Secrecy

[Geoseer]

Over the years I have learned a very valuable lesson, and because I see some of you making the same mistakes, I felt obligated to share.

Stop telling people about your plans and grand aspirations. Especially the profound or magical ones. You’re often just inviting their doubts, limitations, and negativity into your own mind, which has the devastating effect of dampening your enthusiasm and momentum. Most people won’t truly believe in what you’re doing until you show them results. And even then, very few will be genuinely proud or happy for you. Instead, many will only think "How can I get some of that for myself?"

I know we all crave that feeling of camaraderie and sharing our journey. But sadly, many people react with jealousy or envy when they see someone pulling ahead. It makes them feel inferior. They project their own limitations onto you, sometimes even disguising it as “concern.” Even family can do this.

“Doubt is the only force capable of disturbing the seed or impression; to avoid a miscarriage of so wonderful a child, walk in secrecy through the necessary interval of time that it will take the impression to become an expression. Tell no man of your spiritual romance. Lock your secret within you in joy, confident and happy that some day you will bear the son of your lover by expressing and possessing the nature of your impression. Then will you know the mystery of ‘God said, Let us make man in our image.'"

Lock your vision inside you with joy and confidence. When the time is right and you’ve brought it into reality, then decide who (if anyone) is worthy of hearing the full story.

“Let your plans be dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.”
— Sun Tzu, The Art of War​

 

[Carl-NC]

Most people won’t truly believe in what you’re doing until you show them results.

In my 27 years of following this forum, I've found that the reason so many dowsers are here discussing their methods is that they don't have a whole lot more to talk about. There are no results. While the guys with metal detectors are scooping up all sorts of goodies and posting pics, the guys with dowsing rods rarely find anything and when they do, a metal detectors is almost always involved.

 

[releventchair]

Well dang it. Cat's outta the bag now!

 

[Geoseer]

In my 27 years of following this forum, I've found that the reason so many dowsers are here discussing their methods is that they don't have a whole lot more to talk about. There are no results. While the guys with metal detectors are scooping up all sorts of goodies and posting pics, the guys with dowsing rods rarely find anything and when they do, a metal detectors is almost always involved.

Can I tell you that people aren't out here dowsing for pocket change and belt buckles? When a dowser is actually successful, you won't see it in the "Banner Finds" section. Ok? 😆 Guaranteed.

There is almost zero benefit for me to convince you or anyone else that dowsing can work, so I won't spend too much time on it. I will only say that for me, there has been a certain rate of undeniable accuracy. When it has been proven to be successful, it was beyond any doubt that it was solely a result of dowsing.

Consider the Swedish psychic Olof Jonsson, who testified under oath that he worked for former Philippine President Ferdinand Marcos to locate and recover 1,250 tons of gold bars. This is something that literally happened. Yet even he failed to produce accurate results 100% of the time. Dowsing is a human ability and human beings are imperfect.

To say that psychic abilities like this are impossible is to deny declassified findings by the CIA, that took tens of millions of dollars to produce. But I guess you know more than the CIA, thanks to your 27 years on TNet. 👍🏻

People can choose to live and be confined to a mediocre reality of limitations. Continue believing only in your $1k PI metal detectors and only ever recover a few coins. That's your right and I won't try to take that away from you.

After all, the world needs plenty of trash collectors.

 

[Red_desert]

Can I tell you that people aren't out here dowsing for pocket change and belt buckles? When a dowser is actually successful, you won't see it in the "Banner Finds" section. Ok? 😆 Guaranteed.

There is almost zero benefit for me to convince you or anyone else that dowsing can work, so I won't spend too much time on it. I will only say that for me, there has been a certain rate of undeniable accuracy. When it has been proven to be successful, it was beyond any doubt that it was solely a result of dowsing.

Consider the Swedish psychic Olof Jonsson, who testified under oath that he worked for former Philippine President Ferdinand Marcos to locate and recover 1,250 tons of gold bars. This is something that literally happened. Yet even he failed to produce accurate results 100% of the time. Dowsing is a human ability and human beings are imperfect.

