Need to know what is here

[Bigdogdad]

I just want everyone to know I am not claiming "Holier than thou", but at the same time I am not going to just sit on my thumbs and not say anything when I know darned well it is not right what I see. I don't even like having to do this. I hope some people have learned something here, but don't hold your breath. More than likely you'll just see diversion.

"it is not right what I see"? "I don't even like having to do this". Ok. Please stop. You have made your point. You have given your opinion. "Diversion"? Yeah it is a big conspiracy by all us dowsing believers. We want you to drink our "Kool Aid". Join our cult. Look into to my eyes. Follow the pendulum. Your getting sleepy, sleepy, sleepy. "don't hold your breath"? I want you to hold your breath signal_line. See if you can hold it for about 10 minutes. Try as hard as you can. Nite, nite.

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

Diving for Pleasure and Treasure - Grab it through Amazon!

[signal_line]

I know I am wasting my breath. The nose thumbing will continue as will the deception and the hiding from the truth. Same stuff different year.

 

[Bigdogdad]

Bigdogdad, nobody wants to hear the truth. The internet is such an easy place for imposters to hide and deceive. That's on both sides of the aisle and you never know which is which or who is who. I'm not saying map dowsing can't possibly work, just that it is huge odds against it. Sure these guys hope they will get a good hit and the guy will give them a share of the loot. You look at every single photo on this forum and there are about a hundred spots marked. Give me a break. There is not that much gold out there. They are grasping at straw. And when someone says someone mailed them some money, that is not from a find or else it would have been gold. They won't tell you that. Look, I don't like pouring cold water on this, but the truth needs to be known. Just like your hole, they realized there is nothing there when you came back asking for help, but I wouldn't bet on it either way. I've seen people that hid gold and took a photo of it for this forum. No one here got the spot not even close and it was only about twenty feet across. Roll the dice but don't go "all in".

I went back to your original post on this thread. Let's try to dissect it to see what you are trying to say.

"Nobody wants to hear the truth". I want to hear the truth as do most of the people reading this. Who is to decide what the "truth" is? You? What qualifies you?

"The internet is an easy place for imposters to hide and deceive". Obviously you are implying that someone on here is "hiding and deceiving". Tell us "truth seekers" who that is.


"I'm not saying map dowsing can't possibly work, just that it is huge odds against it". So what if the odds are huge. The odds are huge that you won't win the lottery but millions still try. OK so let's say the odds are huge that if you post a picture on here to be dowsed there may not be gold within it and the dowsers may be wrong on where they think it may be. So what. Nobody is forcing anybody to post a picture. Nobody is charging anybody to dowse the photo. Nobody is promising anybody that their dowsing is correct. There is no scam or deception. So if you acknowledge that map dowsing could possibly work, what is your problem here?

"You look at every single photo on this forum and there are about a hundred spots marked". BS-You need to learn to count. Whether it is one or one hundred, why do you care? Some of these guys mark different things besides gold. In fact the majority of the hits may not be marked as "gold".

"They are grasping at straw". I'll just say that sounds a little silly and leave it at that.

"someone says someone mailed them some money, that is not from a find or else it would have been gold". For one thing the "find" could have been gold, silver, diamonds, paper money, guns, or many other things. Kind of a weak statement on your part. Meaningless.

"Look, I don't like pouring cold water on this, but the truth needs to be known." You lost me on this one. You say you believe in dowsing. You say map dowsing could possibly work. Am I missing something here? What exactly is your "truth"?

"Just like your hole, when they realized there is nothing there when you came back asking for help, but I wouldn't bet on it either way". I don't know what you are trying to say with this, do you?

"I've seen people that hid gold and took a photo of it for this forum. No one here got the spot not even close and it was only about twenty feet across'. Are you talking about the poorly executed vor "test"? "twenty feet across" Wrong. "No one here got the spot"? Only one person replied to that test. I was involved in the outcome. Like I said it was poorly executed and completely flawed at best.

