these must have had another use

[CASPER-2]

these finds were made by aquachigger the other day

they look mostly from the 1600 - 1700s
I am curious about the circled item
some think they are flintlock screws - but flintlock screws are usually iron/steel and
are threaded differently
the consensus from others that they are screws for furniture drawer plates
which I have seen screws from furniture from 1800s back that seem to match
my question is - does anyone know of a secondary purpose they may have been used
cause I have found like 5-6 of these and have seen many others posted on forums and found by friends
but they are found with no other hardware what so ever - and have found all mine in farm fields and a couple in fields that were old colonial fort sites and have to wonder if they used them for something else off of broken furniture
I guess they could be used as a tamper - but think there was some other purpose that they might have been carried - maybe they used them to clean their ears
any thoughts?

 

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[lonewolfe]

If you're finding them in fields far removed from fort/home sites (as some here stated they have many times)

then I would suggest the possibility of them being used as a carriage bolt of some type for plowing equipment or the like.

Cool digs!

HH

 

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[CRUSADER]

I know what the items are - that was not my question here -
alot of these items were most likely UK made in the 1600s early - 1700s and brought over
just like everything else back then - we did not have scrap /rag men in this country to a little latter on in our history
we did not have a ton of raw materials back then just yet and things were recycled till they had no use in them
I am from Ma. and been hitting colonial areas since 1975
I find many old brass, copper and lead items that started out as one thing and were turned into other items
or used for some other purpose -also the areas I hit had tons of indians and they took many items or traded for items and used them for their own purposes
We find small cups that were made from hammered coppers - I found a spoon that that was definitely made from something else - we find the ends of the seal & baluster spoons that a bunch agree were probably used as tampers
have found whizzers made from all kinds of items - I have copper arrow heads that were made from odd pieces of copper or brass
and knew a guy that had a bunch of arrow heads you could see were made from coppers
My father contacted me after talking to him about this - he has a friend with an old powder horn and guy has a large one of these he has in it for a plug
so there is one example of it being re-used
THIS was my point and question

Like I said - if I hit a cellar hole or a field behind an old house and found different types of hardware - then that would answer that
but some of these were found out miles away from a house or cellar at small stockade 1600s fort sites and mostly what else was found was musketballs
a few coins and a few buttons - so it got me wondering what other purpose could one use one for

OK fine, I understand & I know of plenty of re-used items in the UK as well. My point is that this could go on for ever, because if we find 1 re-use, it tell us very little other than 1 persons thoughts. Lonewolfe idea of carriage hardware is not a bad idea but we could guess all night. Trucks or large boxes is another thought.

My last observation on these, is that they never (in my experience & most others) come with there nut attached. Food for more thought? Because for these to be any use in the future after taking them off the nut is essential, is it not?

 

[CASPER-2]

"My point is that this could go on for ever, because if we find 1 re-use, it tell us very little other than 1 persons thoughts."

and isnt this part of what archeologists / anthropologists look for

what about the ends of broken seal and baluster spoons being "re-used" as pipe tampers
alot of people think this is what they were used for - or at least one use
the weak part of the spoon is usually where the handle meets the bowl - yet I have only seen one broken full length handle
most seem to be -rebroken - to a length of around or just over 2 inches
both in the UK and here

these 2 are from UK - mine are around same length and it looks like Aquachiggers is also
along with others found by friends
I just thought that maybe someone might have knowledge of another personal use for these pommels
away from what is acceptable (for furniture)-
like i said - I personally have hit fields and have seen group finds from others
from fields where amongst hundreds of items - they have found just one of these - which to me seems odd

 

[CRUSADER]

"My point is that this could go on for ever, because if we find 1 re-use, it tell us very little other than 1 persons thoughts."

and isnt this part of what archeologists / anthropologists look for

what about the ends of broken seal and baluster spoons being "re-used" as pipe tampers
alot of people think this is what they were used for - or at least one use
the weak part of the spoon is usually where the handle meets the bowl - yet I have only seen one broken full length handle
most seem to be -rebroken - to a length of around or just over 2 inches
both in the UK and here
View attachment 731414 View attachment 731416
these 2 are from UK - mine are around same length and it looks like Aquachiggers is also
along with others found by friends
I just thought that maybe someone might have knowledge of another personal use for these pommels
away from what is acceptable (for furniture)-
like i said - I personally have hit fields and have seen group finds from others
from fields where amongst hundreds of items - they have found just one of these - which to me seems odd

OK, lets debate this one. If the weak point is assumed to be at the spoon bowl, how can you explain my examples below? Most are 'broken' too short to be useful & only 1 has the right diameter to be useful in a 17th C pipe bowl. See my 17th C pipe tamper next to the spoon ends.
If they were used in mid-late 18th C pipes then you have a possibility.
What were mine used for?

