Question on home protection firearms

[Honest Samuel]

Must have guns for protection.

 

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[pepperj]

Dude, even their wildlife is peaceful and no reason to use force.

No reason to getting jealous, we have some mean critters that debowel a dog in one swipe. You do need to be packing when dealing with them.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fisher_(animal)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolverine

 

[CHUCK IN PA]

A pistol grip on a shotgun makes a follow up shot near impossible for someone not familiar with the recoil generated.

 

[TerryC]

I have always thought that a shotgun would be best for home, you won't be aiming a half mile away

Pump shotgun (most reliable) number 6 birdshot in the house (will not go through most walls) and no.4 buck for around the house (why shoot only 9 00 when you can shoot 27 4buck?) ╦╦Ç

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

I disagree (respectfully) and say a double is more reliable than a pump.

I had a redoubtable Ithaca M37 pump jamb and I had to remove the barrel to clear it. Cost me a deer. First slug hit a strand of barbed wire in a swamp and the deer stood there looking at me as I tried to clear it. Happily deer don't shoot back.

 

[Duckshot]

I disagree (respectfully) and say a double is more reliable than a pump.

I had a redoubtable Ithaca M37 pump jamb and I had to remove the barrel to clear it. Cost me a deer. First slug hit a strand of barbed wire in a swamp and the deer stood there looking at me as I tried to clear it. Happily deer don't shoot back.

Haha. I own a bunch of sxs and a couple o/u. They cant malfunction until you try to fire the second shot, but they can malfunction. Unless its a double trigger, not much can go wrong with those. Then so long as you got only two shots you are probably going to want ejectors, and the reliability of automatic ejectors over extractors kills the deal.

My duck gun of choice is an old pump.

 

[TerryC]

I disagree (respectfully) and say a double is more reliable than a pump.

I had a redoubtable Ithaca M37 pump jamb and I had to remove the barrel to clear it. Cost me a deer. First slug hit a strand of barbed wire in a swamp and the deer stood there looking at me as I tried to clear it. Happily deer don't shoot back.

Duckshot has got a point there, Charlie. I was thinking Winchester Mod 12 (pre 64) or a Remington 870. A Mossberg 500A is right up there too. ╦╦Ç

 

[TerryC]

A pistol grip on a shotgun makes a follow up shot near impossible for someone not familiar with the recoil generated.

I will assume you mean no shoulder stock? ╦╦Ç

 

[TerryC]

Here's a tip for the uninformed.... The 870 is notorious for having a round slip down past the gate if it is lamely pushed into the magazine. No more trying to use a knife to push it back up. Simply drop to one knee and JAM the bottom of the stock on a firm surface and the slide will push past the round. Ready to go in seconds! ╦╦Ç

 

[Kace]

I highly recommend either the Remington 870 or Mossberg 500 'Street Sweeper' style 12ga with 00 Buck. Six Rounds. Open Choke.

If you go that way, keep in mind with the pistol grip in the back, when fired, the gun will not only kick back like normal but up too. The front pistol grip or holding down the heat shield on the barrel keeps the barrel from flying up. Kind of push the pistol grip {stock} forward to keep it from coming back hard and hitting you/her or flying out of your/her hand when firing.

Shotguns, in my opinion are the best for home protection...Even if you are startled, just point in the area of the intruder and pull the trigger..

I have cameras, high fencing, gates etc and those home protection guns just give an added security. I'm sure CC has been mentioned and that's a great idea when out of your home too.

I didn't read all the posts, sorry if I repeated others.

I'm sorry about the tragedies you've experienced. I hope getting home protection helps some to ease anxiety.

Kace

 

[TerryC]

I highly recommend either the Remington 870 or Mossberg 500 'Street Sweeper' style 12ga with 00 Buck. Six Rounds. Open Choke.

If you go that way, keep in mind with the pistol grip in the back, when fired, the gun will not only kick back like normal but up too. The front pistol grip or holding down the heat shield on the barrel keeps the barrel from flying up. Kind of push the pistol grip {stock} forward to keep it from coming back hard and hitting you/her or flying out of your/her hand when firing.

Shotguns, in my opinion are the best for home protection...Even if you are startled, just point in the area of the intruder and pull the trigger..

I have cameras, high fencing, gates etc and those home protection guns just give an added security. I'm sure CC has been mentioned and that's a great idea when out of your home too.

I didn't read all the posts, sorry if I repeated others.

I'm sorry about the tragedies you've experienced. I hope getting home protection helps some to ease anxiety.

