Legend vs Realitiy

well why I am getting ready for knee surgery my best friend has not been by in 4 days another friend stop me in the store yesterday and told me he got sick and cant stand up and is lost a lot of weight and looks like he is dying .. so I am going to day to see him ,I have known him over 25 years ...he is good people X navy ,he was in the 6 day war ...on a ship .see latter today guys ...
 

Surgery

well why I am getting ready for knee surgery my best friend has not been by in 4 days another friend stop me in the store yesterday and told me he got sick and cant stand up and is lost a lot of weight and looks like he is dying .. so I am going to day to see him ,I have known him over 25 years ...he is good people X navy ,he was in the 6 day war ...on a ship .see latter today guys ...
BB, hope your surgery goes well.
Idahodutch
 

Not to try to derail the topic, I would only add that there are apparently FOUR different Tayopas over the centuries, counting the three in Mexico and one rather mysterious tale set in the Superstitions. I can not remember which one was spelled with the "E" however, think it was the story of the single mine being called by that name in the Superstitions, referred to in an old newspaper article I posted here some time ago.

Please do continue;

:coffee2: :coffee: :coffee2: :coffee2:

Yes, there have rose over the centuries more Tayopas in different places, like the LDM and the other treasures all over the America. The Real de Guadalupe de Tayopa is only one and is in Chihuahua, Mexico. More of the clues which we know are for this place and the only maps which exist are for this place too.
For the first time I will post an aerial image of a part of the Real de Tayopa which depicts the Tayopa church ( in the red circle ) and the treasure site ( in the yellow rectangle ) like is depicted in the Tayopa treasure map.
Just to make this thread more interesting.

View attachment 1765993 Stylzed.webp
 

have a few less drinks and you might make some kind of logic ....
 

Yes, there have rose over the centuries more Tayopas in different places, like the LDM and the other treasures all over the America. The Real de Guadalupe de Tayopa is only one and is in Chihuahua, Mexico. More of the clues which we know are for this place and the only maps which exist are for this place too.
For the first time I will post an aerial image of a part of the Real de Tayopa which depicts the Tayopa church ( in the red circle ) and the treasure site ( in the yellow rectangle ) like is depicted in the Tayopa treasure map.
Just to make this thread more interesting.

View attachment 1765993 View attachment 1765994

I can see what appears to be a trail or road from your church to the treasure. Not an expert on that particular legend for sure. But that is interesting.
 

have a few less drinks and you might make some kind of logic ....


On your return from timeout please post by our rules, any more attacks, insults, or veiled threats and the next timeout will double.
 

I can see what appears to be a trail or road from your church to the treasure. Not an expert on that particular legend for sure. But that is interesting.

There is a main trail that goes to the church and from there many other secondary trails which go to the mines and treasure site. The main trail - Camino de Tayopa - is not depicted in the Dobie map , despite its title, but is somewhere between the Camino de Arischiachi and Camino de Moris. Is to wonder someone why one trail depicted in the map to has two different names, but is because there where starts the Camino de Tayopa ( brown line), there start also two different trails, up to Moris and down to Arischiachi.
What is worth to be taken in consideration, there in the treasure site shape depicted in the treasure map, are three mines which are depicted in the Dobie map ( red oval ), two of them Guadalupe and San Ignacio hold the gold bars and the Sanor Amo de Tayopa holds the archives.

Camino de Tayopa.webp
 

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Just to make something clear. If you are looking at the Dobie map where I marked the Tayopa trail and the mines which are in the treasure shape site, you will see how the treasure site in the Tayopa GE image is not in the same location like the Dobie map shows. Don't panic, there is an explanation, and is because the treasure site map should be reversed ( I posted it reversed to be more combatible to the treasure map like is know to the public ) to be at the real location in the field. This is the original image of the location with the east to be on top.

View attachment 1766254

Also, the Dobie map has north on top, so the treasure site in regards to the Dobie map looks like this

View attachment 1766255

This is the difference between legend and reality
 

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Just to make something clear. If you are looking at the Dobie map where I marked the Tayopa trail and the mines which are in the treasure shape site, you will see how the treasure site in the Tayopa GE image is not in the same location like the Dobie map shows. Don't panic, there is an explanation, and is because the treasure site map should be reversed ( I posted it reversed to be more combatible to the treasure map like is know to the public ) to be at the real location in the field. This is the original image of the location with the east to be on top.

View attachment 1766254

Also, the Dobie map has north on top, so the treasure site in regards to the Dobie map looks like this

View attachment 1766255

This is the difference between legend and reality

How did Dobie come by his map? I've seen some of the books on Amazon and they are not cheap. Although pretty respected.
 