To say that psychic abilities like this are impossible is to deny declassified findings by the CIA, that took tens of millions of dollars to produce. But I guess you know more than the CIA, thanks to your 27 years on TNet. 👍🏻

People can choose to live and be confined to a mediocre reality of limitations. Continue believing only in your $1k PI metal detectors and only ever recover a few coins. That's your right and I won't try to take that away from you.

After all, the world needs plenty of trash collectors., but so far none have been willing to give it a try.

Actually, there was a best year ever thread moved to Best of TN with the map dowsing credit to me a missing. He did mail me a good coin find of his so no problem. I also was told by owner of the Tayopa Mine complex that the photo and satellite images I remote viewed gave him the location for opening the entrance of the Lost Tayopa Mine. Of course, did the same marking the photo opening 3 old Roman gold mines in Bulgaria. I would offer the same for free to those working the 1715 leases but so far none have been willing to give it a try.

There is a big problem here with people trying to combine metal detecting 2-box detectors with dowsing because you end up digging moist mineral salts. I have gone to a small lake beach and made a sketch in my car and map dowsed it. Then walked to the spot first before turning on the detector. Scanning a small area less than 3 ft got a bunch of aluminum junk type signals. Put the detector down and with a few scoops with digging trowel up came jewelry.

Try going treasure hunting walking with a pair of dowsing rods. Cars will stop right where they are and be watching you. We had a map dowser on the forum here from the Philippines. He owned property with an old WW2 Japanese camp. When he walked through a house the dowsing rods responded, indicating back inside a room. The dug a WW2 cache from under that house. Soon as I made a post about his find, gave me a DM request for it to be deleted.

We don't have very many serious dowsing treasure hunters left here on the forum.

 

[Carl-NC]

Can I tell you that people aren't out here dowsing for pocket change and belt buckles? When a dowser is actually successful, you won't see it in the "Banner Finds" section.

I can't tell you how many times unsuccessful dowsers have told me that. The British Museum has a hall full of treasure hoards found around England. Ask the curator of that section how many of those hoards were found by dowsing. I did.

Olof Jonsson was a fraud and the CIA experiments were a failure. Yes, I will say that psychic abilities are impossible. Too many have consistently failed (or shown to be cheats) to believe otherwise.

 

[Geoseer]

I can't tell you how many times unsuccessful dowsers have told me that. The British Museum has a hall full of treasure hoards found around England. Ask the curator of that section how many of those hoards were found by dowsing. I did.

Olof Jonsson was a fraud and the CIA experiments were a failure. Yes, I will say that psychic abilities are impossible. Too many have consistently failed (or shown to be cheats) to believe otherwise.

Wait, why do you think you know how successful I or anyone else here has been? Nobody is reporting everything to you man 🤣 the world goes far beyond what you think you know. That I can tell you.

Olof Jonsson had multiple documented successes. Helped solve 13 murder cases by visiting crime scenes, located three missing women, advised a ship captain to avoid a German minefield etc etc. And you're saying he chose to stand in a Hawaiian court room (which ruled that the treasure was real) and blatantly lie under oath about the Marcos gold? Make it make sense.

U.S. government spent 23 years studying parapsychology programs before they all went black.

Again, it doesn't interest me at all to convince you otherwise. All the best.

 

[blauer]

Move along! Nothing to see here.....

 

[Red-Coat]

...Consider the Swedish psychic Olof Jonsson, who testified under oath that he worked for former Philippine President Ferdinand Marcos to locate and recover 1,250 tons of gold bars. This is something that literally happened....

No, he didn’t. Jonsson claimed to have psychically pinpointed locations such as Teresa in Rizal province and the Nachi site in the Philippines in informal interviews after the event. In court under oath he only testified that he had seen large quantities of gold already in the possession of President Marcos, after being invited to assist in finding more. He did not testify that he had been instrumental in finding it, nor in locating additional buried gold.. This is from the official proceedings of:

Roger ROXAS and The Golden Budha Corporation, a foreign corporation, Plaintiffs-Appellees/Cross-Appellants, v. Ferdinand E. MARCOS and Imelda Marcos, Defendants-Appellants/Cross-Appellees.
Supreme Court of Hawai`i.
November 17, 1998.

