✅ SOLVED saving this one as a present to all my new friends on TREASURENET..

[outlawatheart]

this one is my BEST point and YES IT'S REAL! Made of red wine colored obsidian which is fairly rare(I think) in itself. It measures 8 3/16" long by 1 5/16" at the base. I found 15 other smaller points at the same site( 6 were a colorful agate material the rest were black obsidian) as well as over 3000+ shell and bone beads. I don't show it much cause most don't believe its authentic or question my collecting methods. I have never tried to get a COA on it cause I will probably never sell it. It is definitely the "banner find of my life" and am very proud of it. Merry Christmas to all you head hunters and thanks for all the great info and comments on my collection so far!!!

 

[Tnmountains]

Outlaw i had people saying my point was fake.One who makes reproductions of this style professionaly he had his doubts.Im gonna write it off to my bad pictures.You know what you got.I went searching for opinions and i got them.You gotta take the good with the bad.....

Well if we did not have these professional wonderful brilliant knowlegable fakers we would not be having this discussion. They should kill everything they make. Then you have all the trash on e-bay.I think back to the replies people made when the Rutz Clovis was posted ….. Good point Mainejman. I do not know why people collect fakes that have real artifacts. It throws everything they have in question.

 

[Get-the-point]

If you come on to the site posting pictures people with many years experience will tell you whether you have something of suspect. Because it comes out of the ground does NOT make it authentic!! There are several stories of Salted lands and dwellings just look it up. From the infamous Sandia point to the the Fenn Cache all of which are being disputed!! Soil acidity and area found will dictate patination level. However patination will always occur! It is one of the determining factors for authentication of any Antiquity. Your point Outlaw has all the characteristics of a grey ghost. However that being said, I have never seen a obsidian grey ghost..that's a plus in your points favor. Most were made out of Edwards Chert slabs. So Mainejman post what you like if someone says different dispute it with facts....Not well... I found it...so that makes it authentic?.....This is a great hobby with some expensive pieces and anyone trying to get one over and set it up for sale will come to a site like this and put it on there for the collecting world to see and if they get nothing but thumbs up knowing it is a repro it aids in there selling of it. So the naysayers are needed to justify and brings about a reasoning with the posters pics!!.........................GTP

 

[outlawatheart]

I did try to have it authenticated by a firm in Sedona. What a mistake and invasion of my privacy that turned out to be. Didn't think they were gonna give it back. I was asked to write and sign a statement about how and where I found it. They even wanted me to pinpoint the location on a map. Treated me like I stole it. Arizona laws are very tough for a reason I guess! I would never dig a burial or any kind of mounds

I really don't mind anyone questioning it at all...I probably would too!! Every piece I have shown on here was found by me and not bought or traded for.

 

[mainejman]

I value everyones opinion.But i think if youre gonna voice an opinion you have the responsibility to base it on some reasonable facts.Not just negative assumptions.As far as getting something authenticated to me that is for people who buy and sell.Thats a whole different world....

 

[painterx7]

Well if we did not have these professional wonderful brilliant knowlegable fakers we would not be having this discussion. They should kill everything they make. Then you have all the trash on e-bay.I think back to the replies people made when the Rutz Clovis was posted ..... Good point Mainejman. I do not know why people collect fakes that have real artifacts. It throws everything they have in question.

Well put TN !!!!!

 

[Get-the-point]

I value everyones opinion.But i think if youre gonna voice an opinion you have the responsibility to base it on some reasonable facts.Not just negative assumptions.As far as getting something authenticated to me that is for people who buy and sell.Thats a whole different world....

Facts were given. That point looks like a grey ghost from size to looking like it was cut from slab. However i did point out that most greys were made of Edwards Chert slabs. This point looks to be a extreme size point for the type. Take a look at Quito's point he just posted. Almost identical yet only 3-1/4". A point type could come with any size it was the maker that chose the size. That point needs to be authenticated. Outlaw send that piece to Ben Stermer he is an expert with regards to obsidian relics. That point is a $5000 plus point and could be the largest of its type. So it needs to be seen by a expert! That point is well within the G-10+ rating and any point like that nees to be noted. As far as The whole different collecting world it does not matter all points will come up for sale regardless of whose collection they are in. There will always b that family member who will sell pieces to get by. Then there are those that just don't want rocks so they either discard them or sell the whole collection. The fact is no matter how old the collection or how many generations these artifacts are held for they will eventually come up for sale! This is why proper documentation and paperwork is needed on the exceptional pieces as this is!!!