How did Dobie come by his map? I've seen some of the books on Amazon and they are not cheap. Although pretty respected.

He found it in a church's archives during his research on Tayopa. I believe in the web you can find some info about.
 

I could leave it like this, to believe how what you have seen is the treasure site shape that match with the Tayopa treasure map. But I 'm not a con man, so what seems like the treasure site is only a decoy well made by the Jesuits to lure those who know to read symbols but not the hidden meanings/messages in the maps.
There is a set of three maps of Tayopa which are very close related each other.
The one is the Dobie's map of Camino de Tayopa which shows the contour of the relief and where the mines are placed in the field, and ultimately this map is oriented N-NE to the top and cover about 1,8 x 1,3 miles.
The second map is the Tayopa treasure map which shows the shape/markings of the ground around the caches and where the caches are placed, and the third map is the map with the hidden messages which shows where is located the real treasure site in regards to the church. And that map is this:

older%20map%20of%20Tayopa.webp

In this map, the first hidden message is how the real treasure site is double in surface than the decoy ( the Subterania shape vs the " mission Franciscana " which could not play in a Jesuit movie ), the second message is how the " arrow N " in the middle of the map is only for the church orientation and not for where is the tresure site in regards to the church. The treasure site should be read like is to the west from the church taking in consideration how the most of the texts are oriented parallel to the top which in the most maps is the north.
And the third hidden meaning is the words written on the Subterania shape, which are written in the order that are placed in the field and in the Treasure map site. Here we should to take in consideration how the shape of Subterania from the map cover only the region of the " Puerta " from the treasure site map, because is talking about the door of the underground room. Like you can see in the GE image of the real treasure site, the church is located in the treasure site map ( and is at the base of the church's cross from the Dobie's map ), with the Subterania ( Puerta ) and the treasure site to be west from the church. The arrow from the treasure site map points toward the entrance of the Subterania which is to the right of the " Puerta ".
Now about the words written on the Subterania shape from the map:
Like you can see in the map, in the first line from the left are written the words " Puerta.Color.Canjara " which means " door/entrance grey colored " which is pointed by the arrow in the GE image.
In the second line is written " Subterania " of why the entrance would be for.
In the third line is written " Treno.4.Pilares " which means " four colums in line " and you can see them in the GE image next above the arrow's point, and in the fourth line is written " Plata.120.Librad " which means " Silver 120 lb " and is for material and the weight of the door which is written in the first line.

View attachment 1767683 View attachment 1767684

There is something else that you have to know about Tayopa mines. Because the decoy treasure site is half than the real one, they wrote the half distances for the mines than in reality. And this is not a legend.
 

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Maybe one day we will learn IF Tayopa is connected in any way with the LDM...I doubt that it is...But we may never know for certain...

I personally believe that I have been to Tayopa...And the Tayopa I have been to is not in AZ...Though there are many who believe that I am full of it...lol...Only time will tell...And I am in no rush to prove my claims...I know what I know and I have been where I have been...

Ed T
 

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some one ask me to show these pictures again so they could see them .you will have to enlarge them to see them better they were taken from a long ways off ,the safe way to get search data with out being dead after .. the first picture shows a large cube and some other interesting objects near by ...the second picture shows the sphinx head and the last shows it for a little different angle but the second picture shows us why I took a closer look at it .. see the funny type of face jeweler under his noise this looks just like the Aztec type and the same kind worn by Inca ....don't ask me I did not make a 15ton sphink on top of a mountain in the supers in my life time so I know about as much as all of you do about it . but IMHO it is a sign of a much older culture then the Zuni or any other tribes that I know of ,the seven caves has many unknown discovery waiting as long as we respect the tribes that came from these mystical caves ...
 

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I could leave it like this, to believe how what you have seen is the treasure site shape that match with the Tayopa treasure map. But I 'm not a con man, so what seems like the treasure site is only a decoy well made by the Jesuits to lure those who know to read symbols but not the hidden meanings/messages in the maps.
There is a set of three maps of Tayopa which are very close related each other.
The one is the Dobie's map of Camino de Tayopa which shows the contour of the relief and where the mines are placed in the field, and ultimately this map is oriented N-NE to the top and cover about 1,8 x 1,3 miles.
The second map is the Tayopa treasure map which shows the shape/markings of the ground around the caches and where the caches are placed, and the third map is the map with the hidden messages which shows where is located the real treasure site in regards to the church. And that map is this:

View attachment 1767685

In this map, the first hidden message is how the real treasure site is double in surface than the decoy ( the Subterania shape vs the " mission Franciscana " which could not play in a Jesuit movie ), the second message is how the " arrow N " in the middle of the map is only for the church orientation and not for where is the tresure site in regards to the church. The treasure site should be read like is to the west from the church taking in consideration how the most of the texts are oriented parallel to the top which in the most maps is the north.
And the third hidden meaning is the words written on the Subterania shape, which are written in the order that are placed in the field and in the Treasure map site. Here we should to take in consideration how the shape of Subterania from the map cover only the region of the " Puerta " from the treasure site map, because is talking about the door of the underground room. Like you can see in the GE image of the real treasure site, the church is located in the treasure site map ( and is at the base of the church's cross from the Dobie's map ), with the Subterania ( Puerta ) and the treasure site to be west from the church. The arrow from the treasure site map points toward the entrance of the Subterania which is to the right of the " Puerta ".
Now about the words written on the Subterania shape from the map:
Like you can see in the map, in the first line from the left are written the words " Puerta.Color.Canjara " which means " door/entrance grey colored " which is pointed by the arrow in the GE image.
In the second line is written " Subterania " of why the entrance would be for.
In the third line is written " Treno.4.Pilares " which means " four colums in line " and you can see them in the GE image next above the arrow's point, and in the fourth line is written " Plata.120.Librad " which means " Silver 120 lb " and is for material and the weight of the door which is written in the first line.

View attachment 1767683 View attachment 1767684

There is something else that you have to know about Tayopa mines. Because the decoy treasure site is half than the real one, they wrote the half distances for the mines than in reality. And this is not a legend.
when listing bearings and ranges ,the length always goes first as listed then the width I it should be 1,3 X 1,8 this is showing unit scale of a value of ! and the measure is 3x8..of the 1 unit size ...the unit scale can be define by the measure of those two sides giving you the 3rd and most important missing measure value ,this is common X,Y and Z axis ... you can believe what ever you want . I am just saying I found a church where no one knew there was one that dose in fact fit the Topira legend ..very define with many isolated details that define the site as Topira .. I have 5 items in a very detailed lay out and the odds are not random ...and yes I am well a wear of the history of Tayopa .. and I fully agree with you the idea that the site I found was Topira was shocking and crazy . but its there and its real ...I will enjoy going back to the 16 sites and finding out what else is waiting to be discovered at these sites ...I have talked openly with someone about these discovery and details of these locations and as my expedition poll together we will find answers to many questions ...and sorry I have never ask for help or money of any kind .I am not doing this for wealth .I just like seeing the truth come to light ...when the sites are define we will know what they are and see how they fit the puzzle ...
 

yesterday, I became a great grand pa .. a new little treasure hunter came in to the world to see what he could find .. life the greatest treasure a man could hope for ....
 

yesterday, I became a great grand pa .. a new little treasure hunter came in to the world to see what he could find .. life the greatest treasure a man could hope for ....

Life is mystical, magical and tragical. I have experienced all of it. I have grieved my lost ones to the point of not wanting to live. I have experienced the magic that my babies being born brings and I have had mystical experiences with the heavenly realm. Everything. I would not trade any of it for anything. I understand what it is all about, finally. When I stand before God, He will say, "You have Loved Well, welcome home my Son." Love is all there is. Love is the only thing that is worth anything. God Is Love.
 

5 brothers .Rick is on life support fore 48 hours.
 

my brother rick is still kicking still fighting . its more then sad ... i am still alive and the days are long .. turn 60 and still want to go back to the mine ...you never know .. i hope you all are well . i don't know if this will help you much but it is interesting to me .. i told you all the story about seeing a Aztec warrior walking around out there . but to day i was reading a story a bout a giant killed in some mountains by solders ,and i noticed something funny between the two stories .. both the Aztec and the Giant came out of caves and both had weapons as if they were hunting or at war almost like stepping out of a time portal . and this was near were those wild magnetic fields were at ...my only question is did he step into our time or did step into his some how .. ? the reason i say that is simple . the Giant in their story throws a spear and kills a man . the Aztec i saw was making paw prints to scare people away . but he was not like any human we know from this time and age ...i will live and die Dutch-hunter i can only hope to get back there some day ...stay safe stay free
 

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BB,
It’s good to hear you are still kicking. Welcome to the 60’s and happy birthday.
The portal idea is interesting, would sure hate to be walking past at the wrong time, just as something came through.
There are still many unknowns, perhaps one day, our understanding will be better.
 

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