Video - Adventures in the Superstition Wilderness

[cactusjumper]

Hi Homar!

I think you hit the nail on the head when you said "many of the clues have been made up by others" - Including Julia Thomas at the onset of clue distribution to the public. I have no idea if the clues I posted are authentic, but its fun to see that the majority of them do match. They could be matching shadows in the ground as well - who knows? lol

The thing is - "everyone" thinks they know where the LDM is - and each one of those people "know" they are correct. I bet you could count hundreds - maybe thousands of people.

Do I know the Pit Mine is the LDM? Nope - I never would suggest that - either in type, or in my videos. I proposed a question in the video, and a poll here on TNet - to see what other people think.

You should check out the book by Ron Feldman called "Broken Mountain". Many believe, including his son Jesse, that the Pit Mine is infact the LDM. Joe R. referenced that in the "is the pit mine the LDM" thread here on Tnet. Joe has WAY more experience than me - keep in mind, I've only been around about 5-6 weeks. You should ask him what he thinks? Or maybe he will read this post.

Joe R. On a scale from 1-10.....10 being absolute.......is the pit mine the LDM according to your studies as well as what you've heard around "town".


Azdave35 said it best in his reply - I can't say it any better than he did (but I can still try) Whoever dug that site up - in the late 90's, surely believed there was something substantial there - that is obvious.

Ryan,

Azdave35 has been around the LDM Community for quite awhile now. He was one of the original participants in the Dutch Hunter's Rendezvous and was with us on the pre-run for the first event at Twin Buttes.

He knows what he is talking about, and good hands respect and listen to him.

While I believe there could have been a rich gold vein in the Pit Mine, I am more inclined to believe it was a repository for gold mined somewhere else. The Pit Mine is only 70" deep and end to end is only 80'. While I don't know crap about rocks, that does not seem like much of a mine.

You could do no better than to listen to azdave.

Good luck,

Joe

 

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[Cubfan64]

The fact all the equipment was left behind smells of a mutiny of partners from hitting a dry hole that didn't pan out.
Either they went 200 feet down and hit the water table or the area was prone to floods. It may have just been a horizontal water well I found one of those high up on the side of a mountain a man made audit filled with spring water that ran from the entrance at one time down the side of the mountain and into a cattle pond. The tunnel had really old rough cut planks that you could walk on back in the tunnel which was always cool in the summer.

I don't see it that way at all. Why would a group of people risk federal charges, jail time and large fines for all the work it took to get the PVC pipe and all the other supplies out there unless there was something worth recovering - doesn't make any sense to me or fit human nature at all. I see it as they got what they wanted and decided it wasn't worth risking (or too much trouble) getting caught bringing all that crap back out and knew nothing they left could point a finger at any specific person - now THAT is human nature.

 

[RG1976]

Bravo! @cubfan64

 

[RG1976]

Bill - that is all new to me. Massive conglomerates flying in machinery to blast away at the superstitions. The only major site I know of is the copper mine in Globe / Miami. Unsure if that's even considered part of the wilderness / superstition range.

Have any photos or documentation? I'd love to see that - as well as the legal docs that reference that. I'm sure they would have received the proper permits. What year did all of this happen?

Thanks!

 

[Old]

Go ahead and call me a conspiracy theorist...........This doesn't look like an illusion, a fantasy of imagination or a fabrication. This is the stuff "that would make 20 men millionaires.

This is worth looking for. And to some, worth risking much.

This is what we are talking about........ and its Very real.

View attachment 1152003

 

[RG1976]

Your attachment doesn't work

 

[Tnmountains]

Poncho,

I'm just speculating.......

Its remote, its protected under the Wilderness Protection Act, it has to be mined by hand or with light power tools, you have to carry in fuel (if used) and generators are noisy. You get what you can as easily as you can, and get out. Its more than a one man job. Teams have disputes, lips get loose, courage fails, job over.

Well obviously the one pit was re excavated recently again with pvc pipe run into and no one has any idea who did that.Did not see a sign in sheet. I doubt I would be posting if I was an illegal digger with no claim.My guess is the old claim has been dug but that does not mean there is not gold to be had.
Like many legends you will never know...

 

[Old]

Attachment to prior post.

 

[cactusjumper]

Joe, Your saying it was an 80 foot 70" deep Trench and not a Pit?

Mr. Riley,

Small typo there. The Pit Mine is 80ft. deep at the entrance and around 70ft. front to back at that level.

Jack San Felice did a very good writeup on the mine in, "Lost El Dorado of Jacob Waltz". In it he drew a diagram of the inside of the mine. I would suggest anyone interested in the Pit Mine buy a copy of his book. Jesse Feldman also included information and pictures of the "Silver Chief" mine in his book, "Jacob's Trail". The real Silver Chief mine is around 2-miles north of the Pit Mine.

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo

 

[sgtfda]

Jack has a new greatly expanded version going to the printer.

 

[DiggerGal]

Attachment to prior post.

View attachment 1152047

I have never seen something so beautiful! Congratulations, and may all the hidden veins be within your reach!

 

[txtea]

Nice job on the latest video, Ryan. Finally found the time to view it on the big flat screen t.v. The phone screen wouldn't cut it for the scenery.
I kick myself in the butt for not driving the Apache Trail when I went to the Rendezvous in 2011....
Learned a few things and loved the views. Looking forward to hopefully visit in October. See you there!

