taxes on sold silver...
- Thread starter d2arcing
- Start date
coolpix9
Bronze Member
http://www.cmi-gold-silver.com/blog/new-1099-reporting/
I have been handed 1099 forms by several dealers. One said to fill it out and return it,the other said I was on my own(insert OUCH).
These new regs were hidden inside the ever-popular Obamacare.
I have been handed 1099 forms by several dealers. One said to fill it out and return it,the other said I was on my own(insert OUCH).
These new regs were hidden inside the ever-popular Obamacare.
lostcauses
Bronze Member
d2arcing said:
Ebay is monitored by IRS on large sales, etc.
Supposedly any profits made by selling anything are to be declared and taxed..
Yet such is life and taxes and the IRS. Makes liers out of a great many people.
quiksilver
Bronze Member
lol ....... hmmm maybe its like finding asbestos in your basement....how about asbsestos in a friends basement?
if your gonna be honest and pay taxes dont forget to keep track of your costs, gas ,bank fees box fees, tolls etc.
could also be like a 50/50 scenario if there is a paper trail pay your taxes
or an honest scenario .. if the govt is honest with you then be honest with them
of course i would never condone doing anyting but whats honest when our honest goverment is concerned
if your gonna be honest and pay taxes dont forget to keep track of your costs, gas ,bank fees box fees, tolls etc.
could also be like a 50/50 scenario if there is a paper trail pay your taxes
or an honest scenario .. if the govt is honest with you then be honest with them
of course i would never condone doing anyting but whats honest when our honest goverment is concerned
legend76
Hero Member
They (the new regs you speak of) start in 2012, unless the provision is repealed. There are several bills presently in Congress that, if passed, will do just that.coolpix9 said:
blkcwbyhat
Full Member
if I recall,a 1099 is a form for an independant contractor,or self employed.The last I heard,any transaction over 600 bucks must have the form filled out.
65gt350
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Here are the guidelines for what is currently reportable. They are from a major dealer and are posted on their website. I am not sure about ebay.
List of Reportable Bullion Transactions
The majority of bullion and rare coin transactions are not reportable to Uncle Sam. For those transactions which are reportable the rules can be confusing because there are also minimum size requirements so checking with your tax consultant before taking action is a good idea. If the few government reporting requirements bother you, it is easy to do your homework and avoid products which fall into the reporting area. There are many low premium bullion bars & coins that have no reporting requirement and move directly with the spot market. If you're an advocate of the secrecy gurus, and can visit us in person, take advantage of "no name" invoices that are legal and make up a great number of our daily transactions.
The following is what The Industry Council For Tangible Assets has to offer about what the I.R.S. wants in the way of paper work. They are describing the paper work provided by bullion dealers which relate to what you purchase or sell. These rules are taken from the ICTA newsletter Washington Wire dated December, 2004.
*
First: You can place any size order and pay with a check. No one cares, not even the government. The only time they want to hear from us is if you invest more than $10,000 in cash. Then you must fill out I.R.S. Form 8300. There is nothing wrong with large cash transactions, but the government wants to know about them. And, by the way, you can't spend $5000 today and $6000 tomorrow, for Uncle Sam does not like to be fooled.
*
Second: There are rules which apply only to bullion and only when you sell. They have nothing to do with your purchases, and do not apply to rare coins. Kilo bars are 32.15 troy ounces of gold and are subject to reporting. We are also required to report any gold bar sale totalling 32.15 ounces are more. Concerning 1 troy oz. gold coin transactions: If you sell 25 coins or more of the Krugerrand, Maple Leaf or Mexican Gold Onza we are required to report them on I.R.S. Form 1099B. Such reporting is not required on transactions involving the U.S. Gold Eagle the Australian Kangaroo or the Austrian Philharmonic. There is also no reporting on any small gold bullion coins.
*
Third: We are required to report $1000 face 90% silver bags and 1000 ounce silver bar transactions only when you sell to us. We are not asked to report the sale of 40% bags or less than $1000 face in 90% silver coin. The 10 and 1 ounce silver bar is exempt as long as the sale does not exceed 1000 ounces.
*
Fourth: Platinum or palladium bars in quantities of 25 ounces or more are reportable. Platinum bullion coins like the Canadian Maple Leaf, the U.S. platinum Eagle, or the Australian Koala are exempt. Palladium bullion coins like the Russian Ballerina are exempt. If these rules seem arbitrary we don't blame you. We believe our government based their decisions on what was traded on the nation's commodity exchanges and had little to do with what was happening in coin stores across America.
HH,
65GT350
List of Reportable Bullion Transactions
The majority of bullion and rare coin transactions are not reportable to Uncle Sam. For those transactions which are reportable the rules can be confusing because there are also minimum size requirements so checking with your tax consultant before taking action is a good idea. If the few government reporting requirements bother you, it is easy to do your homework and avoid products which fall into the reporting area. There are many low premium bullion bars & coins that have no reporting requirement and move directly with the spot market. If you're an advocate of the secrecy gurus, and can visit us in person, take advantage of "no name" invoices that are legal and make up a great number of our daily transactions.
The following is what The Industry Council For Tangible Assets has to offer about what the I.R.S. wants in the way of paper work. They are describing the paper work provided by bullion dealers which relate to what you purchase or sell. These rules are taken from the ICTA newsletter Washington Wire dated December, 2004.