Kace

Hey Kace, I agree both the 870 and the 500 are very good choices but I do not agree with the load. A standard 00buck has 9 pellets, the mag load 12 pellets. Standard 4buck, 27(2 3/4 inch), and the mag load, 41 (3 inch). The 4buck is only a few thousands of an inch smaller than 00buck. At 50 yards, one or more fatal hits with 00buck is IFFY. Why not send 27 or 41 downrange to a target? use an OPEN cylinder bore. Regardless if using a FORWARD grip, backward grip, or neutral, 78 ft. lbs. of kick is difficult to hold down, even for us bigger guys, using a pistol grip. I prefer and recommend a standard stock against the shoulder for a quicker follow-up shot. ╦╦Ç

 

[pepperj]

Interesting how a 10ga. will put a lady down on her arse when firing it.

Throw those 12ga. aside when it's obvious that a 10ga. will blow the mellon apart.

 

[Kace]

Hey Kace, I agree both the 870 and the 500 are very good choices but I do not agree with the load. A standard 00buck has 9 pellets, the mag load 12 pellets. Standard 4buck, 27(2 3/4 inch), and the mag load, 41 (3 inch). The 4buck is only a few thousands of an inch smaller than 00buck. At 50 yards, one or more fatal hits with 00buck is IFFY. Why not send 27 or 41 downrange to a target? use an OPEN cylinder bore. Regardless if using a FORWARD grip, backward grip, or neutral, 78 ft. lbs. of kick is difficult to hold down, even for us bigger guys, using a pistol grip. I prefer and recommend a standard stock against the shoulder for a quicker follow-up shot. ╦╦Ç

Hi Terry...Sorry, I just didn't elaborate on the load..I use 3" Winchester Super X Magnum. If I remember right that's 15 pellets.

I agree with what you said on distance and the stock if you are outside the home. I only referenced the 870 and 500 for indoor home defense. I use Belgium Browning's Auto 5 12 & 20ga and the Sweet 16 bird hunting.

I use a Winchester NWTF Full Choke 3.5" Mag #4 for Turkey Hunting and the range, power and pattern I'm very happy with.

I like the pistol grip, I'm used to it and it's a lot shorter without the stock for indoor movements and protection. I kinda tried to put a warning on my first post because if you don't know the recoil at the back and front, the shooter can get hurt too. I let a friend try my 500, told her what to watch for and she didn't push forward when firing...the gun came back and hit her in the hip bone and dropped her..she had a hellacious bruise and would not ever fire that gun again.

I kinda hated recommending them here, but I'm a firm believer in those models for indoor protection. It might not be a good suggestion if you aren't familiar with guns and the recoil...

I think on home protection, thinking if you are sound asleep and someone breaks in...a handgun is not a good choice for anyone. If you have notice and can prepare...maybe. I'd still want to have a shotgun too. The driveway alarm, cameras and Rocco are great for early warning of visitors for me.

Probably just individual preferences. Thanks Terry for reminding me on the load.

Kace

 

[TerryC]

Hi Terry...Sorry, I just didn't elaborate on the load..I use 3" Winchester Super X Magnum. If I remember right that's 15 pellets.

I agree with what you said on distance and the stock if you are outside the home. I only referenced the 870 and 500 for indoor home defense. I use Belgium Browning's Auto 5 12 & 20ga and the Sweet 16 bird hunting.

I use a Winchester NWTF Full Choke 3.5" Mag #4 for Turkey Hunting and the range, power and pattern I'm very happy with.

I like the pistol grip, I'm used to it and it's a lot shorter without the stock for indoor movements and protection. I kinda tried to put a warning on my first post because if you don't know the recoil at the back and front, the shooter can get hurt too. I let a friend try my 500, told her what to watch for and she didn't push forward when firing...the gun came back and hit her in the hip bone and dropped her..she had a hellacious bruise and would not ever fire that gun again.

I kinda hated recommending them here, but I'm a firm believer in those models for indoor protection. It might not be a good suggestion if you aren't familiar with guns and the recoil...

I think on home protection, thinking if you are sound asleep and someone breaks in...a handgun is not a good choice for anyone. If you have notice and can prepare...maybe. I'd still want to have a shotgun too. The driveway alarm, cameras and Rocco are great for early warning of visitors for me.

Probably just individual preferences. Thanks Terry for reminding me on the load.

Kace

Good post, Kase. The person that DID NOT instruct that little lady on how to hold the shotgun should have his ass kicked! She was off balance, her shoulders behind her hips. Rear leg not well spread from forward leg. Needs a Little bit of crouch to lower center of gravity. Other Things. She could have been seriously and permanently injured. I was a police firearms instructor. I taught such things. Take care, Kase. ╦╦Ç

 

[pepperj]

Good post, Kase. The person that DID NOT instruct that little lady on how to hold the shotgun should have his ass kicked! She was off balance, her shoulders behind her hips. Rear leg not well spread from forward leg. Little bit of crouch set to lower center of gravity. Other Things. She could have been seriously and permanently injured. I was a police firearms instructor. I taught such things. Take care, Kase. ╦╦Ç

Good point about instruction on how to handle something that has a kick on it as the 10ga.
When I was young my buddy took out the double barrel 10ga. He told me that it kicked harder than a 12ga. and dared me to shoot. Still close to 50 yrs later I'll never forget squeezing off the first trigger while pressing the butt hard into the shoulder. Off it went and the recoil caused me to do the second trigger, but recoil also dislodged the butt from the shoulder so it was in mid-air. Though I hit the can as it flew up-total fluke! Buddy remarked that I was a pretty good shot. The bruising left some weeks later from the shoulder area, a great reminder for the next decade not to take on something bigger than I could handle.

