Roman Coin from the United States!?!?!? If so...I am amazed!

[HomeGuardDan]

OK - disclaimer first - I hope my reputation speaks for itself. I am a hard hunter and very knowledgeable of relics from the states and also am very honest and never try to pull the wool over the eyes of people. Due to this I was almost not going to post this as I am sure the backlash that it will potentially create.

I went back to the water again this evening to a very remote site that was the location of an early 1600's wharf. There are no roads or homes (no home has been here since the civil war). I paddled to the spot that has yielded early coins and buttons over the past couple of years along with other odds and ends.

While detecting I first dug a couple of early musket balls and then unearthed a nice flat button. A short distance later I dug what I initially thought was a small flat button, then when I saw the bust, immediately thought a freaking Lincoln penny (as it is about the same size though much thinner). After looking at it I realized that the bust was that of a cesar. I then began to think early hammered coin of some sort as the site is of the appropriate age - however after not finding a match I did see a few roman coins that looked similar. Finally I found a basic match Constantin II (Constantinus Cesar 321-324)!!!!!!

The coin looks right, but I am no expert on these things so I hope plenty of our friends from across the pond will chime in on this. I do know of some roman coins and other EARLY foreign coins found at early colonial sites from time to time, though very rare.

I ended the day with a nice early (probably 19th century) brass spigot and pocket knife and other various lead odds and ends. This site also saw some activity from the civil war and I have found a few three ringers there from time to time.

HH

On cloud nine (for now)

Dan

 

[HomeGuardDan]

Sorry, I misinterpreted you post Gary. We're cool.

Steve are we cool ha

I agree - I tried to be as plan as possible when I made the post that I was attributing this find to the colonial history (1600s this site) rather than a fictional roman voyage

 

[Steve in PA]

Steve are we cool ha

I agree - I tried to be as plan as possible when I made the post that I was attributing this find to the colonial history (1600s this site) rather than a fictional roman voyage

Ya mon, we cool

 

[HomeGuardDan]

Ya mon, we cool

Good to know ha ha

 

[Back-of-the-boat]

I keep waiting for someone to find the six Roman Coins I dropped along Tule Wash near Ocotillo Wells SVRA.

Mike

Next time I visit Julian I'll pop down the hill for a looksee.

 

[MichiganMan]

A very interesting, and thought/story-provoking find. But the spigot is what really caught my eye.

 

[HomeGuardDan]

A very interesting, and thought/story-provoking find. But the spigot is what really caught my eye.

You know you are the fourth person who mentioned that ha ha...the spigot is cool and I am happy with it, but the coin is still my favorite

 

[HomeGuardDan]

We all over here like to get a spanish piece or a cob... it took me over 20 years to get one 1/2 Reale over here and a cob will never happen! Cut or not!

Bill and I talk frequently about the currency found in the states and how it varies region by region, obviously globally speaking, it is even more so due to age - but it is always a reminder when folks west of Spain have difficulties finding cobs and reales. I have found hundreds of pre 1820's coins over the years and only a handful were different than US or English/Spanish. I have a few Prussian, German and French influenced coins.

 

[Bill D. (VA)]

Bill and I talk frequently about the currency found in the states and how it varies region by region, obviously globally speaking, it is even more so due to age - but it is always a reminder when folks west of Spain have difficulties finding cobs and reales. I have found hundreds of pre 1820's coins over the years and only a handful were different than US or English/Spanish. I have a few Prussian, German and French influenced coins.

I agree Dan. Although the colonies were a melting pot for foreign currency, I've found very few coins outside of those produced in England or Spain/Spanish New World colonies. My exceptions include coins from France, Germany, the Netherlands, and India (which technically was a British colony at the time). I'm surprised more from other European countries haven't shown up. But I'm not complaining .....

 

[Back-of-the-boat]

I agree Dan. Although the colonies were a melting pot for foreign currency, I've found very few coins outside of those produced in England or Spain/Spanish New World colonies. My exceptions include coins from France, Germany, the Netherlands, and India (which technically was a British colony at the time). I'm surprised more from other European countries haven't shown up. But I'm not complaining .....