 

[Broken knee]

OK, lets debate this one. If the weak point is assumed to be at the spoon bowl, how can you explain my examples below? Most are 'broken' too short to be useful & only 1 has the right diameter to be useful in a 17th C pipe bowl. See my 17th C pipe tamper next to the spoon ends.
If they were used in mid-late 18th C pipes then you have a possibility.
What were mine used for?

It is obvious that you have and will find more examples in the UK as these spoons where made there, as well the ones we find here. all of the ones I have found are the smaller style and about the same broken length. Our area " the Ct.river valley" was a big producer of tobacco in those days, right up to the late 1970's 80's. So the mid 1600's on up there was a lot of smoking going on? And evident by the amount of pipe fragments I've found and still find. The supply of this type of spoon was very limited here. I had a conversation with another person and his theory about these has something to do with the puritans and there religious beliefs and that they were intentionally broken or destroyed because of those beliefs? Well, more fodder for a cold winter morn HH
BK
PS please corect me if im wrong but were these also called apostile spoons? As it may give credance to the Puritian theory?

 

[302guy]

I was thinking they were used on ox yokes and other equipment harness for work animals. I'm sure plenty of hardware got lost in the fields, and if an oxen can't be secured the fields don't get worked. I can't imagine a woman putting enough torque on a door pull that size to bend it....unless she was a real ox....the ball most likely "popped" through a hole punched in leather to secure the reins...just guessing here.

 

[CRUSADER]

It is obvious that you have and will find more examples in the UK as these spoons where made there, as well the ones we find here. all of the ones I have found are the smaller style and about the same broken length. Our area " the Ct.river valley" was a big producer of tobacco in those days, right up to the late 1970's 80's. So the mid 1600's on up there was a lot of smoking going on? And evident by the amount of pipe fragments I've found and still find. The supply of this type of spoon was very limited here. I had a conversation with another person and his theory about these has something to do with the puritans and there religious beliefs and that they were intentionally broken or destroyed because of those beliefs? Well, more fodder for a cold winter morn HH
BK
PS please corect me if im wrong but were these also called apostile spoons? As it may give credance to the Puritian theory?

Apostle spoons were are similar period (& earlier) but had full length images of the apostles, unlike these 'seal tops' which sometimes had incised letters/image on top to double up as a wax seal. (thats another debate)
Maybe you missed my point, if these were used, & I have no problem believing they were, it would need to be over 150 years after they were made. Because the diameter was too wide to fit down the narrow pipe bowls of the 17th C. Look at 17th C pipe tampers for evidence. Therefore, they would only work as tampers on a site that was occupied in the late 18th C into the early 19th.

 

[releventchair]

Its getting out there a ways but what if after original cause of fracture they were used as substitutes for carriage bolts as suggested by others. One end would hold for sure while the other would need to be bent. Once worked loose a stray could turn up at odd intervals. And they have a large bearing surface to hammer or mallet. Wax seal does seem plausible. Heck kids could have used them as toy soldiers. Pipe tampers in a public house where pipes shared if stems broke for each users health maybe,hard on clay bowels compared to a finger or dowel. plus keeping them from walking away. For personal use outside the home one more thing to carry along with for some a pipe case. Some pieces pictured almost look usable for chess figures. Assuming women were protective of utensils its hard to imagine spoons being broken, or lost out doors. being discarded when more contemporary style procured possible.

 

[Broken knee]

I am curious as to why we find only the brass ones as there were many made of silver?
BK

 

[302guy]

Another possibility is ramrods for small pistols. And back then very little was known about firearms safety. If it fit, they'd shoot it.