Not Fake News

[Goldwasher]

This is direct info from someone to me. So, I don't want to hear anything about pushing for donors.

Sunday a guy stopped in the store. He is a coach for kids soccer, they practice at a park by the river.

He was asking if I had a map of closed claims. I was telling him why there wasn't . Letting him know how he can find public lands and how to check for current claims. Talking about MLM etc.

I started to lose him when I was using words like township..range....section...you know stuff like that.

He lives up by me. I asked where. He mentions he is off of Johnstown creek. All private land in the area. Says part of the creek is on his land.
Theres gold in that creek. I ask why don't you work there first ?

Says he was until the "Forest Service" showed up.

"Forest service? your on private land"

He says " I mean fish and game"
He was running a generator to power a shop vac. A neighbor called Dept. of F and W on him.

The officer told him what he was doing was illegal and he told him to stop so he did.

Obviously I told him what I though about it..and what he should have said and what I would have said and done.

he grabbed one of my cards we talked for a while. I recognized him from school functions or other sports. I'm gonna head down next time there are games and get contact info from him. Maybe I'll go run a crack vac on his creek until the green suit shows up.

This isn't the first story of an interesting interaction with F&W since 637 that I've heard a first hand account I have been told.
Where the LEO left with no citation given, even though the individual was admonished that what they were doing was illegal.

It's only a matter of time before I'm sharing my own interaction I'm pretty sure of it.Though it will be dependent on some busy body calling.
F&W has no reason to be where I'm at otherwise.

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

Family Maps of Hinds County, Mississippi, Deluxe Edition - Grab it through Amazon!

[Reed Lukens]

Crack Vac? I think I'd run a 9hp highbanker with the muffler pulled off. He should let them know that they are trespassing next time, ask them to leave, and let the Sheriff set them straight if needed. I'm glad that we don't have neighbors like that here...

 

[nh.nugget]

Crack Vac? I think I'd run a 9hp highbanker with the muffler pulled off. He should let them know that they are trespassing next time, ask them to leave, and let the Sheriff set them straight if needed. I'm glad that we don't have neighbors like that here...

A Harley powered one on fuel! LOL! I got a neighbor like that in my neighborhood he gets burn-outs at 6am.

 

[MadMarshall]

I doubt there is any walk of life or pursuit that ignorance isn't taken advantage of. If this individual was educated in his chosen pursuit and in property ownership I suspect this wouldn't even be a story..
But alas here we are at the very (heartbeat of mining rights groups.) But anyway, no citation no nothing other then someone bein duped due to ignorance. It s by no means right.... but honestly just a common thing in all walks of life. I hope he takes it upon himself to educate himself and arm himself with his responsibility of his pursuits.. Or maybe a mining rights org is in his future and forgo any personal responsibility..

Anyway I'm sure stories like these are good to dredge up emotion and sympathy towards a cause .. but for me I see that it wasn't worth the individuals time to bother knowing so why should I concern myself with something they never bothered with. I'm not an activist after all.. Its not like the information aint readily available and plenty of avenues arnt open to the inquiring mind.. Just like anything and everything else whether you are opening a restaurant or mining ..... laws and crap apply.. even property ownership laws and crap applies due to many different circumstances.. People who take it upon themselves and be knowledgeable in their pursuits usually don't have antidotes like these to share..

Now case in point GW if you do pursue trying to get an encounter with an agency I am willing to bet that your story will be comparably different and I am also willing to bet you will continue with your chosen activity after the encounter.. AWWWWWWWWWW the power of knowledge.. But who knows maybe you may go to jail.. I suppose nothing is ever certain but I'm still willing to bet your knowledge of your pursuits changes the game...
Anyway
Now show me an individual who is versed in the laws of their pursuits and show me that they were shut down under an interpretation of SB637.