Robert Curtis, an American owner of a mining and refining business in Sparks, Nevada, testified that, in late 1974, he received a number of telephone calls from Norman Kirst, an associate of [President] Ferdinand, inviting him to travel to the Philippines to meet the president. Kirst stated that Ferdinand wanted Curtis's company to resmelt some gold bars and change the "hallmarks." Ferdinand also wanted Curtis to change the chemical composition of the gold while resmelting it so that its origin would not be identifiable. Curtis initially refused the invitation, but finally relented and traveled to the Philippines to meet with Ferdinand.

When he arrived, Curtis met with a number of Ferdinand's aides and generals, including General Ver. He also met with Colonel Lachica, who was "Imelda Marcos' personal security and went with her wherever she went." Colonel Lachica took part in the conversations about resmelting and "rehallmarking and purifying the gold". Finally, after approximately ten days, he met with Ferdinand, Olof Jonsson (another American, see infra), General Ver, and Kirst.

Ferdinand told Curtis that he had recovered an enormous amount of gold from the Yamashita treasure, which he had found at various sites, and that he needed help because the "International World Court had... passed a ruling that any ... World War II treasures that were recovered would revert back to the countries from ... whence they were taken." Ferdinand told him that he had so much gold that selling it could have a large effect on the world economy or even "start World War III."

Curtis also testified that General Ver had brought him to a basement room in the Marcoses' Miravelles summer palace, where the gold bars were kept. Curtis entered a room "about roughly 40 by 40," stacked to the ceiling with bars of gold. He estimated the ceiling to be ten feet high. Two or three four-foot wide aisles ran through the stacks of gold. The bars were in a standard seventy-five kilogram size. He noticed that the bars had "[o]riental markings" on them. Later, Ferdinand showed Curtis a solid gold buddha statue with a removable head, which Curtis identified from the pictures taken at Roxas's house as the same buddha that Roxas had discovered.

On cross-examination, Curtis testified that his study of the Yamashita treasure had suggested that the treasure contained eighteen buddhas and was distributed among 172 sites. He also testified that Ferdinand had told him that the gold that Curtis had seen had come from a site in the Luzon region. Moreover, in 1975, while Curtis was working with Ferdinand, another site was discovered in the town of Teresa, and more gold was retrieved.

Curtis and others began the work of designing and building a refinery in the Philippines to fulfill Ferdinand's requests. However, on July 5, 1975, General Ver took him to a military cemetery at Fort Bonafacio, walked him to a freshly-dug hole, and put a gun to his head, saying "[W]e're good friends but,] I'm sorry, I have to do this." Curtis was able to talk General Ver out of shooting him and then quickly left the Philippines. He did not return to the Philippines as long as Ferdinand remained in power.

Olof Jonsson also testified that he had seen stacks of gold bars. Jonsson testified that he had first traveled to the Philippines at the invitation of a colonel stationed at Clark Air Force Base. He was brought there to use his powers as a psychic to locate gold that the colonel believed to be buried there. Jonsson described his psychic powers as including telekinesis, clairvoyance, telepathy, and the power to dematerialize objects with his mind.

While he was in the Philippines, Jonsson was asked to meet Ferdinand. He was brought to Ferdinand's office in the Malacanang Palace. Ferdinand invited Jonsson to stay at a guest house on the palace grounds. After several weeks, Jonsson left the Philippines, but he returned in 1975 with Curtis when the latter had traveled to the Philippines in order to discuss resmelting gold with Ferdinand. On this occasion, Jonsson met again with Ferdinand and General Ver. General Ver showed him a basement room in the guest house outside Malacanang Palace and another room in the summer palace, both filled with gold. He was also shown a golden buddha in the summer palace that was too heavy for him to move. Jonsson described the basement room in the guest cottage as being approximately twenty feet wide, forty feet long, and twelve feet high. He estimated the room in the summer palace as measuring "probably 40 feet by 25 or something" and twelve feet in height. Both rooms were filled with two-foot-long bars of gold stacked to the ceiling. Jonsson testified that it was possible that the bars were four inches wide and four inches thick, but that he could not recall exactly.

