Chart antigunners dont want you to see

worldtalker · Jan 6, 2013

Chart antigunners don't want you to see

Gotta see things for yourself,not just what "they" are drilling into your head,wake up people!!!GodBless Chris America's Biggest Killers: The Chart Anti-Gunners Don't Want You To See

0121stockpicker · Jan 6, 2013

worldtalker said:
Gotta see things for yourself,not just what "they" are drilling into your head,wake up people!!!GodBless Chris America's Biggest Killers: The Chart Anti-Gunners Don't Want You To See

First if all Im not pro or anti gun but am very experienced in working with stats, studies, graphs etc. this is an extremely manipulative chart that does not hold up to any scrutiny. First note the categories used - they range from the very specific to the very broad - apples to oranges. Lets rake the gun category - "firearm homicides" - An interesting term that caught my attention. Does this stat include accidental deaths because some kids were playing with guns?? Or did those numbers end up in catagory 2 accidental injuries?? Note it did not say "gun related deaths or injuries" a "homicide" is very specific.

The tobacco category on the other hand is extremely vague - these are obviously not just deaths when someone kicks the bucket with a cig in the hand!! I dont smoke anything, but have looked into these numbers in the past and they are completely bogus. Includes all sorts of major assumptions and third and fourth hand deaths. I think many smokers in the audience would argue to the smoking numbers are complete bogus numbers whipped up by a very overly intrusive government conspiracy to take away our right to do what we want with our bodies - smoke.

Take also the false logic of the conclusion. Since guns are lowers on the list we should do nothing about them. This is a simple logistical error / trick in the same category as the "slippery slope" - ie first they will take away your 100 round clips and next zombies and the UN will rule the world. I debated in college and studied debate logic so it's always funny to see these embarrassing trucks being used to try and manipulate poor folks who don't know any better.

We should do nothing about firearms because they are lower on the list? Thats "bad logic". Ok then, lets not try and do anything about medical errors or drug use either - that smart? In your opinion what would be an acceptable number of gun homicides each year?

Always beware of studies and stats - I can prove just about anything under the sun with a quick graph and a few stats. BUYER BEWARE !!

Chadeaux · Jan 7, 2013

Interesting . . . homocides by gun are less than homocides by other means.

Also interesting, more acidental deaths and deaths from bad decisions than by gun. Why are they able to get the wusses to back banning guns? Because the know the wusses are also too lazy to research anything.

Click on image, should enlarge

worldtalker · Jan 7, 2013

Chadeaux said:
Interesting . . . homocides by gun are less than homocides by other means.

Also interesting, more acidental deaths and deaths from bad decisions than by gun. Why are they able to get the wusses to back banning guns? Because the know the wusses are also too lazy to research anything.

Click on image, should enlarge

View attachment 722264

Glad to see there are a few folks around with a little "common sense" hard to come by these days,a dying breed,I guess Public Education wouldn't have anything to do with it though.

Dano Sverige · Jan 7, 2013

Maybe they speak a different language in southeast Arkansas and western Massachusetts Stockpicker? :dontknow:

Frankn · Jan 7, 2013

Over 3 times as many people killed in auto accidents then intentional killings with guns. Guess what, most of the gun ban crowd drive. Think about it. Frank

dieselram94 · Jan 7, 2013

Frankn said:
Over 3 times as many people killed in auto accidents then intentional killings with guns. Guess what, most of the gun ban crowd drive. Think about it. Frank

<img src="http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=722291"/>

I'm guessing a prius?

Treasure_Hunter · Jan 7, 2013

Stockpicker, your correct, perfect example is any anti-gun graph media currently using...

Dano Sverige · Jan 7, 2013

I'm all for the USA banning cars. The videos on youtube of millions of Americans wobbling and staggering around like new born foals will go "viral" in no time!...."Honey help. i can't seem to get my danged pedal pushers to work properly!!" :laughing9:

dieselram94 · Jan 7, 2013

Dano Sverige said:
I'm all for the USA banning cars. The videos on youtube of millions of Americans wobbling and staggering around like new born foals will go "viral" in no time!...."Honey help. i can't seem to get my danged pedal pushers to work properly!!"

More mindless rambling.

worldtalker · Jan 7, 2013

Let him ramble,no skin off my back,it's the responses to his rambling that gets threads locked. GodBless Chris

0121stockpicker · Jan 7, 2013

Treasure_Hunter said:
Stockpicker, your correct, perfect example is any anti-gun graph media currently using...

Definitely - both sides use these tricks. Just look at the climate change debate also. One of the favorite tricks is to put a stat out there in an article or tv show. All of a sudden a bunch of other sources pick up the stat and start reprinting and quoting it. Then all of a sudden it looks like its the gospel truth and everyone is repeating it as if its the truth. Happens all the time.

