Superstition People, Places, & Things.

[Hal Croves]

Hal,

I may also be confused. This is how I recall it from several years ago. The Arizona Repblican Weekly (July 18, 1903) was a newspaper that contained the highlights of the previous week taken from the daily Arizona Republican. When I found the obit, one version was unreadable in some areas and I found the second obit in the other paper which was somewhat better. I think the obit should be in both places but I will post the image of the obituary and my transcription.

Sorry about that!

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(Transcription)

Arizona Republican, Friday Morning, July 12, 1903, Page 4

G. O. ROBERTS DEAD

Succumbed to Apoplexy at His Home in Trinidad

G. O. Roberds, well known in this city, died in Trinidad, Col., on Saturday morning at 9:30 o’clock. He was down town the day before and was taken ill just before super time while doing chores around his house, dying the next morning of apoplexy. The chronicle-News of Trinidad speaks as follows of the dead man.

“In the death of Mr. Roberds the community loses one of her most honored pioneers. He came here from Texas in 1874 and since then has been identified with the best interests of the county, having been engaged actively in the cattle business and extensively engaged in mining enterprises.

“He was born in North Carolina in 1832. When very young he went to Georgia, where he was married in 1858. The next year he came west and settled in Texas, where he resided until he came to this state.

“None could tell more of the first days of the west. Twice Mr. Roberds had all taken by the Indians and for a long time he was active in defending the settlements from Indian depredations. To the young men it was very interesting to listen to the many dangers gone through with, which were more strange than fiction.

“Mr. Roberds has two brothers and a sister in Arizona. They are R. H. Roberds of Castle Creek and G. A. Roberds of Buckeye, the father of deputy sheriff Oscar Roberds. The dead man’s sister is the mother of W. A. Milton of Phoenix.

G. O. Roberds has been more or less interested in Arizona enterprises for the last twenty years and has spent nearly every winter in this city. His most notable ventures were on Castle creek where he expended a large amount of money in the development of the Whipsaw mine together with two of his Trinidad associates, Messrs. Lenhart and South. He was also interested at one time in a stamp mill alongside of which the Briggs or Castle Creek smelter was built.

Garry

Ya, that is Dr. G.O. Roberds.
Very generous Gary, thank you for sharing it.

So, Gideon16 is not G.O. Roberds.
He does seem to fit the Bark description that Cubfan64 noted.
And wintered in Phoenix.

Gideon and his father Alfred:


View attachment 1338660

View attachment 1338661

​

We still need to settle the William Roberts - Gideon Roberts question.

 

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[EarnieP]

I have a bit of a different spin on the who owned the onyx mine(s) in Cave Creek. This is just supposition on my part. I have little or nothing other than a hunch to base my assumptions on. Its just an interesting aside and does little to further the story.

I "think" R J Holmes (the elder and the younger) each owned a percentage interest in the mines. I think there were multiple claims, at least two. All known as the Dolly Varden mine(s). I believe Woodson owned a percentage (perhaps a half) with both the elder and younger Holmes under separate claims.

I suspect the elder R J Holmes died sometime prior to 1897 and the newspaper clippings of the sale of the claims involves the sale of both R J Holmes (the elder) and R J Holmes (the younger aka Dick Holmes) interests. I believe Dick Holmes (the younger) in addition to marrying an Ida, had a sister named Ida H. Holmes. Ida H. Holmes along with the remaining children of the elder Holmes executed a deed to Heyman. Dick Holmes the younger also having, by separate deed, conveyed his interest to B. Heyman.

Its just a hunch but it would explain why there were separate deeds, differing amounts, and the mention of Ida H. Holmes and others executing a separate instrument of conveyance. Ida M. Holmes, the wife of Dick, the younger, always went by Ida M. I believe the middle initial distinguished between two different people.

If anyone has access to Yavapai County records this can be easily checked.

Good grief, as if it wasn't already confusing enough with the similar male Holmes names now we have two Holmes women with the same first names? Too much for me to grasp without some kind of family chart in my hands to keep all of it straight! Must have made it easy to call them all in for supper, yell out a couple of names and everyone showed up!

I have been kind of following the 'onyx mine' stories through the old Arizona newspapers. A very interesting subject on it's own. Some of the discovers and owners names are new to me. The story of the poor rock cutter expert brought in from Chicago who was crushed by a falling slab of onyx. The use of prisoners to polish the onyx and how they spent their pay (lifers were apparently better savers than short-termers). Think some of you serious researchers could do an interesting book on that onyx mine history.
Also, was there more than one onyx mine in that area? I see locations referred to as Seven Springs, Cave Creek, and another which I can't remember at the moment. Were those all actually the same mine?

Thanks for sharing your excellent posts, you guys are outstanding!

 

[Azquester]

Onyx was a good source for arrow heads and axes. I found a chunk of Onyx while hiking cross country in the Superstitions stashed in a small hole in solid rock formation that was used for chipping arrow heads. I still have it somewhere around.