 

[pepperj]

Okay. Maybe he didn't admit to locating any of it in court,

 

[releventchair]

Okay. Maybe he didn't admit to locating any of it in court, but did admit to seeing it and his history of psychic success is clearly the only reason he would have been there or privy to anything related to the operation. Marcos would never have let him see the billions in gold bars and walk out of there alive if he had nothing else to contribute. So, quite obviously he was instrumental in locating it, as he said in his informal interview.

Regardless, the abilities we're debating are real. Extremely rare, but people with them do exist. Just because you don't have them or have never personally witnessed them work for anyone else doesn't change that fact. We can end the matter here as far as I'm concerned. Die hard skeptics are the most boring people on Earth.

You do understand that by being shown as not being factual by the above post your credibility is out the window?

I don't have to prove anything I claim!
Of course you don't.
Nor can you most of it.

I don't have to show you any evidence of my insinuations!
Nope. You don't.
You leave with the same zero evidence you started with.
On a forum with a banner of evidence as to make folks scream.
How many of which are dowse recoveries?
But yes lets keep it a secret lest people be convinced by evidence Vs unsubstantiated claims!

'Too many potatoes, too little meat! Farewell, Mr. Potato-King.'"

 

[Red_desert]

Here is Honorable Mentions for lost ring finds made by Jon (Teleprospector).

https://www.treasurenet.com/threads/a-dowsing-find.582135/post-5870563

 

[Red-Coat]

Olof Jonsson said that he helped locate the gold, whether in court or otherwise, the man was clearly deeply involved in the operation.

The gold (or at least a massive quantity of it) had already been retrieved by President Ferdinand and transferred to a basement room at the Summer Palace before Jonsson even arrived in the Phillippines or met Ferdinand (as per the testimony in court from Curtis and Jonsson himself).

There is no evidence that Jonsson played any part in finding it or located any further stashes, apart from his own unsubstantiated claims made in later interviews.

 

[Red_desert]

Post by treasure diver friends of mine who dowse


https://www.treasurenet.com/threads...y-that-made-me-a-believer.614658/post-6283930

 

[Red_desert]

Post by treasure diver friends of mine who dowse


https://www.treasurenet.com/threads...y-that-made-me-a-believer.614658/post-6283930

Recently Bruce his brother obtained ownership, of this same ring, but had to swap a couple of his valuable treasure coin finds.

I've always been skeptical of dowsing but I want it to be true. There was a story awhile back in American Digger magazine of a guy who went out with his buddies who were skeptical and told them where to detect using dowsing and they found a gold and emerald Spanish cross on the beach. Cool story. I tried my own method: I did this thing called Qigong while looking at a historical aerial of a spot that I detect. I went and detected there with my friends and I had a great day at this spot. Might not be linked but who knows. I guess sometimes you have to have a good day right?! Any advice on how to get into dowsing?
Click to expand...

The Spanish gold emerald ring was on display in one of the two places which end in Rico. I forgot whether it is Costa Rico or Puerto Rico, why I'd said in another country. To figure out where is hard because both were in Central America and the Caribbean. Of coarse, the best treasure was his brother's wife he met while in Central America. Sure they found coins, but those are only money which can be very slow in converting to cash.

Do your home work, study up and it won't take you long to learn dowsing.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Geo, your post was deleted, please post by our rules, no insults directed at members.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Okay. No worries. Yes, I ask anyone I offended to forgive me. I forgive them also. May everyone's joy be complete. 🙂

Thank you for understanding sir.👍

 

[WEF_Insect_Burger]

In many countries, doing metal detecting will get you into trouble, so what methods are left for people those countries? You guessed it.. dowsing.

It is the only tool left for many people, and costs no money, any person in his right mind can do a practical experiment or 2 to verify if it works for them,if you conducted experiments, and verified your capabilities, boom! Expect alot of people to hate on you, that is why you keep it quiet and do your own thing...

If you go and try to make money with dowsing services, you are fundamentally corrupted, great dowsers will teach and share their skills, even look at stuff for others, with no expectation.. If someone into dowsing is asking you for money, ask yourself what went wrong in their lives, they could be scamming, and these guys give real researchers and experimenters a bad name. If someone offers you, as dowser without any solicitation, you can choose to accept or participate of course, i suspect this how many of the best dowsers receive compensation.