"Roll the dice but don't go "all in"." What does this mean? Dig holes but "don't quit my day job"? Spend money but don't "bet the farm"? Live life "like your dying" but don't die trying? Imply the dowsers on here are deceivers, but don't come out and really say it?

signal_line- I suggest you quit while you are behind before you make an even bigger behind of yourself. It is not really fair of me to fight a defenseless man in this "war of wits". I will beat you with one eye tied behind my back.

 

[prospexican]

Hey prospexican...I have hunted the patch many times..when I go east I always stop by on the way back...Lots of gold can be found there..Art

. I have been there only a couple of times art, but last time we didnt have the info how to get to majuva placer and snow was all over, driving 2 wheel drive was scary lol

 

[signal_line]

Bdd, I'm not here to insult you. I can understand you are sensitive to what you perceive as criticism. Get over it. Most of it was not even directed at you. You have a lot to learn and I am sorry to inform you that being influenced by aRT was a bad choice. You are entitled to make mistakes.

 

[Bigdogdad]

Bdd, I'm not here to insult you. I can understand you are sensitive to what you perceive as criticism. Get over it. Most of it was not even directed at you. You have a lot to learn and I am sorry to inform you that being influenced by aRT was a bad choice. You are entitled to make mistakes.

"perceive as criticism"? Pretty much everything you have had to say is criticism. I am head over heels "over it". Most of what, was not directed at me? The "perceived criticism? We ALL have a lot to learn. I read all that "aRT" has to say but he really has little influence over me. Add an F and let's call him flatulence. Thanks for entitling me. I now feel free to make more mistakes.

 

[Bigdogdad]

As usual a dowsing thread has turned into a pissing contest. I have stooped to others level. My bad.

I started this thread. The name I chose was "Need to know what is here". I am wanting to try to find some treasure. I am not looking for personal opinions from T-Net members about whether they believe in dowsing or how they feel about other members. If you have something constructive to say about my pictures or questions please respond. If you only want to cause trouble please go elsewhere. Last time I checked there were 359,312 other threads to choose from.

 

[signal_line]

Yeah, you should tell aRT to quit posting on your thread. I tried to help but that's okay. I told you the map dowser's record is dismal at best. I could give you several examples about the ones where information was known and your cult hero was dead wrong. I agree you need to make your mistakes by the school of hard knocks.

 

[aarthrj3811]

Gee Mike.....I would stop if he ask me....You claim that nothing works for you...Just because I don’t agree with your failed methods you follow me around making all kinds of claims about my honesty....I just tell people what works for me just like you tell everyone what has not worked for you....Art

 

[signal_line]

Hey Bdd, you want to follow that guy I call the "false profit" please don't let me stop you. I told you everything that guy says it wrong and his map dowsing is even worse and wrong technique. I sure don't want you to feel the way I do everyday that guy thumbs his nose at me with his in-your-face posts. I don't read them but on occasion accidentally. That certainly was not intentions here. He plays your ego like a fiddle. That's sociopath territory. I hope your figure it out some day.

 

[aarthrj3811]

This will be my last response on this thread to all your rants

Hey Bdd, you want to follow that guy I call the "false profit" please don't let me stop you.

False prophet - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I told you everything that guy says it wrong and his map dowsing is even worse and wrong technique.

Map dowsing.

I sure don't want you to feel the way I do everyday that guy thumbs his nose at me with his in-your-face posts. I don't read them but on occasion accidentally. That certainly was not intentions here.

If the truth hurts get out of the kitchen..

He plays your ego like a fiddle. That's sociopath territory. I hope your figure it out some day.

so·ci·o·path
/ˈsoʊ

si

əˌpæθ, ˈsoʊ

ʃi-/ Show Spelled [soh-see-uh-path, soh-shee-] Show IPA
noun Psychiatry.
a person with a psychopathic personality whose behavior is antisocial, often criminal, and who lacks a sense of moral responsibility or social conscience.

