Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead - SOLVED

[pjroo33]

Looking for a little help on this unknown. It was found at about 4 inches at a home built around 1750. Any help is appreciated.

 

[Iron Patch]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

That is awesome!! My good friend Ryan got permission for us to hunt a homestead outside of Philadelphia. I didn't have a whole lot of time because my wife just had our first child 2 weeks ago. My mother was in town to see the baby for a week and I got the wife's ok to head out for a couple hours. We spent maybe 2 hrs at the site. I found 2 Merc. Dimes 1929 and 1943. Nothing else except a couple clads and this buckle. Ryan pulled a 1816 Coronet Large Cent as our time was running out. Needless to say, I was scrambling at that point. He knows a lot of history of the area and said that the middle section of the house was built in the 1600's, and the section near where we were hunting had a date stone of 1752 (I think) might have been 1754. I found the buckle about halfway through the hunt and didn't give it a second thought. It was so dirt encrusted It was pretty unrecognizable. Got home and cleaned off the Mercs and started tending to the wife and baby. Today (7 days later), I decided to have a look at that "unknown" find that was still in my bag from the hunt. As I was washing off the dirt, I began to see some detail. Thats when I decided I'd better have some experts take a look.

How confident are we that it is a Type V buckle from 1660-1720?

If thats the case, it's my oldest find to date.

Thanks for the help everyone!

I don't know how confident you are but I feel pretty good about it. I have hunted many mid. 1700s sites and it predates the styles we find. The value is not in the item, but the history , therefore making it not worth much. A great old find never the less.

 

[CRUSADER]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

That is awesome!! My good friend Ryan got permission for us to hunt a homestead outside of Philadelphia. I didn't have a whole lot of time because my wife just had our first child 2 weeks ago. My mother was in town to see the baby for a week and I got the wife's ok to head out for a couple hours. We spent maybe 2 hrs at the site. I found 2 Merc. Dimes 1929 and 1943. Nothing else except a couple clads and this buckle. Ryan pulled a 1816 Coronet Large Cent as our time was running out. Needless to say, I was scrambling at that point. He knows a lot of history of the area and said that the middle section of the house was built in the 1600's, and the section near where we were hunting had a date stone of 1752 (I think) might have been 1754. I found the buckle about halfway through the hunt and didn't give it a second thought. It was so dirt encrusted It was pretty unrecognizable. Got home and cleaned off the Mercs and started tending to the wife and baby. Today (7 days later), I decided to have a look at that "unknown" find that was still in my bag from the hunt. As I was washing off the dirt, I began to see some detail. Thats when I decided I'd better have some experts take a look.

How confident are we that it is a Type V buckle from 1660-1720?

If thats the case, it's my oldest find to date.

Thanks for the help everyone!

I don't know how confident you are but I feel pretty good about it. I have hunted many mid. 1700s sites and it predates the styles we find. The value is not in the item, but the history , therefore making it not worth much. A great old find never the less.

Well said. Value ($) has little bearing on the thrill of YOU being the finder of history. But if you want to know, in the UK you would be lucky to get £2 for it ($4), however in your market with the provenance it must worth at least $20.

 

[Iron Patch]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

That is awesome!! My good friend Ryan got permission for us to hunt a homestead outside of Philadelphia. I didn't have a whole lot of time because my wife just had our first child 2 weeks ago. My mother was in town to see the baby for a week and I got the wife's ok to head out for a couple hours. We spent maybe 2 hrs at the site. I found 2 Merc. Dimes 1929 and 1943. Nothing else except a couple clads and this buckle. Ryan pulled a 1816 Coronet Large Cent as our time was running out. Needless to say, I was scrambling at that point. He knows a lot of history of the area and said that the middle section of the house was built in the 1600's, and the section near where we were hunting had a date stone of 1752 (I think) might have been 1754. I found the buckle about halfway through the hunt and didn't give it a second thought. It was so dirt encrusted It was pretty unrecognizable. Got home and cleaned off the Mercs and started tending to the wife and baby. Today (7 days later), I decided to have a look at that "unknown" find that was still in my bag from the hunt. As I was washing off the dirt, I began to see some detail. Thats when I decided I'd better have some experts take a look.

How confident are we that it is a Type V buckle from 1660-1720?

If thats the case, it's my oldest find to date.

Thanks for the help everyone!

I don't know how confident you are but I feel pretty good about it. I have hunted many mid. 1700s sites and it predates the styles we find. The value is not in the item, but the history , therefore making it not worth much. A great old find never the less.

Well said. Value ($) has little bearing on the thrill of YOU being the finder of history. But if you want to know, in the UK you would be lucky to get £2 for it ($4), however in your market with the provenance it must worth at least $20.

The right person may pay even more than that, all considering, but probably not ever enough to make you want to sell it. I don't mind those types of finds because they're easy to keep!

 

[RELICDUDE07]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

Good point ironpatch.You may keep it and later turn up another that goes with it,and a large beltbuckle of the same style.And then you have a nice set ..

 

[pjroo33]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

Turns out to be a pretty exciting find. Wish I had known that when I dug it. It's going to be tough finding anything older around here.

 

[CanUDigIt]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

Sweet PJ! Congrats! That is an awesome buckle!

 

[Hardy]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

A BANNER PIECE, NICE BUCKLE

 

[Montana Jim]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

Pj,

If you decide that Colonial era stuff is the most interesting, get some books and immerse yourself in it. That buckle is a beautiful start.

Start thinking of your finds as specimens and examples.

Not that you need me to plehbah- but I agree!

