=TL090109114002r19699

 

[trikikiwi]

Re: Button Date Help

That is a seriously nice haul of buttons. BigCH
I know so little about buttons, but i'm learning all the time from the learned here on TNet.


Mike

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Button Date Help

That is a seriously nice haul of buttons. BigCH
I know so little about buttons, but i'm learning all the time from the learned here on TNet.


Mike

I figured what the hell for a buck. I thought they were modern and I have been tossing them in the surf to see were they end up in my thixotropic sand movement testing. I didnt know they were old until I noticed the different backmarks. Im still trying to get a date on the Scovills and Waterburys. Somebody here should know.

 

[detector de metales]

Re: Button Date Help

wow you could throw a few my way! Instead of wasting em in the surf!
Now you know zlincolns are better at that test than good buttons.. LOL
J2
Hopefully some one with Button knowledge galore will answer you!

 

[Woodland Detectors]

Re: Button Date Help

well, lets see if we can get these ID"D

 

[Cajunme]

Re: Button Date Help

these were used from wwI thru wwII until now. there are afew in the button book but for the most part they are new.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Button Date Help

these were used from wwI thru wwII until now. there are afew in the button book but for the most part they are new.

Yes, I realize they are all post 1902. I would like to better date the backmarks. Does your book say anything?

 

[done dug it all up]

Re: Button Date Help

dasalottabuttons

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Button Date Help

Since I started this thread, I have found several other Great Seal button backmarks. Here is a list so far (may have errors)


1- SCOVILL MF'G CO WATERBURY (back ungilted)
2- SCOVILL MF'G CO WATERBURY
3- WATERBURY BUTTON CO. *
4- CITY BUTTON WORKS - N.Y.- (WWI)
5- CITY BUTTON WORKS- NEW YORK- 1877-1955
6- US PRODUCTS CORP
7- R. LIEBMANN MFG CO (WWI)
8- R.L. MFG Co Newark N.J.
9- THE AUSTIN CO. PROVIDENCE R.I.
10- WATERBURY COS INC CONN modern
11- W W W W (waterbury) modern
12- D. EVANS CO. ATTLESBORO, MASS. 1902- WWII
13-ARNSTEIN, SIMON & CO. S.F.

 

[east tx digger]

Re: Button Date Help

Nice find for a buck. HH

 

[thrillathahunt]

Re: Button Date Help

Big, I don't know anything about buttons...but know a good deal when I see one. Abuck?? WOW.

Rick

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Button Date Help

I added a few more to the list of Great Seal Buttons.

1- SCOVILL MF'G CO WATERBURY (back ungilted)
2- SCOVILL MF'G CO WATERBURY
3- WATERBURY BUTTON CO. *
4- CITY BUTTON WORKS - N.Y.- (WWI)
5- CITY BUTTON WORKS- NEW YORK- 1877-1955
6- US PRODUCTS CORP
7- R. LIEBMANN MFG CO (WWI)
8- R.L. MFG Co Newark N.J.
9- THE AUSTIN CO. PROVIDENCE R.I.
10- WATERBURY COS INC CONN modern
11- W W W W (waterbury) modern
12- D. EVANS CO. ATTLESBORO, MASS. 1902- WWII
13- ARNSTEIN SIMON (& CO.) * S.F. *

 

[Moe (fl)]

Re: Button Date Help

BigCypressHunter,

You may have seen this link already but just in case. It has lots of button backmarks with their dates.

http://pw1.netcom.com/~jimyce/bm.html

HH!
-Moe

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Button Date Help

BigCypressHunter,

You may have seen this link already but just in case. It has lots of button backmarks with their dates.

http://pw1.netcom.com/~jimyce/bm.html

HH!
-Moe

That link does not apply to more modern Great Seal buttons or is in error. If you notice under Scovill I have the same SCOVILL MF'G CO WATERBURY backmark but Great Seal buttons are post 1902.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Button Date Help

Updated list of US Great Seal button backmarks:


1- SCOVILL MF'G CO WATERBURY (back ungilted)
2- SCOVILL MF'G CO WATERBURY
3- WATERBURY BUTTON CO. *
4- CITY BUTTON WORKS - N.Y.- (WWI)
5- CITY BUTTON WORKS- NEW YORK- 1877-1955
6- US PRODUCTS CORP
7- R. LIEBMANN MFG CO (WWI)
8- R.L. MFG Co Newark N.J.
9- THE AUSTIN CO. PROVIDENCE R.I.
10- WATERBURY COS INC CONN modern
11- W W W W (waterbury) modern
12- D. EVANS CO. ATTLESBORO, MASS. 1902- WWII
13- ARNSTEIN SIMON (& CO.) * S.F. *
14- N.S. MEYERS * NEW YORK *
15- AMERICAN BUTTON CO. *NEWARK N.J.*
16- AMERICAN EMBLEM CO. UTICA N.Y. (WWI)

 

[BuckleBoy]

Re: Button Date Help

BigCypressHunter,

You may have seen this link already but just in case. It has lots of button backmarks with their dates.

http://pw1.netcom.com/~jimyce/bm.html

HH!
-Moe

That link does not apply to more modern Great Seal buttons or is in error.  If you notice under Scovill I have the same SCOVILL MF'G CO  WATERBURY backmark but Great Seal buttons are post 1902. 

That backmark was used during the CW, post-CW, Indian Wars, Turn of the Century, early 20th c. ... 

The deciding factor is the Size of the lettering on the backmark, the presence of one ring or two, or a dotted ring around the shank, etc.  Do you have a copy of Tice's book?  If so, check out the Plates in the beginning of the book.  If not, I'll try to make some time to do a little work on this for you.  Eve though Tice doesn't list buttons made after the CW, in his preliminary remarks about dating buttons, he lists backmarks and rough time frames for the big producers. 

Waterbury Button Co. is 20th c. for sure...but I'll look up the exact dates later for you. Time to hit the sack...


-Buckles

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Button Date Help

BigCypressHunter,

You may have seen this link already but just in case. It has lots of button backmarks with their dates.

http://pw1.netcom.com/~jimyce/bm.html

HH!
-Moe

That link does not apply to more modern Great Seal buttons or is in error. If you notice under Scovill I have the same SCOVILL MF'G CO WATERBURY backmark but Great Seal buttons are post 1902.

That backmark was used during the CW, post-CW, Indian Wars, Turn of the Century, early 20th c. ...

The deciding factor is the Size of the lettering on the backmark, the presence of one ring or two, or a dotted ring around the shank, etc. Do you have a copy of Tice's book? If so, check out the Plates in the beginning of the book. If not, I'll try to make some time to do a little work on this for you. Eve though Tice doesn't list buttons made after the CW, in his preliminary remarks about dating buttons, he lists backmarks and rough time frames for the big producers.

Waterbury Button Co. is 20th c. for sure...but I'll look up the exact dates later for you. Time to hit the sack...


-Buckles

I think it should say 1855- 1965. Possibly a typo.

 

[BuckleBoy]

Re: Button Date Help

BigCypressHunter,

You may have seen this link already but just in case. It has lots of button backmarks with their dates.

http://pw1.netcom.com/~jimyce/bm.html

HH!
-Moe

That link does not apply to more modern Great Seal buttons or is in error. If you notice under Scovill I have the same SCOVILL MF'G CO WATERBURY backmark but Great Seal buttons are post 1902.

That backmark was used during the CW, post-CW, Indian Wars, Turn of the Century, early 20th c. ...

The deciding factor is the Size of the lettering on the backmark, the presence of one ring or two, or a dotted ring around the shank, etc. Do you have a copy of Tice's book? If so, check out the Plates in the beginning of the book. If not, I'll try to make some time to do a little work on this for you. Eve though Tice doesn't list buttons made after the CW, in his preliminary remarks about dating buttons, he lists backmarks and rough time frames for the big producers.

Waterbury Button Co. is 20th c. for sure...but I'll look up the exact dates later for you. Time to hit the sack...


-Buckles

I think it should say 1855- 1965. Possibly a typo.

Could be, but I just use the books when I can. I don't trust the net. Again, with that backmark--it's the Size of the letters, and other features that determines the date range.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Re: Button Date Help

Could be, but I just use the books when I can. I don't trust the net. Again, with that backmark--it's the Size of the letters, and other features that determines the date range.

ok thanks