 

[TerryC]

Good point about instruction on how to handle something that has a kick on it as the 10ga.
When I was young my buddy took out the double barrel 10ga. He told me that it kicked harder than a 12ga. and dared me to shoot. Still close to 50 yrs later I'll never forget squeezing off the first trigger while pressing the butt hard into the shoulder. Off it went and the recoil caused me to do the second trigger, but recoil also dislodged the butt from the shoulder so it was in mid-air. Though I hit the can as it flew up-total fluke! Buddy remarked that I was a pretty good shot. The bruising left some weeks later from the shoulder area, a great reminder for the next decade not to take on something bigger than I could handle.

Wear the bruise as a badge of honor! And don't let anyone know it hurts. Pain is part of the toys you play with. I busted a box of 00 one day and wore a bruise the size of a softball! Only I knew it hurt. Control the pain and you control the gun. Keep it up. The arthritis in my right arm is so painful, I now wear a cross draw for my Sig (I'm 68). I cannot lift my right arm up far enough to pull from a regular holster.... but nobody knows (knew) but me. Take care. ╦╦Ç

 

[Red James Cash]

I just had to put my two cents in here.First off to the antigun fools in here.You have two choices in life,be armed or be a victim.Thats the bottom line right there.Second unless you live alone and a mile or so from your nearest neighbor DO NOT use a rifle for home defense.Forget what you see on tv about people hiding behind car doors,brick walls,etc,its all hollywood fantasy.DO NOT use shotgun slugs for home defense unless you live alone and a mile or so from your nearest neighbor.A simple high velocity .22 will go through 2 1/2 2x6 inch pine boards,thats 5 and a half inches of wood penetrated by a 40 grain bullet fired from point blank range from a rifle.A 12 gauge slug is devastating.I once shot an old car I had to test penetration of a 12 gauge slug.I hit the car fro,right in the corner at a slight angle in the rear quarter panel.The slug penetrated the quarter panel,went through the brace the back of the back seat was attached to,went through the back seat,went through the front seat,went through the dash board,went through the fire wall,went through the wheel well,through the fender and exited out the drivers side head light.Use BB shot-goose shot in a home defense shotgun.

 

[TerryC]

I just had to put my two cents in here.First off to the antigun fools in here.You have two choices in life,be armed or be a victim.Thats the bottom line right there.Second unless you live alone and a mile or so from your nearest neighbor DO NOT use a rifle for home defense.Forget what you see on tv about people hiding behind car doors,brick walls,etc,its all hollywood fantasy.DO NOT use shotgun slugs for home defense unless you live alone and a mile or so from your nearest neighbor.A simple high velocity .22 will go through 2 1/2 2x6 inch pine boards,thats 5 and a half inches of wood penetrated by a 40 grain bullet fired from point blank range from a rifle.A 12 gauge slug is devastating.I once shot an old car I had to test penetration of a 12 gauge slug.I hit the car fro,right in the corner at a slight angle in the rear quarter panel.The slug penetrated the quarter panel,went through the brace the back of the back seat was attached to,went through the back seat,went through the front seat,went through the dash board,went through the fire wall,went through the wheel well,through the fender and exited out the drivers side head light.Use BB shot-goose shot in a home defense shotgun.

Good post. I would just change the goose load to No. 6 bird load. It will not go through most inside walls. ╦╦Ç

 

[Duckshot]

Does any manufacture even sell factory size BB lead shotshells anymore?

We used to rock geese back in day with lead BB, but now days it is all steel, bismuth or wolfram for waterfowl. I don't think it safe to use steel BB for defense in or around your house. Steel bounces off stuff instead of just flattening out when it can't penetrate.

 

[pepperj]

Does any manufacture even sell factory size BB lead shotshells anymore?

We used to rock geese back in day with lead BB, but now days it is all steel, bismuth or wolfram for waterfowl. I don't think it safe to use steel BB for defense in or around your house. Steel bounces off stuff instead of just flattening out when it can't penetrate.

Interesting article about pattern, lead, steel, 12ga, 410 vs 20ga. at a range of 40yrds. Considering your query about inside the home and shot bouncing off things. Considering most rooms in a house are under 10 yrds in length a direct hit is the answer, regardless of what it's hitting. 12ga at 5 yrs the pattern is so tight the it's going into or through most items in the house, and into the other room I'd be thinking.

https://www.fieldandstream.com/articles/hunting/2013/08/truth-about-shogun-ammo#page-7