 

[azdave35]

Good grief, as if it wasn't already confusing enough with the similar male Holmes names now we have two Holmes women with the same first names? Too much for me to grasp without some kind of family chart in my hands to keep all of it straight! Must have made it easy to call them all in for supper, yell out a couple of names and everyone showed up!

I have been kind of following the 'onyx mine' stories through the old Arizona newspapers. A very interesting subject on it's own. Some of the discovers and owners names are new to me. The story of the poor rock cutter expert brought in from Chicago who was crushed by a falling slab of onyx. The use of prisoners to polish the onyx and how they spent their pay (lifers were apparently better savers than short-termers). Think some of you serious researchers could do an interesting book on that onyx mine history.
Also, was there more than one onyx mine in that area? I see locations referred to as Seven Springs, Cave Creek, and another which I can't remember at the moment. Were those all actually the same mine?

Thanks for sharing your excellent posts, you guys are outstanding!

earnie...the entire stretch of seven springs road is a rockhound paradise starting from camp creek all the way to the bloody basin tee...onyx...marble..agates..jaspers..chrysocolla and a host of other rocks and minerals are found on both sides of the road...the cave creek campground has a rock wall encasing the campground and it is made entirely of red jasper and concrete..so to answer your question there are many places along the road where onyx is found...

 

[EarnieP]

earnie...the entire stretch of seven springs road is a rockhound paradise starting from camp creek all the way to the bloody basin tee...onyx...marble..agates..jaspers..chrysocolla and a host of other rocks and minerals are found on both sides of the road...the cave creek campground has a rock wall encasing the campground and it is made entirely of red jasper and concrete..so to answer your question there are many places along the road where onyx is found...

Thanks Dave.
Do you know if there was more than one 'working onyx mine' (quarry) in that area in the late 1890's - early 1900's? Separate claims? Separate owners?
Trying to determine if all the newspapers onyx mines stories are about one mine or several?

I realize some newspaper references were to mines down in Mexico/California, I'm just talking about those in Az., north of Phoenix.

 

[sgtfda]

There is a large onyx deposit in Dewey. Glen and I were offered it for 10 million. It's on a huge federal toxic site.

 

[azdave35]

Thanks Dave.
Do you know if there was more than one 'working onyx mine' (quarry) in that area in the late 1890's - early 1900's? Separate claims? Separate owners?
Trying to determine if all the newspapers onyx mines stories are about one mine or several?

I realize some newspaper references were to mines down in Mexico/California, I'm just talking about those in Az., north of Phoenix.

earnie....the cave creek/seven springs onyx quarry is located at 34 03 42.90.. 111 52 02.56...if you look on google earth you will see other pits in the area but the one i gave coords for is probably the mine you seek...there is another famous onyx mine north of phoenix but it is near mayer ariz...that might even be the one holmes was involved in..i havent really checked into it ...they say that the travertine that was used on the model t was taken from the mayer mine

 

[EarnieP]

There's so much mineral wealth scattered throughout Arizona, when someone says; "You've got rocks in your head!", it could be a compliment!

 

[azdave35]

There's so much mineral wealth scattered throughout Arizona, when someone says; "You've got rocks in your head!", it could be a compliment!

earnie...i made a mistake...there is 2 onyx quarries in the area....there is one farther south than the one i gave you...it is at. 33 59 46.88 111 53 34.94....these are coords from a blm government website so they may or may not be correct...lol

 

[Old]

Directions to the Dolly Varden that I have say, Magazine Mining District, lying 1/4 mile N/E of Magazine Spring and about 2 miles west of the Red Rover Mine.

Looks like to me, in the area of the junction of Forest Rd 41 and Seven Springs Road. Dave, look right to you? My directions are broadly the area, not specific.

 

[azdave35]

Directions to the Dolly Varden that I have say, Magazine Mining District, lying 1/4 mile N/E of Magazine Spring and about 2 miles west of the Red Rover Mine.

Looks like to me, in the area of the junction of Forest Rd 41 and Seven Springs Road. Dave, look right to you?

old...its been a long time since i was there but i remember there is a huge boulder of travertine at the entrance to the quarry

 

[azdave35]

old...its been a long time since i was there but i remember there is a huge boulder of travertine at the entrance to the quarry

i just looked on google earth..you are correct...if you zoom in on the entrance to the quarry you will see that huge boulder of travertine at the entrance to the quarry...coords for the travertine boulder and entrance to the qruarry:
34 00 31.94
111 52 50.11

 

[Garry]

Directions to the Dolly Varden that I have say, Magazine Mining District, lying 1/4 mile N/E of Magazine Spring and about 2 miles west of the Red Rover Mine.

Looks like to me, in the area of the junction of Forest Rd 41 and Seven Springs Road. Dave, look right to you? My directions are broadly the area, not specific.