 

[Laz7777]

if you read my sig, it explains a lot of what's happening in this country.
now, I'm no right-winger or left-winger for that matter (need a right and left wing to fly the cuckoo bird), but I'm for responsible mining, which includes dredges and other motorized gear.
my friend has a bumper sticker: "Gold built it, Green destroyed it", which is an apt description...

this F&G ranger just trespassed when he stopped your friend from using his vac on his private property. powered gear on private property is not allowed? since when?

we've allowed them too much power and the more they get away with incidents like this, which is clearly illegal, the more they'll take advantage.

 

[Aufisher]

Last time a guy in green suit magically appeared my dog got scared and tried to shred the poor fellow.

 

[bug]

Ah the sacred riparian zone. I have also seen fish and game shut down private property owners clearing land too close to creeks.
They seem to have some diplomatic immunity when it comes to waterways, even if on private land. I dont know the laws myself, but that's what I have observed round here.

 

[Goldwasher]

Couple points.

Private land. You fall under ordinances. And state law.

Dept. of Fish and Wildlife or Fish and Wildlife. Well, hate to break it to you but, they don't need a warrant to do what they do. If they suspect anything they can "legally" get all up in your BIZ!

I am not in the pursuit of getting hassled, cited and most certainly no plan on going to jail.

Guy is not my friend. he was someone who came into my store and we ended up talking about the interaction.

I did tell him what I would have told the LEO.

VIctor Holy cow man.. Lighten the hell up!! Seriously. The guy is a dad, guy with a job. And a daughter who plays soccer. He is a coach. as far as I (millions of others also ) am concerned. He should be able to go into his own damn back yard and suck dirt, out of a crack in a dry creek, in gold country. With out having a neighbor call a fella over to feign enforcing a law, that doesn't apply to his activity. Sucking dirt out of a crack seems to me , maybe to be...one of the most stupid bull$%$#$#@ thing to ever have someone show up and tell you NO NO NO..now you get a ticket I could ever imagine.

Fact is the LEO is the one who needs an education!

NEWS FLASH!! there's a really good reason soccer dad doesn't know about SB 637 or stream alteration permits or NPSDESDEFA EI EI O

He is random soccer dad and that is all. Gain some actual perspective at some point it will be helpful!!

I did not make this post to DREDGE up anything

I made it to share the fact that YES you can have some guy show up to where you are digging and cite some noodle on the wall law, to tell you you can't do,what you are doing, even though you can.

Yes, I do wish the guy had the "knowledge" to deal with the LEO.

I would get all upitty just because it was my land I can't really fault the guy for being civil in the face of UBER OPPRESSIVE DOUBLE SECRET PROBATION OPPRESSION

 

[Assembler]

How is the "Land private''?
Is or is not the "Land" a "Subdivision that is administration or disposal of the public domain" (29 States)? Does not "Waters" flow under the "High water mark" of the Johnstown creek? What authority does the "Fish and Game" have on the Johnstown creek under the "High water mark"?

 

[Assembler]

Crack Vac? I think I'd run a 9hp highbanker with the muffler pulled off. He should let them know that they are trespassing next time, ask them to leave, and let the Sheriff set them straight if needed. I'm glad that we don't have neighbors like that here...

It would be nice if the "Sheriff" would back you up however this will not happen in this case see my other posts as to some possible reasons why this will not happen.
Yes a "Title search" could answer some questions. Likely will not fine the "Title abstract or chain of Title" down at a 'Bank' that is handling a "Mortgage" compared to "Title abstract or chain of Title".
Ask yourself what started a "Title abstract or chain of Title"? It appears that the "State fish and game" is making the warnings to "Homeowners" about "Streams" the County may or may not update "county rules on what sort of mining you can do on your private land in El Dorado County. Per the county. This guy was no where near close as far as the county is concerned".
The sheriff wouldn't be able to do anything per that initial visit. After putting some paperwork together and some study on the part of the homeowner. The S.O. may be able to get the DFW to back off.
Not sure what the "S.O." is however keep us updated on this.
Does not "The State of California" Have a very big "Mining Case Law history" to take a look 'Within' about some of the above questions?
What is the difference between "Recreational vs. Mining"? What "Papers or Records" are used to answer these questions?

