unique Knights Templar sword

[kawkasian]

This sword I can not find any information on with the figures that are on the sheath. i searched hi and lo. Any information would be wonderful
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[Backwoodsbob]

Thanks Bruce for that info. I collect any old swords or other weapons. You have a very nice collection. Thank to both for sharing.

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[Bruce R]

I wonder what happened to the O.P. of this thread ? I'd really like to see pix of the blade.

 

[powrsurg]

I am a Freemason and can say without doubt this is a ceremonial sword for York Right Freemasons belonging to the Knights Templar organization.

 

[Bruce R]

There should be something on the blade. I did some checking around and I believe the OP is listing it on EBay.

 

[Bruce R]

The middle scabbard mount is definitely NOT Masonic.

 

[powrsurg]

The middle scabbard mount is definitely NOT Masonic.

Not True. There is nothing there to suggest it isnt. It is agnostic. That in itself doesnt indicate the sword and the scabbard are not Knights Templar. I see these swords all the time.

 

[Bruce R]

I'm waiting to see the blade and what may be inscribed on it. And like I said before , I found the middle mount in the Ames catalog, Tabor.

 

[powrsurg]

I'm waiting to see the blade and what may be inscribed on it. And like I said before , I found the middle mount in the Ames catalog, Tabor.

I'm curious, clearly my experience with these swords doesn't mean much. Fare enough, you don't know me. What exactly are you looking for that will suddenly register in your mind that this is a Masonic Knights Templar ceremonial sword, or incorrectly register that it isnt?

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[Bruce R]

I rely on my acquired knowledge and my research materials, I also rely on the knowledge of others who have proven to be knowledgeable in the past, either to me, personally, or to someone or something that I am familiar with. As you stated, I don't know you. That being said, I have sent photos of this sword to the Curator of the Masonic Museum and I await his reply, and I assure you I won't keep it a secret.

 

[powrsurg]

Makes sense. Too bad there's no way we can know who to trust because you could have saved yourself a lot of time trusting this guy here on this topic.

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[powrsurg]

One last note, I hope your contact at the museum is a member of this suborganization of Masonry. Be sure to ask him that. You should also contact the manufacturer and document their intent when the designed it. Just saying.

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[powrsurg]

My last comment on this matter.
http://www.masonicdictionary.com/inhoc.html

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[Bruce R]

One question, there are 2 Knights of Malta organizations, one Masonic, one definitely not. How do you tell their swords apart ?

 

[powrsurg]

Your question is a cunard. The sword pictures attached to this post clearly show a T within a K on the middle of the scabbard which stand for Knights Templar. The Knights Templar masonic motto is on the upper part of the scabbard. One doesn't need to know what an order of Malta (nonmasonic) sword looks like (if one even exists) because they wouldn't steal the masonic orders moto and add triangles and compasses, which clearly denoted masonry. But please, research this all you want. Please spend countless hours on this. There is a lesson in this for you.

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[Bruce R]

K o TView attachment 1333876

 

[Bruce R]

Knights of Malta swords , Masonic & non are identical except for the cross on the handle. Masonic uses the Latin cross, non Masonic uses the Patriarchal cross. The swords both have the same iconography and the same motto, in hoc signo vinces. Nearly impossible to tell them apart.

 

[powrsurg]

The cross on the handle is there because you need to be a Christian Mason in order to join it the masonic Knights Templar organization or Order of Malta degree. The Sovereign Military Order of Malta (NonMasonic) motto is different and again any ceremonial sword they use, while may be of a similar style would easily be discerned as nonmasonic by almost any freemason. The opposite of the above is also true. Any masonic Knights Templar sword would easily be discerned as such by almost any freemason.

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[Bruce R]

Still waiting

 

[powrsurg]

One more point. The Sovereign Military Order of Malta has no relationship with any Knights Templar organizations. Any sword used for their purposes would never have a KT on any part of it.

 

[Bruce R]

First of all, we're talking about 19th century swords here. And no, I'm not referring to the contemporary military KM, I'm talking about the racist Knights of Malta founded in Georgia in the 1860's, and yes they appropriated most of the Masonic iconography and mottos . The Freemasons had no patents or copyrights on their symbols, EVERYONE copied them. At any rate, let's agree to disagree and leave it at that. I want to buy the sword but the OP won't repost and won't answer my PM , so I guess I'll have to keep my eye on EBay