Is map dowsing a hoax?

[NJHunter]

Doesn't the ability of the person matter a lot more than the rod used?i dunno but I think $100's-$1000's is ridiculous for a stick and a few hundred or a pendulum just as bad.

 

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[aarthrj3811]

~NJHunter~
Doesn't the ability of the person matter a lot more than the rod used?i dunno but I think $100's-$1000's is ridiculous for a stick and a few hundred or a pendulum just as bad.

I feel the same way...But...If someone wants to spend their money that is their decision...Art

 

[Treasure finder]

I bought an Anderson rod as a requirement to take a dowsing course from Sam Wolfe in 1974, my first dowsing experience.
At the time it was about the same pricce as a metal detector.
Rich

 

[NJHunter]

I bought an Anderson rod as a requirement to take a dowsing course from Sam Wolfe in 1974, my first dowsing experience.
At the time it was about the same pricce as a metal detector.
Rich

Why did it have to be an Anderson?

 

[fenixdigger]

If someone accidentally found something and word got out, then it was the "only" thing to use. If you mental dowse, operator ability is the key. Physical dowsing is all about the equipment.

 

[Treasure finder]

At the time the course was set up to use an Anderson rod based on what the trainer was using. Since then I have used many other
rods, pendulums, Y-Rods and bobbers. Anderson units are well balanced and a little easier to use in some cases (for me), but I have
had success with other units as well. One unit that works well for me is a light brass rod with a large cork on the end. I am the least
successful with a Y-Rod, they just don't work well for me. And yes, the mental dowsing is a large part of success.
Rich

 

[ClonedSIM]

I posted a few few aerial photos and asked for help dowsing them. The first map that I started working through has been 100% accurate. I am nowhere near finished with the map, however so far here are the results:

1. I went directly to the first area circled as having items near the surface. I ran the MD through the area and dug up 4 items.
2. Because time was short and it was dark I didn't try to find the next circled areas, but opted to search the area surrounding the first circle. (none of this area was marked by the dowser as having anything there). I got absolutely no hits in this area.
3. As a comparison of area, the unmarked area I searched was roughly 8-10xs the size of the circled area that had 4 items, and was totally surrounding the circled area. Again..not one hit on the MD (not even for nails, pulltabs or foil)
4. This weekend I searched a second circle that was marked by the dowser and found 2 items. I searched the unmarked area surrounding the circle and had no hits whatsoever on the MD in the unmarked area. (The unmarked section I checked this weekend was approximately 4-5 times larger than the marked area.)

So, it's not definitive proof, however these early results certainly indicate an early positive correlation between the dowser's work and the presence of items. I have several other maps I will be working through in the future that have also been dowsed so I will keep everyone up to date on how it goes. But for now, the map dowser is 100% accurate on both where to look, and where NOT to look.

I'm happy the map dowsing worked out for you, but I am curious. What are the items that you found, and would you consider hunting on the directions of a non-dowser? By that, I mean, what kind of luck would you have if you just randomly marked spots on a map and then went hunting in those areas? Also, in the areas where you dug no items, did you focus on those areas as hard as you did the marked areas?

There's a lot going on with this kind of map dowsing, when you think about it. When the map dowser circled those spots, did he give any indication what might be found there, and did this match with what you dug? What is the history of the site you were hunting at, and is what you found consistent with that history? That being said, I'd love to try this myself, I'd be thrilled to learn there's something behind it.

 

[ClonedSIM]

Would anyone be interested in a bit of map dowsing? I own 5 acres of land in New Mexico that I could post an overhead shot of. I'm really curious if there's anything out of the ordinary underground. Not necessarily gold or silver, but stone or iron objects, coins, jewelry, basically anything that didn't naturally occur on the land, something dropped or buried. I'll dig the crap out of the place and post photos of finds for anyone interested. Takers??