 

[Dave Rishar]

BDD? A few thoughts. Take them or leave them as you will. I'm a sceptic at heart and I'm not personally sold on dowsing, but I'm not going to discuss dowsing because that's not the issue here. I'm going to discuss your dig.

So, questions. Do not answer them to anyone but yourself. This is a thought exercise.

What are you digging up? Who put it there? And how? I only ask because you're expending an awful lot of effort on extracting this, and if a person put it there...well, I can only imagine what they went through to bury it, reading what you're going through to dig it up. But if a person didn't put it there, how did you know that it's there? And if a person put it there, how did they put it there?

There could have been some geographical changes, depending on when that treasure ended up in the ground. But it's under the water table, right? That's the big problem. How has the water table changed throughout recorded history? And if someone put something there, they probably intended to retrieve it at some point. How were they going to dig it back up?

Again, don't answer me. I'd be lying if I said that I didn't want to know, but I certainly don't need to know and it's probably better if I didn't. You need to know. Why is it where you think that it is? How did it get there, and how was it supposed to get back out?

 

[Bigdogdad]

The level of the water table in Florida is constantly changing in any given spot. It is affected by rain, drainage, drought and other factors. It may go up or down 10 feet or more within a short time period. I know this for fact as I have lived in Florida on the west coast for over 46 years, been in construction 34 years and have dug many, many holes. I have worked on multiple septic systems, dug ponds, built barns, and had a friend that owned a sewage pipe installation company. I was trained as an Army Engineer at Ft Leonard Wood, Mo and graduated at the top of my class.

All this being said you would think I would know how to dig a hole. But in spite of all this I still tend to screw up. I get in a hurry. I had too small of a backhoe both times. I left various pieces of my treasure hunting tool repertoire at home. I did not wait for my GPR guy to be available. I did not install a small well point system even though I knew I needed it. I did not make sure others involved brought the detectors they said they would. I became obsessed.

I have found time and again that the closer you may be (whether it is there or not remains to be seen) to getting to the treasures you are after, the dumber you may get. I blame it on the "Gold Gods" or spirits protecting what is there but the truth is it is all my fault and no one else is to blame. My only statement about all this is at least I am trying and hopefully I am learning just a little bit more each time.

As far as why I think this treasure is there or why any of the many other spots I have may contain treasure, it is a long story. I don't feel like explaining it all.

As far as how deep any given person will dig, or the trouble they go to when burying a valuable treasure, that merits a thread of its own. For the record it only took me about 2 hours to dig the 8 foot deep hole in the first photo on this thread. It was all sand, little roots, and no water.

I have met Dell Winders on a couple of occasions. I actually have a cool mirror map on my office wall that came from him. He had a stroke just hours after he gave it to me. He seems like a nice guy and does not live far away. Thanks signal_line, maybe I will contact him.(I just edited this post and for some reason signal_line deleted his post telling me to contact Dell Winders. Why? Strange.)

 

[Bigdogdad]

The first dig site picture I posted on this thread was on the east side of a historical old creek. That's where the hole shown is. Although there are some great dowsing hits posted on here they are on the west side of the creek. I only have permission at this time to dig and detect on the east side. There are actually rumors of an old fort/outpost right in the general area of where the new dowsing hits are. This property is going through a lot of changes and I may not be able to get on it legally. I plan on trying and I want to thank Red and Jon for dowsing and marking it for me.

 

[Red_desert]

You're quite welcome BDD.....old fort, thanks! I'd believed something had to be there because of the dowsing hits. I've done map dowsing for archaeologists on a museum board and my name as co-founder of multiple museum displays for a historical land tract. I'm beginning to actually prefer historical dowsing over the other lost treasure cache legend type searches.