Reminds me of the food industry. Every week we hear about a new "superfood" - chocolate, blueberries, wine, pomegranates, etc. You hear a news story saying a "study" suggests it prevents cancer, increases lifespan, prevents heart attach, etc, etc. look at the fine print - it's always a study funded by the blueberry growers, chocolate folks, etc, etc.

Always be skeptical with what you read and hear. Educate yourself on the tricks that people/government/businesses play.

Treasure_Hunter · Jan 7, 2013

Simple line....."the right of the people to bear arms shall not be infringed".....

"NOT be infringed"...can't get any clearer than that.

0121stockpicker · Jan 7, 2013

Treasure_Hunter said:
Simple line....."the right of the people to bear arms shall not be infringed".....

"NOT be infringed"...can't get any clearer than that.

But you can get clearer. It has already been decided that "guns" does not mean fully automatic weapons - correct. Those have been extremely regulated for decades and decades. Our founding documents are "interpreted" ever day. That's why our country/gov has survived so long we interpret to take any ever changing society into consideration. E

Crispin · Jan 7, 2013

WorldTalker: What stockpicker elloquently stated is that exact same thing I tried to tell you when that thread was deleted. Curiosity....Why are you and Red not attacking him like you did me in that thread. Why are you not bashing education and telling him pieces of paper are worthless. Is it something about me?

Treasure_Hunter · Jan 7, 2013

If it has already been decided then why call for new laws?...Supreme Court has already ruled in past on our gun rights.

I wonder, are you going to be as compromising when it is the 1st or 3rd Amendment they are wanting to gut?

When they decide our "changing society" no longer needs free speech is that OK? When they decide our "changing society" no longer can accommodate freedom of assembly is that OK as well...?

Anyone who thinks that want happen once the 2nd is gutted is naive...They who ignore history are destined to repeat it, there has never been a government that once they started taking freedoms away from their people that did not continue to take them away.......

dieselram94 · Jan 7, 2013

Shall not be infringed is pretty clear to me as well. Start infringing and its over for the second amendment. It is there to protect against a tyrannical govt. And if the tyrannical govt. Has semiautomatic weapons and all the people only have single shot weapons......guess who stays in power? Why would anyone support this? Only two reasons as I see it. First one being a genuine feeling the govt is not and will not be tyrannical. The second being a feeling the govt should be in total control and knows best for its citizens.......like Hitler did. Only two ways I see it.

Chadeaux · Jan 7, 2013

Dano Sverige said:
I'm all for the USA banning cars. The videos on youtube of millions of Americans wobbling and staggering around like new born foals will go "viral" in no time!...."Honey help. i can't seem to get my danged pedal pushers to work properly!!"

It is important to note the numbers of HOMICIDES . . . from Guns VS NON GUN HOMICIDES.

Seems we need to stop the "NON GUN HOMICIDES" first as they are killing 50% more people than the GUN HOMICIDES.

Deaths from accidental falls is more than double the number of Americans killed by guns. Let's ban ladders, chairs and anything else someone might climb on. A friend of mine died in February because he fell from the roof of his house while cleaning up storm damage. We need to ban houses as well.

Mindless arguments from the antigun folks don't hold water.

dieselram94 · Jan 7, 2013

Chadeaux said:
It is important to note the numbers of HOMICIDES . . . from Guns VS NON GUN HOMICIDES.

Seems we need to stop the "NON GUN HOMICIDES" first as they are killing 50% more people than the GUN HOMICIDES.

Deaths from accidental falls is more than double the number of Americans killed by guns. Let's ban ladders, chairs and anything else someone might climb on. A friend of mine died in February because he fell from the roof of his house while cleaning up storm damage. We need to ban houses as well.

Mindless arguments from the antigun folks don't hold water.

"Don't hold water "good advice. Maybe we should ban water as well...you could drown as well. All very good points Chadeaux.

Chadeaux · Jan 7, 2013

From Wikipedia (based on information from CDC)

From the CDC: Not a top ten list, but a top 15 list. Guess where homicide (including guns and all other weapons used)

The 15 leading causes of death in 2009 were:
1.
Diseases of heart (heart disease)
2.
Malignant neoplasms (cancer)
3.
Chronic lower respiratory diseases
4.
Cerebrovascular diseases (stroke)
5.
Accidents (unintentional injuries)
6.
Alzheimer’s disease
7.
Diabetes mellitus (diabetes)
8.
Influenza and pneumonia
9.
Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome and nephrosis (kidney
disease)
10.
Intentional self-harm (suicide)
11.
Septicemia
12.
Chronic liver disease and cirrhosis
13.
Essential hypertension and hypertensive renal dis*
ease (hypertension)
14.
Parkinson’s disease
15.
Assault (homicide)
In 2009, the infant mortality rate was 6.39 infant deaths per 1,000
live births.