 

[Treasure finder]

Cloned,
Personally I have my best results when I am looking for a specific object with as much information about it as possible. If the search
terms are too broad I can't focus as well and have to spend way too much time checking for one thing at a time. That is just me,
someone else may be happy to.
Rich

 

[aarthrj3811]

Hey Rich.....I used to ask all kinds of question..But when I found to many items the map would get to complicated..So I now start asking about gold and silver..If I get yes answers I try to stick with those topics..That is the type of treasure hunting I know best...Art

 

[Treasure finder]

Art,
Sam Wolfe (a dowsing instructor in the 1970s) used to just ask, "Is there any treasure here?" That worked for some of his students,
but too many complications as you point out. To each his own techinique. Thanks for your opinion, we kind of agree on that one.
I have had numerous requests to "Find something on this map!", which I usually turn down. There are enough real dowsing jobs to
not waste brain energy on every request.
Rich

 

[coyote3]

One very fatal issue that has not been brought up is.. NEVER dowse for someone that does not believe in the art of dowsing or you will look like a damn fool. Art and many others on here know that showing off and trying to make people believe a lot of times will backfire and your results will suck. I can dowse around my parents and some close friends because they believe in it and results stay the same. When I try it around a skeptic or for a skeptic usually it blows up in my face. If a person has heard of dowsing and knows it works go after it. There are skeptics about this. The reason a lot of dowsers charge a fee is because by charging a fee, this ensures that the person which is wanting the dowsers service is a believer in what he is going to receive back from the dowser in the form of information. 99 percent of the people will not throw money at someone to try and prove them wrong. That is why sometimes on this forum there can be a lot of different results by the people that dowse the targets and by the ones that want the targets dowsed. IF someone on here asks for a target to be dowsed and gets a map back by say RED DESERT and they look at it and say... Well there is nothing where he has his targets other than a big grass flat.. Guess what? They just created doubt in the ability of that and all dowsers which will dowse that picture from that point on. The people on here that want maps, pictures, grandmas house, whatever dowse have to believe equally that it will work. Just like the signal line that is created that we dowse with our rods... if there is no connectivity between the dowser, the person wanting the information and the map, there will be no results. That is why free dowsing is a lot of bull*#$#. It does affect what people think of us. I have seen a lot of pictures where Red, Art, Okie and Tele, all had comparatively exact same results. WHY Because the person that sent the map believed in dowsing and its results. Whether there is any targets is left to the owner of the map. But, if four or five people get the same results that have no telepathic connection between each other, you can bet I would be stoked and going after some targets. So if you just want to see if someone can find something on a map, dont waste a dowsers time. If you have a lead and believe there is something there and that dowsing would be a helpful tool to narrow down the search area of a target, then post on here. Otherwise if you dont believe in it, throw a dart at the map and go dig, cause thats how accurate we will be too. No one claims you will find the exact location of the target on here. We try and narrow the search area from billions of miles square down to hundreds of feet square. If that is not good enough, well your doubting our ability again and that aint gonna work... BELIEVE AND YOU SHALL SUCCEED !!!!!!!!!!!

 

[aarthrj3811]

Hey rockhound...When I look at a map on here I dowse it if I like what I see...I don’t know what equipment the person uses..When I find a gold vein I try to find one that is exposed at the surface..I only mark what I know that I could find...Art

 

[teleprospector]

Ok, this is just a question I'm not stating an opinion about dowsing of any kind. What I'm wondering is if you can find out where treasure is by dowsing then why do dowsers list metal detectors as some of their equipment? From some of what I read it looks like dowsers are able to tell how deep some stuff is.

I think of the dowsing equipment as being the "Air Force" enabling me to cover an area quicker and the metal detectors as being the "Ground Force" enabling me to pinpoint better but the rods/pendulum may be used with success w/o the use of a metal detector.Jon

 

[teleprospector]

Would anyone be interested in a bit of map dowsing? I own 5 acres of land in New Mexico that I could post an overhead shot of. I'm really curious if there's anything out of the ordinary underground. Not necessarily gold or silver, but stone or iron objects, coins, jewelry, basically anything that didn't naturally occur on the land, something dropped or buried. I'll dig the crap out of the place and post photos of finds for anyone interested. Takers??