*
First: You can place any size order and pay with a check. No one cares, not even the government. The only time they want to hear from us is if you invest more than $10,000 in cash. Then you must fill out I.R.S. Form 8300. There is nothing wrong with large cash transactions, but the government wants to know about them. And, by the way, you can't spend $5000 today and $6000 tomorrow, for Uncle Sam does not like to be fooled.
*
Second: There are rules which apply only to bullion and only when you sell. They have nothing to do with your purchases, and do not apply to rare coins. Kilo bars are 32.15 troy ounces of gold and are subject to reporting. We are also required to report any gold bar sale totalling 32.15 ounces are more. Concerning 1 troy oz. gold coin transactions: If you sell 25 coins or more of the Krugerrand, Maple Leaf or Mexican Gold Onza we are required to report them on I.R.S. Form 1099B. Such reporting is not required on transactions involving the U.S. Gold Eagle the Australian Kangaroo or the Austrian Philharmonic. There is also no reporting on any small gold bullion coins.
*
Third: We are required to report $1000 face 90% silver bags and 1000 ounce silver bar transactions only when you sell to us. We are not asked to report the sale of 40% bags or less than $1000 face in 90% silver coin. The 10 and 1 ounce silver bar is exempt as long as the sale does not exceed 1000 ounces.
*
Fourth: Platinum or palladium bars in quantities of 25 ounces or more are reportable. Platinum bullion coins like the Canadian Maple Leaf, the U.S. platinum Eagle, or the Australian Koala are exempt. Palladium bullion coins like the Russian Ballerina are exempt. If these rules seem arbitrary we don't blame you. We believe our government based their decisions on what was traded on the nation's commodity exchanges and had little to do with what was happening in coin stores across America.
HH,
65GT350
jim4silver
Silver Member
Taxes are owed on any net profits. Just because something is non-reportable does not mean the profits are non-taxable.
Jim
Jim
47thelement
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Jim is correct!
Does anybody need a reminder of what they finally nailed Al Capone for.
Does anybody need a reminder of what they finally nailed Al Capone for.
65gt350
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jim4silver said:
Yes you are right. The OP asked how it worked when dealing with companies who need to report the transactions. I was just giving him guidelines on how and what those companies report the transactions to the IRS. In dealing with the IRS you want to make sure that your records match with what is filed. For example if you sold a bag of 90% to CNI you would get a 1099 for the full selling price. When you file your taxes you need to record the full selling price and then subtract the shipping cost and cost basis to determine the net profits. You would not want to just record the net profits since it would not match with the 1099 being filed.
This is not tax advice but I did sleep at the Holiday Inn Express last night.
HH,
65GT350
quiksilver
Bronze Member
47thelement said:
as i recall there was some sort of proof
even big brother needs proof....of course buying your house , car etc, can be a paper trail if your "on the books" job income doesnt quite cover your purchases and or expenses.
mlayers
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If you get cash you have nothing to worry about. But if you get a check and you sell m ore then $600 you are surpose to claim it......Matt
jim4silver
Silver Member
mlayers said:
If a person decides not claim their profits and pay taxes that is a personal decision. But I would not be advising that to people if I were you. The $600 amount you mention is part of the law that does not start until 2012.
Even though a coin store may not send anything to the gov when you sell (like a 1099), they do keep transaction records. Any coin store I have ever been in requires a photo ID when they sell and takes down your info and what you sold and saves it in case what you sold turns out to be stolen. The store also needs this info when they do their taxes to show what they paid out during the year to sellers (to determine their cost basis when they sell the item to somebody else). So there is a paper trail of sorts.
65gt350 said:
You are right 65GT350. I believe the proper way to document your PM sales is on a schedule D form, just like stock sales, etc.
Jim
- #16
Thread Owner
can't you just say you bought to resell in essence only made 50 bucks? but didn't save proof of the purchase...
ex: buy 100$ in 40% halves for 950, resell for 1000, get check for the 1000 but have no proof you bought them for 950 because you bought from a random person straight cash? now what...
ex: buy 100$ in 40% halves for 950, resell for 1000, get check for the 1000 but have no proof you bought them for 950 because you bought from a random person straight cash? now what...
Moneypenny
Jr. Member
d2arcing said:
Here's an article about income taxes for eBay sales in general:
http://www.moneybluebook.com/are-ebay-sellers-required-to-pay-income-tax-on-sales/
I think it answers your question: "Under current tax law, an individual who sells an item online and collects more money than its original purchased value is expected to report that money as income on his or her tax return. Items whose original purchase basis value cannot be determined is typically valued at $0 under current tax law." (Actually, I'm not sure I interpreted this correctly.)
Edit: Yeah, I think it meant what I originally thought. If you can't produce records that you bought it at $950 they will assume you got it for free and made $1000 profit. Correct me if I'm wrong.
quiksilver
Bronze Member
If we are gonna assume anything lets assume big brother is reading this
Demon_Wolf
Jr. Member
So what are you suppose to do if you buy $10,000 dollars worth of old silver coins and silver drops by $20 dollars a ounce and you sell it for a loss of $6000. Do you report the lost income?
diggummup
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When it comes to ebay, you must sell more than 20k and have over 200 paypal transactions before it gets reported to the IRS at the end of the year. Though technically.............well you know.
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