 

[teleprospector]

The first dig site picture I posted on this thread was on the east side of a historical old creek. That's where the hole shown is. Although there are some great dowsing hits posted on here they are on the west side of the creek. I only have permission at this time to dig and detect on the east side. There are actually rumors of an old fort/outpost right in the general area of where the new dowsing hits are. This property is going through a lot of changes and I may not be able to get on it legally. I plan on trying and I want to thank Red and Jon for dowsing and marking it for me.

Hello Bigdogdad,
You're welcome! It was nice to read your post on your field search experience from a dowsed photo. I have a good feeling that your effort in the field will result in a recovery wether it's on this site or on another of your projects.
Jon

 

[ECS]

... Follow the pendulum...

On other threads,BDD,you have told us how Ovid Arnold with his pendulum led you to many treasure sites,which you have dug to no avail.Now you are requesting other remote map dowsers to confirm the same sites that you have found barren.
Is this not an example of repeting the same activity over and over again,but expecting different results,or just valudation of what you believe to be true?
You have followed the pendulum for many years,but what have you found?
That is the basis of the critics queries.

 

[Bigdogdad]

On other threads,BDD,you have told us how Ovid Arnold with his pendulum led you to many treasure sites,which you have dug to no avail.Now you are requesting other remote map dowsers to confirm the same sites that you have found barren.
Is this not an example of repeting the same activity over and over again,but expecting different results,or just valudation of what you believe to be true?
You have followed the pendulum for many years,but what have you found?
That is the basis of the critics queries.

I don't know of any site that I have finished digging and consider "barren". Please name one. The sites I am requesting on here have nothing to do with Ovid. There is much more to my story than following a pendulum. I don't really care about the "critics queries". Is there a reason why I should care? If you really want to know about me and my story you can come visit me. We can talk face to face one on one. You don't live far away. If this is too much trouble then I will assume you don't want to get involved. All this internet chit chat tends to get tiresome.

Digging up a cache of gold is not that easy. If it were lots of people would be doing it. How many people on the Cache forum are digging up caches of gold? I am slowly learning more and more. I work a full time job and have many other activities and hobbies that do not involve treasure. If this were my full time occupation I would probably be better at it by now. ECS-giving me a hard time about my lack of success is not helping in any way. BTW-When was the last time you found a treasure cache?

 

[ECS]

Yes,BDD,maybe the sites are not barren,two more feet deeper,or three feet to the left and ten feet down.
"These are the things dreams are made of".
No,I have never found the "BIG ONE",then again I have never searched for the "BIG ONE",but have found a few tiny little ones through historical research,knowing where to look.
The "BIG ONES" are far too many times based on tall tales,local lore,myths,and legends,that fire dreams,but end only in smoke.

 

[Dave Rishar]

BDD? I'm not being critical of you, and I'm certainly not telling you how to dig your site. You're an expert. I am not. I'm not even being sceptical of whether your treasure is there or not. I don't know the site, the history, or even what you're looking for. I lack the information to be critical.

My aim here is to provide a bit of insight, to "shake something loose," so to speak. There may be some answers in your own mind that you're not currently conscious of. You're very close to the problem. Your dowsers are very close to the problem. I'm not close to your problem at all. I don't know what you're looking for or where you're looking for it; I only know that you're looking for something within the parameters that you've established on this thread, which are (and should be) rather vague.

I'll trust you on the water table. I haven't been to Florida since the late nineties and I knew nothing about the water table there then, and perhaps less now. I likewise don't know the specifics of your site and again, I don't want to. I am curious as to why the treasure was buried so deeply though. Burying that deeply wasn't really necessary (and was indeed counterproductive) prior to metal detectors and GPR. Again, you're enduring some real trials to get down to it and while the people who buried it may not have had to face quite so much inconvenience, it could not have been too much easier.

I'm not saying that there's nothing there, but I'm saying that it's rather curious, and you may wish to take this into consideration while appraising the site. There may be something that you do, and we do not, that could shed some light on this. Perhaps there was already an existing hole at the time of burial that happened to be rather deep and easy to find, and would have to be covered up? Where would that hole be?