Here is a great start and an easy read... it's a click away:

http://www.gutenberg.org/files/16277/16277-h/16277-h.htm

 

[ivan salis]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

some things are worth more than a small bit of money ever would be -- $20 hah what a small amount for such a cool old rare item --- Ivan

 

[CRUSADER]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

some things are worth more than a small bit of money ever would be -- $20 hah what a small amount for such a cool old rare item --- Ivan

It was only a guess, I have no idea what you US pay for such a common find Who's to say they didn't buy 20 of them of ebay from the UK for £10 the lot (buckles are very collectable but are cheap on ebay in the UK).

As we all know items like these sell for whatever you like, its not like a electrical good or car which has a price band. Its what I like about UK Antiquities you will never guess what it maybe worth to the right person. I collect rare artefacts & for some items I will out bid everyone with no limits.

 

[pjroo33]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

some things are worth more than a small bit of money ever would be -- $20 hah what a small amount for such a cool old rare item --- Ivan

It was only a guess, I have no idea what you US pay for such a common find Who's to say they didn't buy 20 of them of ebay from the UK for £10 the lot (buckles are very collectable but are cheap on ebay in the UK).

As we all know items like these sell for whatever you like, its not like a electrical good or car which has a price band. Its what I like about UK Antiquities you will never guess what it maybe worth to the right person. I collect rare artefacts & for some items I will out bid everyone with no limits.

I can't imagine a buckle from that era would be a common find here in the states. I could be wrong. I know UK finds are always much, much older and a buckle from 1660-1720 would be considered fairly modern.

Do you think the buckle was made in the US? Is there any way for me to get info like that?

Would electrolysis be a good idea for the rust or should I just leave it as is. Possible maker's mark?

Thanks again for all your help.

 

[pjroo33]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

Very interesting site. Looks very detailed.
Thanks

Pj,

If you decide that Colonial era stuff is the most interesting, get some books and immerse yourself in it. That buckle is a beautiful start.

Start thinking of your finds as specimens and examples.

Not that you need me to plehbah- but I agree!

Here is a great start and an easy read... it's a click away:

http://www.gutenberg.org/files/16277/16277-h/16277-h.htm

 

[RELICDUDE07]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

The only place there common in U.S. is on shipwrecks ....I would just use some oil and a soft tooth brush ,and then leave it alone..As far as where it came from,you should look up the history and study who were the first around your area.It looks english to me, but it could be spanish as well..I would keep it, i bet you find something else that goes with it from the area..Goodluck

 

[CRUSADER]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

some things are worth more than a small bit of money ever would be -- $20 hah what a small amount for such a cool old rare item --- Ivan

It was only a guess, I have no idea what you US pay for such a common find Who's to say they didn't buy 20 of them of ebay from the UK for £10 the lot (buckles are very collectable but are cheap on ebay in the UK).

As we all know items like these sell for whatever you like, its not like a electrical good or car which has a price band. Its what I like about UK Antiquities you will never guess what it maybe worth to the right person. I collect rare artefacts & for some items I will out bid everyone with no limits.

I can't imagine a buckle from that era would be a common find here in the states. I could be wrong. I know UK finds are always much, much older and a buckle from 1660-1720 would be considered fairly modern.

Do you think the buckle was made in the US? Is there any way for me to get info like that?

Would electrolysis be a good idea for the rust or should I just leave it as is. Possible maker's mark?

Thanks again for all your help.

I should have made it clearer. Its a common UK find (Not US, I suspect its very rare). However the point I was making was that those in the know could buy them very cheaply in the UK & sell them as rare US finds for X amount. (therefore impacting on its value)

It is unlikely to be US made. They are of a style copied in many European Countries.

DON'T CLEAN - these do not have makers marks on them, unless you were lucky enough to get a silver version.

 

[RELICDUDE07]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

You can not clean aswell.but i have found that WD40 and a soft tooth brush has never hurt any soild cast brass relics i have found from around this period ,and brings out all the details ..They are very durable and last for ever.. as you can tell,unlike pewter and copper.

 

[CRUSADER]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

You can not clean aswell.but i have found that WD40 and a soft tooth brush has never hurt any soild cast brass relics i have found from around this period ,and brings out all the details ..They are very durable and last for ever.. as you can tell,unlike pewter and copper.

Do you mean clean off the rust? I think it looks good how it is, this rust is part of its attraction to me

 

[RELICDUDE07]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

I guess so.Im not a big fan of rust,see so much around fl..salt from the gulf of mexico ,eats away at everything..Cars ,homes,relics. It may have some more nice detail in the center Maybe, thats just me.

 

[Montana Jim]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

Relics should either be left alone or best preserved as is... IMO

 

[CRUSADER]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

I guess so.Im not a big fan of rust,see so much around fl..salt from the gulf of mexico ,eats away at everything..Cars ,homes,relics. It may have some more nice detail in the center Maybe, thats just me.

At the end of the day, the finder can choose to do whatever makes him happy.

However, strangely enough artefacts with what is described as 'iron residue' left on the piece are more desirable to the top collectors. The iron pin which is only now visible as rust was part of the piece & therefore should be preserved with it. Only when items are in danger of deterioration should they be treated.

 

[RELICDUDE07]

Re: Unknown find from 18th Century Homestead

Your right crusader that rust piece could fall out.And then only the brass left..I just like the rich green luster and the details oil brings out.. If you do clean it ,be careful not to scrub the area in the center to hard.This may help you if you find some more in the area..Goodluck at your spot.