Yes please post a picture in a new thread so all who want to dowse it will know where to find your picture.Jon

 

[aarthrj3811]

~Jon~

I think of the dowsing equipment as being the "Air Force" enabling me to cover an area quicker

Yes..About 4 miles better...Small target may be a little out of range but the big ones can be there...I can check the area out and not leave the highway.
a

nd the metal detectors as being the "Ground Force" enabling me to pinpoint better

I do not use a metal detector as most of my finds would be out of their range.

but the rods/pendulum may be used with success w/o the use of a metal detector.Jon

I have worked hard at learning how to pinpoint with my rods...Art

 

[ClonedSIM]

There always has been lots of dowser bashing.
What do the bashers want. In my experience they want me to go to a spot of their choosing and find them a treasure of which they think
I am entitled to less than half. This would be a site without proper research, with no owner's permission and no $ for me or for travel
expenses including a place to stay. Of course I would have to leave my successful business to make them some money for my time.
Some bashers just want me to teach them a foolproof way to dowse up a treasure right away or they intend to tell the world that dowsing
is a hoax or worse. Who needs it! I am having a perfectly good time on my own and with a few personal friends who have been amazed
at results I have handed them. Dowsing works for me, thanks.
Rich
PS. Think of needing proof before trying something when a doctor hands you a strange pill to swallow and says "Let's try this and see
how you feel! By the way, here are a list of side effects!"

Treasure Finder, do you map dowse at all? If so, I just created a new thread with a photo of my own property, and am offer to share anything recovered with the dowser that led me to it. Full disclosure, I won't hold a thing back from anyone who tries to help.

And in response to your comparison of the doctor prescribing medication? One thing you didn't consider is that no/very few doctors in the US would risk their license by handing a patient a drug that hadn't already been tested and approved by the FDA. So, there is proof of what that drug does before it's prescribed,and this testing is nearly always done double-blind with a control/placebo group.

 

[ClonedSIM]

Yes please post a picture in a new thread so all who want to dowse it will know where to find your picture.Jon

I have that photo posted in a new thread, Jon. Thanks for taking a look, I really appreciate it!

 

[ClonedSIM]

One very fatal issue that has not been brought up is.. NEVER dowse for someone that does not believe in the art of dowsing or you will look like a damn fool. Art and many others on here know that showing off and trying to make people believe a lot of times will backfire and your results will suck. I can dowse around my parents and some close friends because they believe in it and results stay the same. When I try it around a skeptic or for a skeptic usually it blows up in my face. If a person has heard of dowsing and knows it works go after it. There are skeptics about this. The reason a lot of dowsers charge a fee is because by charging a fee, this ensures that the person which is wanting the dowsers service is a believer in what he is going to receive back from the dowser in the form of information. 99 percent of the people will not throw money at someone to try and prove them wrong. That is why sometimes on this forum there can be a lot of different results by the people that dowse the targets and by the ones that want the targets dowsed. IF someone on here asks for a target to be dowsed and gets a map back by say RED DESERT and they look at it and say... Well there is nothing where he has his targets other than a big grass flat.. Guess what? They just created doubt in the ability of that and all dowsers which will dowse that picture from that point on. The people on here that want maps, pictures, grandmas house, whatever dowse have to believe equally that it will work. Just like the signal line that is created that we dowse with our rods... if there is no connectivity between the dowser, the person wanting the information and the map, there will be no results. That is why free dowsing is a lot of bull*#$#. It does affect what people think of us. I have seen a lot of pictures where Red, Art, Okie and Tele, all had comparatively exact same results. WHY Because the person that sent the map believed in dowsing and its results. Whether there is any targets is left to the owner of the map. But, if four or five people get the same results that have no telepathic connection between each other, you can bet I would be stoked and going after some targets. So if you just want to see if someone can find something on a map, dont waste a dowsers time. If you have a lead and believe there is something there and that dowsing would be a helpful tool to narrow down the search area of a target, then post on here. Otherwise if you dont believe in it, throw a dart at the map and go dig, cause thats how accurate we will be too. No one claims you will find the exact location of the target on here. We try and narrow the search area from billions of miles square down to hundreds of feet square. If that is not good enough, well your doubting our ability again and that aint gonna work... BELIEVE AND YOU SHALL SUCCEED !!!!!!!!!!!