Persons attacking dowsing on this forum, live and let live, nothing can convince a dowser otherwise, but distinguish between scammers and real researchers, smart people on this forum gave me books and ideas, without asking anything in return, since receiving the information and experimenting, i can say my dowsing has improved magnitudes,

Am i going to prove it here, never in my life, research projects of significance must never be revealed to the open internet, secrecy must be kept unless
you are planning on making significant donations, so dont expect any successful people to come out and prove their findings, the concepts of dowsing can be proven without revealing finds and forums like this is a good place to share ideas with other researchers.


I have quoted some info i found below, if you are going to lose all your finds and even the "legit' metal detectors are banned, then whats the use?
If someone is against dowsing, they probably also in favor of property owners losing their treasures they found on their own property, because dowsing + remote viewing is the ultimate expression of freedom.

Dowsing as a personal hobby is legal almost everywhere in the Western world. The risks arise when it's practiced commercially (fraud laws), in countries with broad anti-divination/witchcraft laws (parts of the Middle East and Africa)

Countries That Take It All (or Most)​

• Most of Europe (Spain, Italy, Bulgaria, Romania, Croatia, etc.): Metal detecting is outright prohibited in Bulgaria, Spain, Italy, Iceland, Luxembourg, Romania, Croatia, Moldova, Estonia, Malta, and Cyprus.
• UK underwater / shipwrecks: If you find a wreck, you'd likely be forced to hand it over to its original country of ownership or the territorial country — at best receiving a finder's fee of around 5% of the value.
• Finland: All discovered items 100 years or older become property of the state.
• India: Declaration to a revenue collector is mandatory, with penalties including imprisonment for non-compliance.

 

[dowser]

There must be a thing as DDS, "Dowsing derangement syndrome" were science doesn't matter only hate and geolously because Dowsing didn't work for them.
Did they ever wonder why?
Pay and ask something you believe, ask Grok if Radio frequencies can disrupt and cause interfearance with other radio Frequencies? They do!
Ask any Ai search, if Dowsing was real, can the Wi-Fi Frequencies cause Dowsing interference? Yes they do!
If Dowsing is the Dowsing of radio Frequencies, which it is, what perfect world do you live in, were radio Frequencies don't exist?
This Dowsing frequency thing is a fact, for L-rods Dowsing, my hobby..

 

[Red-Coat]

There must be a thing as DDS, "Dowsing derangement syndrome" were science doesn't matter only hate and geolously because Dowsing didn't work for them.
Did they ever wonder why?
Pay and ask something you believe, ask Grok if Radio frequencies can disrupt and cause interfearance with other radio Frequencies? They do!
Ask any Ai search, if Dowsing was real, can the Wi-Fi Frequencies cause Dowsing interference? Yes they do!
If Dowsing is the Dowsing of radio Frequencies, which it is, what perfect world do you live in, were radio Frequencies don't exist?
This Dowsing frequency thing is a fact, for L-rods Dowsing, my hobby..

What a crazy set of logic. The existence of radio frequencies is not in any doubt, nor is their ability to disrupt and cause interference with other frequencies. What your selective take from the AI generated answers isn’t mentioning is that the doubt revolves around the ability for those frequencies to be dowsed. Just because they exist doesn’t mean that dowsing can detect or interpret them.

When you ask AI “If Dowsing was real, can the Wi-Fi Frequencies cause Dowsing interference?” of course you’ll get an answer along the lines of “If dowsing were real, Wi-Fi frequencies could hypothetically cause interference [with various explanations of why].”

But, again, you’re being selective because if you ask AI whether dowsing is real, you’ll get an answer along the lines of “Dowsing is not considered real by the scientific community. Controlled scientific tests and double-blind experiments have consistently shown that divining or dowsing rods are no more effective than random chance at locating underground water, pipes, or minerals.”

That also underlines the fallacy of you statement that “science doesn’t matter” to those who doubt. The very opposite is true.

You might as well ask AI “If fairies are real, can they have wings?” or “if unicorns are real, would they have four legs and a horn?”