Dwayne Zettner

 

[RG1976]

Before wilderness it was pretty much open.

I'm not going to give you the long history lesson your just jumping into the subject. The books are at the superstition museum if you want the crash course. There are many, many more out there some quite rare.

This website is probably your easiest way just browse the history stuff.

Many big names including John Wayne were in there and practically every book you pick up is about a group of Thunters going in there with large equipment or just Dynamite. I read one story about the large explosions another about back hoes being choppered in.

It was legal back then in the early part of the 20th century.

You should know all this by now your just messing with me.

We're talking the old west here anything went up until the wildabeast act.

I am def. not messing with you - I'm just asking for something I can read to learn more about what you are talking about. Disappointed to hear that you don't have it. If you ever find it, please post!

They are mighty big claims - airships flying in equipment to blast out the sides of the mountains looking for gold in the SWA. Was that one of your "jokes" by chance? Sometimes its really hard to tell.

And the wildabeast act - I assume that is a typo and you meant wilderness act?

 

[RG1976]

Nice job on the latest video, Ryan. Finally found the time to view it on the big flat screen t.v. The phone screen wouldn't cut it for the scenery.
I kick myself in the butt for not driving the Apache Trail when I went to the Rendezvous in 2011....
Learned a few things and loved the views. Looking forward to hopefully visit in October. See you there!

Dwayne Zettner

Thank you so much!! I also watched the video on my TV - still shocked the iPhone can record such great video!

Perhaps I will see you in October! =)

 

[Old]

Hi Bill,

That particular picture is from Scott Wolters and his interview with Ron Feldman. Aired last November, I believe. Pretty isn't it?
I have 3 other pictures of specimen rocks just like it, all from different sources of information. Most of which have been featured on this forum from time to time and/or on similar forums at different sites. They are easily found, if you look for them. They all relate back to a common source.

1 rock is just interesting, 2 rocks begin to establish a pattern, 3 rocks reach the threshold for beyond reasonable doubt. 4 Rocks from different sources, of the same host rock, same color and presentation, same average percentage of gold to host and (to me) its beyond doubt. Your mileage may vary.

Its like the old adage, if you hear 4 thundering hooves coming, it could be a unicorn. Its most likely a horse, but you can expect to see a unicorn if you wish. Likely to be disappointed, but its an option. Your choice. My money is on... its a horse. More often than not, things in life are what they appear to be and not all that complicated or complex.

In this 120 some year old legend we have many and varied stories of who is a hero and who is a villain. You speak as if you know beyond doubt that Jake was a villain. Just how would you know that? Maybe he was, maybe he was as innocent as new fell snow. Either way, I don't recall nominating him for sainthood. He was a prospector and, by my assessment, a good one.

One thing we do know is he wasn't lying when he said there was gold out there. That has been proven time and again. I'm using what has been attributed to him (minus what I consider planted red herons) to follow his trail. The story I believe is when he was too old to make the trip and would tell bits and pieces of the riches that laid out there his eyes would gaze in their direction. That's the trail I follow, albeit from afar.

We don't know to a certainty the exact spot that yielded these specimens. Until proven wrong, I'll accept the statement of the person who claims to have found them and who currently holds them. Fibbing or not, they know more about from whence they came than we do. Nuff said.........probably too much.

 

[captain1965]

IMHO Waltz was not a killer. If he was he would have killed Mr. Holmes for following him. Waltz was said to help Julia Thomas with her debts. I also heard stories of him bringing candy to local Indian children. Who knows! I think Waltz lied to Holmes to lead him away from his friends. But what do I know.

 

[Cubfan64]

More often than not, things in life are what they appear to be and not all that complicated or complex

Excellent comment and something I try hard to always remind myself when I start digging into the stories of the LDM

 

[UncleMatt]

A good rule of thumb to follow it to always presents facts when you make claims about something. Facts have a source where they can be verified. Just expecting people to agree with your opinion when you haven't proved it is correct isn't really valid in my humble opinion. And should people ask you for evidence to back up what you claim, that is completely acceptable and valid. Its not about educating people, its about shouldering the burden of proof when you claim something is a certain way.

 

[Garry]

More often than not, things in life are what they appear to be and not all that complicated or complex

Excellent comment and something I try hard to always remind myself when I start digging into the stories of the LDM

You guys are certainly in the minority here but I couldn't agree more!

"The explanation requiring the fewest assumptions is most likely to be correct."
or
"Keep things simple!"

A study of the public documents and contemporary newspapers that involve Jacob Waltz is a great example.

Sadly, people will continue to repeat the tall tales either because they don't know any better or they simply don't care whether their statements are true or not.

Garry

 

[RG1976]

A good rule of thumb to follow it to always presents facts when you make claims about something. Facts have a source where they can be verified. Just expecting people to agree with your opinion when you haven't proved it is correct isn't really valid in my humble opinion. And should people ask you for evidence to back up what you claim, that is completely acceptable and valid. Its not about educating people, its about shouldering the burden of proof when you claim something is a certain way.

*golf clap*

Matt said it perfectly!