It makes you wonder if maybe there was some type of currency exchange when people migrated into the country back then, that would explain the lack of foreign currency.

 

[HomeGuardDan]

It makes you wonder if maybe there was some type of currency exchange when people migrated into the country back then, that would explain the lack of foreign currency.

This biggest contributor is that England, Spain and France were the major players in the North American empire (Colonial Expansion). They also were the main countries with naval/seafaring abilities. We were indeed a melting pot, but not everyone could reach our shores. Same as from time to time an occasional Canadian coin ends up in our wallets or peso from Mexico.

 

[ReidMan]

It could also just be from a Collector you know they did collect coins back in the day. Might be from some colonial guys collection or his favorite good luck piece. I think some of the Spanish silver we find in CW camps might also be from the same thing.

 

[HomeGuardDan]

It could also just be from a Collector you know they did collect coins back in the day. Might be from some colonial guys collection or his favorite good luck piece. I think some of the Spanish silver we find in CW camps might also be from the same thing.

Reid - welcome to the debate. This has been my thought all along - I have also recovered native american points in hut sites. I do love all the theories though - shows we are still a race of thought at times. Hope all is well.

 

[CRUSADER]

Dads ID based on the unclear pictures:

From the head outline I lean towards a Constantine II VOT X or VOT V types as example below.



http://www.wildwinds.com/coins/ric/constantine_II/_siscia_RIC_vII_166.jpg

Rather than a Constantius II VOT XX MVLT XXX which would look like this



http://www.wildwinds.com/coins/ric/constantius_II/_constantinople_RIC_VIII_069.jpg

 

[MichiganMan]

Links are not working Cru'

 

[CRUSADER]

Links are not working Cru'

Just checked them & they are for me. Anyone else?

 

[HomeGuardDan]

Cru,

Sorry I have been out of town since you posted this. I tried taking a better pic and I simply could not, the coin just does not have any surface features to show other than what is there. I will say it is a VOT X as I was able to locate the X in the exact spot. Just curious, what is the difference between the X and V?

Many thanks again!

 

[CRUSADER]

Cru,

Sorry I have been out of town since you posted this. I tried taking a better pic and I simply could not, the coin just does not have any surface features to show other than what is there. I will say it is a VOT X as I was able to locate the X in the exact spot. Just curious, what is the difference between the X and V?

Many thanks again!

The difference is the year in which it was minted. A 'V' gives thanks for 5 years & X for 10 years. I can't remember if the Emporer is giving thanks for 5 years service or asking for another 5, either way you get the point.

 

[HomeGuardDan]

The difference is the year in which it was minted. A 'V' gives thanks for 5 years & X for 10 years. I can't remember if the Emporer is giving thanks for 5 years service or asking for another 5, either way you get the point.

Indeed - thank you again.

 

[Bill D. (VA)]

Dan - I know we've been discussing this a bit offline, but I decided to go ahead and mention some of the possible explanations for your Roman coin being found here in Va that I just came across. My reference source is another of Ivor Hume's books, "All the Best Rubbish". In it he mentions that a number of these early coins have been found along the shorelines in the Middle Atlantic area from MD down to NC. One of the reasons he brings out is that, just like today, some folks back then were coin collectors and likely had coins such as yours in their collections. However, he states that since excellent specimens were available for purchase back in colonial times that it would be highly unlikely that a collector would have been satisfied with a relatively poor quality specimen. So I don't think that's what's happening here. The more likely scenario would be that your coin came from fill from along the shore of the Thames River in England (where numerous Roman coins are still found) that was used as ballast for ships that came to the colonies. As was common practice, this ballast would later be dumped in our local rivers and streams. This is not just a theory, but has been documented on other occasions so its likely a plausible explanation to how your coin arrived at its final destination. I tend to agree with this, but of course there may also be other possibilities. Maybe this post will help to generate some additional discussion on this very interesting topic.

 

[Silver Searcher]

I missed this first time around But why is it so difficult to imagine that Roman Traders made it to the America's, perhaps not intended, but rather blown of course. Roman ships were advanced and very sea worthy. After saying that you would need other Roman objects, like pottery to have any context of the find.

SS