I really have to know... What reasoning are you using when you made the statement that if you're around a person with a certain opinion, but who has no actual physical control over you, that dowsing will simply stop working?? Do you realize how ludicrious that sounds? A person with a negative attitude might affect those around him by passing along that bad mood, but that's explained by the fact that misery loves company. Someone who is consistently in a bad mood can bring down the moods of those around him, but only because the other people let the first person affect their moods. The moody guy isn't projecting waves of "bad energy" that can physically affect anything at all.

Of course, a simpler explanation (Occam's Razor, anyone?) is that you might just not be a very strong dowser, and you're letting someone's mood affect you. This makes much more sense than your blanket statement that a skeptic will always stop dowsing from working just by being near a dowser. You need to learn to ignore anyone whio doubts you but, that being said, you might be harboring some ngative feelings about your own skills. If you are positive what you do works, then why should anyone else's opinion matter?

What you're really saying is that, since dowsing involves nothing more mysterious that your own skill, you let yourself get psyched out by anyone who doesn't believe in your hobby. Which is basically akin to saying that a baseball player can't be able to hit a pitch because someone rooting for the other team wants him to fail, and that in turn affects his ability to swing a bat. That's a pretty darn lame excuse for failure...

 

[ClonedSIM]

Rich, you are again right on point. Most are do-nothing, give me everything types. Art and I have given very simple experiments to try and guess how many gave it a fair shot?? We had a great example here, Ole shallow water, never tried anything and argued the hardest. Some have serious Freudian issues and come here to scratch the itch. Others just want to know the truth. As you know from personal conversations, I don't tell the full truth here, only the part that we want to let out. Can you imagine what would go on if we did? Shoot, Carl is willing to pay 25 grand for the secret. No telling how far others would go. A lot just want you to show your hand and who knows their intentions?

Fenix, a close-minded dowser is no better than a close-minded skeptic. And why on Earth would you not give skeptics the credit they deserve? If it weren't for the skeptics throughout history, humans would still believe the Earth is flat and that we are the center of the universe.

And, just for your clarification as you seem to be a bit confused on the subject, Carl is willing to put up $25K not so someone can tell him how dowsing works, but simply for someone to prove in a scientifically-run test situation that they can find hidden objects while dowsing. He just wants to see a self-proclaimed dowser prove their ability in a blind test, he's not try to steal any of your secrets. If you're so sure in your abilities, take his test and prove all of the skeptics wrong. But by taling like you did above, you aren't helping your cause at all....

And what's wrong with telling the "full truth," as you put it? Do you honestly wonder why people don't blindly believe in you when you only feel obligated to tell half the story? Trust me, no one here is trying to steal anything from you. When we ask questions, we're not looking to trap you in anything, we're just looking for an honest answer, which you obviously don't feel a need to be honest about.

You say that skeptics aren't willing to try anything, only gripe about it, but can you blame them? You say, "I hold the rods and it leads me to treasure!" but you don't feel that the specifics of what you're doing need to be elaborated on. That's why people don't believe you! And then you get all hurt and overly defensive when someone tells you that what you just described shouldn't be possible, but you don't feel a need to actually figure out and describe what's going on. You only have yourself to blame, really.

You should probably let yourself cool down a little beofre you create posts here, otherwise you end up with the rambling diatribe above.

If you ever want to hear how a metal detector works, just ask me. I'll tell you the whole process fron start to finish.