Lynda,

Nothing of consequence to add but my wife and I tried to reach the onyx mine a few years ago and it didn't go well. I was armed with the GPS Corrdinates and we parked at the parking lot near the junction of FR 41 and Seven Springs Road. I checked the GPS and we were a little over a mile from the mine. We walked south out of the parking lot and down a small canyon. It wasn't bad at first but we soon got into some cat claw and later my wife fell and was skinned up and bleeding. We had probably gone a little over a mile and we were still a mile away. The GPS showed it to the west over a rather large (to us) ridge running parrallel to our canyon. At least I had sense enough to know we needed to get out of there before something worse happened so we backtracked to the parking lot. The car was a welcome sight.

I suspect we should have proceeded west on FR 41 a few hundred yards and then followed the other side of our ridge south. We have never gone back! It wasn't a pleasant experience. I don't know why she ever trusts me?

Garry

 

[azdave35]

Lynda,

Nothing of consequence to add but my wife and I tried to reach the onyx mine a few years ago and it didn't go well. I was armed with the GPS Corrdinates and we parked at the parking lot near the junction of FR 41 and Seven Springs Road. I checked the GPS and we were a little over a mile from the mine. We walked south out of the parking lot and down a small canyon. It wasn't bad at first but we soon got into some cat claw and later my wife fell and was skinned up and bleeding. We had probably gone a little over a mile and we were still a mile away. The GPS showed it to the west over a rather large (to us) ridge running parrallel to our canyon. At least I had sense enough to know we needed to get out of there before something worse happened so we backtracked to the parking lot. The car was a welcome sight.

I suspect we should have proceeded west on FR 41 a few hundred yards and then followed the other side of our ridge south. We have never gone back! It wasn't a pleasant experience. I don't know why she ever trusts me?

Garry

garry....if you were using the coords supplied by MRDS then you would be a couple miles off...you can (or could) drive right to the onyx quarry....

 

[Garry]

garry....if you were using the coords supplied by MRDS then you would be a couple miles off...you can (or could) drive right to the onyx quarry....

Dave,

I'm not sure of whose data I was using. I got it from a site that Larry Hannah provided so it is his fault, right? In which direction from the parking lot off of FR 41 are the two miles to which you are referring?

Thanks,

Garry

 

[Old]

Ouch Garry <g>. Sounds like quite an adventure. Hope you treated the girl to a steak dinner and some good (strong) beverage.

 

[EarnieP]

earnie....the cave creek/seven springs onyx quarry is located at 34 03 42.90.. 111 52 02.56...if you look on google earth you will see other pits in the area but the one i gave coords for is probably the mine you seek...there is another famous onyx mine north of phoenix but it is near mayer ariz...that might even be the one holmes was involved in..i havent really checked into it ...they say that the travertine that was used on the model t was taken from the mayer mine

"A Valuable Onyx Mine" (1890)

The St. Johns herald. (St. Johns, Apache County, Arizona Territory [Ariz.]) 1885-1903, September 04, 1890, Image 1 « Chronicling America « Library of Congress
--------------------------------

[Edit; 7-21-16 Another old newspaper article for those interested;]

"Phoenix Onyx Company" (1898)

http://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/l...ine&y=17&x=23&dateFilterType=yearRange&page=1

 

[azdave35]

Dave,

I'm not sure of whose data I was using. I got it from a site that Larry Hannah provided so it is his fault, right? In which direction from the parking lot off of FR 41 are the two miles to which you are referring?

Thanks,

Garry

the usgs or mrds coords list the mine as being a couple miles s.w. of the intersection of fr 41 and seven springs road.....the onyx mine i have been to is at the left hand turn off about 250 ft south of the intersection of fr41 and 7 springs rd...zoom in on google and look for the big boulder..someone has actually posted a pic of it

 

[EarnieP]

I know the Charles Rodig gold mine story has been talked about many years ago on 'that other site' (at least as early as 2005), but it is an interesting story since it shares a lot in common with Waltz's own story.

Maybe those new to it, like myself, will find it as interesting as I did.

"Success At Last" (1892)

Arizona republican. (Phoenix, Ariz.) 1890-1930, August 23, 1892, Image 1 « Chronicling America « Library of Congress

 

[azdave35]

I know the Charles Rodig gold mine story has been talked about many years ago on 'that other site' (at least as early as 2005), but it is an interesting story since it shares a lot in common with Waltz's own story.

Maybe those new to it, like myself, will find it as interesting as I did.

"Success At Last" (1892)

Arizona republican. (Phoenix, Ariz.) 1890-1930, August 23, 1892, Image 1 « Chronicling America « Library of Congress

earnie....rodig's discovery was reportedly located in 4 peaks..in the southern part of the range north of the salt river....some reports list it as a placer and others say it was a lode deposit