 

[Neanderthal]

........oh boy.

 

[Get-the-point]

........oh boy.

What's your take on this piece Neanderthal......I'd like to hear it.

 

[rock]

So does it have a name for it Outlaw and what period was it made?

 

[fongu]

I think it's a beautiful artifact and it looks deadly to me. I know hardly anything about artifacts but hope to learn as I go. Thanks for sharing this photo with the rest of us. Merry Christmas.

 

[Red Earth]

No chance in hell would i ever send a piece like that through the mail or leave it with someone.

 

[Red Earth]

Just leave it alone. Havent you ever heard if you dont have anything nice to say then dont say anything at all !!!!!?
In all fairness, for those of you that cant just be happy for some one, the people who present fake artifacts, and I'm not talking about you outlaw, are only cheating themselves. so there's no need to get your panties in a bunch

once again outlaw,great find, wish I could have been there and your the man

 

[outlawatheart]

you would know better than me rock

So does it have a name for it Outlaw and what period was it made?

 

[Neanderthal]

What's your take on this piece Neanderthal......I'd like to hear it.

Since you asked. This is indeed an artifact, just not ancient. I know of no such "obsidian" and would bet on it being made from glass. The form, flaking and everything about this piece are completely incorrect for ancient aboriginal manufacture. I'm not saying he didn't find it, he may have. But, just because someone finds a piece does not mean it's ancient...it only means they found it.

It's not a Gray Ghost - Brian Rheinhardt used a jig and the flaking them are somewhat recognizable.

 

[outlawatheart]

not doubting your judgment at all. I showed it to some collectors at a show in Washington and they said it looked like it was glass butte material. They also didn't think it was more than 300 to 500 years old

Since you asked. This is indeed an artifact, just not ancient. I know of no such "obsidian" and would bet on it being made from glass. The form, flaking and everything about this piece are completely incorrect for ancient aboriginal manufacture. I'm not saying he didn't find it, he may have. But, just because someone finds a piece does not mean it's ancient...it only means they found it.

It's not a Gray Ghost - Brian Rheinhardt used a jig and the flaking them are somewhat recognizable.

 

[jamey]

hey outlaw do you know that neanderthal feller,he is a really good man and very smart when it comes to artifacts,if it were my point i would have no problem letting him check it out.

 

[Get-the-point]

Since you asked. This is indeed an artifact, just not ancient. I know of no such "obsidian" and would bet on it being made from glass. The form, flaking and everything about this piece are completely incorrect for ancient aboriginal manufacture. I'm not saying he didn't find it, he may have. But, just because someone finds a piece does not mean it's ancient...it only means they found it.

It's not a Gray Ghost - Brian Rheinhardt used a jig and the flaking them are somewhat recognizable.

Thank you for confirming my suspicion over it. Everything you stated was what i stated other then your suspicion of it being glass. Thank you for agreeing that just because it comes from the ground does not make it authentic. Now I did say it had some of the earmarks of it being a ghost. To me it has some of the traits so that is the reason it got put out there........

 

[mainejman]

Let me rephrase this when i go out to a place and dig down and find an artifact in the ground where i have found numerous other artifacts i would think 99.9% of the time i could count on it being real.I cant imagine many others finding fakes under these same circumstances.Anybody dug up any fakes out there lets see them?

 

[outlawatheart]

so what I am hearing, and may I say so eloquently said, is that its a fake with nothing more than intrinsic value and that someone actually went deep into the boonies picked out the biggest rock formation for miles and buried it. I truly did find it and if what you say is correct I could not imagine someone taking the trouble to make it and then just leave it in such a remote indiscriminant place hoping it is found. What would be the purpose in that? I have posted a lot of my stuff on here and would never intentionally put up a piece that I knew was fake with so many knowledgeable people viewing. Sorry I do tend to be a little more blunt and straight forward than some and do not mean any disrespect nor do I want to start a pissing match here by asking to see some examples of such large fake pieces made from glass. I really would like to know about this stuff. I have been searching on the net but I'm sure you guys have many more resources than I do. Question: how do you distinguish the difference between manmade glass and volcanic glass? Excluding bubbles. It must be obvious to be noticed from photos. Wondering also can any good maker of fakes produce such a piece from glass.

 

[outlawatheart]

Obsidian Butte Oregon - Bing Images