 

[Goldwasher]

A private parcel is not part of the public domain. It is private land with a title held by a bank or the guy I spoke with. I don't know where he is in his mortgage or if he has one.

It's his house. Creek in his back yard. I didn't ask if he knows if he has the mineral rights. That would be found out with a title search.Not a survey.

Water rights are old and tricky when it comes to downstream use. I have seen nothing in law that says you cant scrape cracks in your dry creek because of riparian rights. Certain levels of construction would trigger certain steps and permits to prevent pollution.

I have all the county rules on what sort of mining you can do on your private land in El Dorado County. Per the county. This guy was no where near close as far as the county is concerned.

He was doing nothing that would require a stream bed alteration permit from DFW.

This comes down to a DFW LEO trying to use the new Suction Dredging Law to stop something that isn't suction dredging.

With mal intent or lack of knowledge I do not know. Totally the wrong thing to focus on in my opinion.

Clarity of the law is what were after. The avenue we need to create

Assembler. You are commenting on the subject. yet, you are showing that you don't follow things very well. As usual your attempts to provide relevant input have fallen very very short.

DFW has jurisdiction to enforce all state laws in regards to wildlife and waterways regardless of land status.

When I said private land and he lives off of Johnstown Creek. That right there tells you he is on "Private Land"

All the mushmouth about surveys, mineral boundaries, public domain......just stop. You don't know what you are talking about. Even when you have the relevant info.

The sheriff wouldn't be able to do anything per that initial visit. After putting some paperwork together and some study on the part of the homeowner. The S.O. may be able to get the DFW to back off.

 

[IMAUDIGGER]

Sounds like you have a busy mind.
I'm not quite sure I follow your train of thought on this one.
Are you literally responding to yourself?

 

[winners58]

stop the post after post
if you are not specifically responding to a post it is the norm of posting on a forum to edit the post and just add to one post
no one is answering and you post more, people just start to tune you out, you might have something good to say but is ignored.

(edit) I'll just go back to ignore if you don't take a look at this bad habit

 

[Nitric]

I'm confused...

 

[Nitric]

I'm confused...

Why are you confused?

 

[Nitric]

Why are you confused?

I got lost in the topic!

 

[winners58]

I'm confused...

Why are you confused?

I got lost in the topic!

.
what was the topic?

 

[Nitric]

.
what was the topic?

Sry! I Just couldn't resist!

I'm usually the one that wanders way off topic in the threads. So, that had different ways of looking at it.

On the topic?

I would have a hard time with that. Not knowing law inside out? I may have stopped the first time I was told to. Then look it up ask questions for the second round. I'm kind of a "do what you want on your own land guy" so...It still would have went on!

"Yes Sir! Well? My wife was out here and she lost her ring. So...I'm trying to find it, I'm sure it was on our property. I'll stop as soon as I find it! Thanks! "

 

[Rail Dawg]

"I" am "now" "very confused" about "a subject" that "could possibly be answered" by "looking at" "what rights" a "property owner" has in "regards" to a "stream" that "crosses" his "property".

Nitric you "got me laughing".

Thanks!

 

[Nitric]

The topic is not real clear. This one asked some questions to maybe help make the topic a little more clear. What one decides to declare or state to "The Fish and Game" is one topic. The "Answers" to possible "Citation papers and Court appearances / Fines etc." can be another topic. The two are different topics unless this one missed something here.

Excellent point about the "Wife lost her ring" and the attempt to find it with a "Shop vac" is well taken as this could take years.
Thanks.

No..That's almost too much nonsense to go through on our own lands...My property, my creek, no questions.....Just have to change what I'm searching for?

"My wife lost her ring, it slipped right off in the cold water, falling into a crack in the rock. I'm just trying to find her ring!!! After all I'm sick of hearing about it from her ,Officer. You understand, don't you?" "I won't be able to get a nights quiet sleep until I find this ring!!!"

Or something along those lines....And hopefully? He will start digging out the cracks for me, by the time I'm done!