KGC Hoot Owl Trees with Symbols & Letters

[sdcfia]

Here's an interesting coincidence involving a hoot owl tree situated in an area oozing with treasure lore. It's a series of four manmade clues that all fall on exactly the same azimuth. The line extends 4-1/2 miles from a sunburst carving near the top of a mountain to an etched heart shaped rock lying in a well known placer mining creek. The tree is the second object on the line, the bird rock the third. Here are the four objects:

 

[Carl-NC]

That tree looks to be 30-40 yrs old. So what makes a tree a hoot owl tree as opposed to a tree that was bent by nature?

 

[sdcfia]

That tree looks to be 30-40 yrs old. So what makes a tree a hoot owl tree as opposed to a tree that was bent by nature?

Very observant Carl - good point. We found that manipulated Ponderosa Pine about 10 years ago and we estimated it was maybe about 40 years old at that time, more or less, based on its height and diameter. If so, that would have placed its origin around 1975, more or less. It could have then been manipulated into its present shape, as you say, by nature or by man at a fairly young age when it's trunk was still pliable. Let's say it happened in the early 1980s, a decent estimate.

This tree is only interesting because of two things. First, its position on a 337 degree azimuth along with three widely separated carved rocks being too precise to be a coincidence. Second, the big reveal of alleged "KGC clues" that appeared in this part of New Mexico in the 1980s along with at least one massive new "lost treasure" legend, previously unknown before then. My working model of the "KGC phenomenon", including the Black Book publication in 1975 and the subsequent appearance of numerous "KGC treasures" around the West in the years that followed.

 

[Carl-NC]

I do a lot of hiking & backpacking and I've seen these bent trees quite often. From saplings to 100-yr olds and everything in between. What this tells me is that bent trees are continuously being formed and by nature, not human manipulation. Most likely ice storms.

The Internet is full of articles on them being Indian trail markers but I have serious doubts about this. First, how would you distinguish a naturally bent tree from an intentionally bent tree? That alone makes it a poor choice for a marker. Next, a bent tree takes many many years to grow big enough to be a useful marker, making it a pretty useless marker in the present. Third, Indians probably didn't need markers, they knew the land exceptionally well.

You've assigned significance to the bent tree because it happens to lie on a line that crosses some other odd-looking elements. And you've assigned significance to that line because of those odd-looking elements. Most likely there is no significance to any of it, they are just odd-looking elements. Most likely the heart rock and bird rock are natural, just from the 2 photos I don't see anything that suggests manipulation. Also, I've seen a ton of odd-looking rocks on my hikes, they are pretty common. In the first photo it's hard to tell because it's zoomed in pretty tight.

I consider the Black Book to be obvious fiction, and it seems to be a major originating source of subsequent KGC lore. Absolutely none of which has any backing evidence, nor any resulting recovered treasure. Yes, I know, no one would ever publicize finding a KGC treasure, but if it actually happened I bet you would hear about it.

 

[cuzimloony]

sdcfia says:
The line extends 4-1/2 miles from a sunburst carving near the top of a mountain to an etched heart shaped rock lying in a well known placer mining creek.

Funny. I just found at the top of Miner's Needle in the Sups, a "snake with a sunburst head" right near a carved human head (in rock) which lead to a giant carved heart on the canyon floor..... Maybe not all on the same azimuth (i gotta check that) but all on the same trail.

Interesting.

 

[cuzimloony]

"This went on for decades, with particular heavy activity occurring in the 1930s and 1980s."

Care to expand on that?

 

[sdcfia]

. . .
I consider the Black Book to be obvious fiction, and it seems to be a major originating source of subsequent KGC lore. Absolutely none of which has any backing evidence, nor any resulting recovered treasure. Yes, I know, no one would ever publicize finding a KGC treasure, but if it actually happened I bet you would hear about it.

The book may be simply allegorical, based on an underlying argument that there is an organized group of elites that have planned for the eventual demise of USA Inc. and have cached gold in many places to be retrieved later in order to finance their future. Of course all the characters were not Jesse James aliases, but they were real people who presumably are alleged to be the organization.

True? Who knows? For that matter, the news of the day and the history taught to us in school are likely fiction too IMO. Why was the book written? Who knows?

 

[sdcfia]

sdcfia says:
The line extends 4-1/2 miles from a sunburst carving near the top of a mountain to an etched heart shaped rock lying in a well known placer mining creek.

Funny. I just found at the top of Miner's Needle in the Sups, a "snake with a sunburst head" right near a carved human head (in rock) which lead to a giant carved heart on the canyon floor..... Maybe not all on the same azimuth (i gotta check that) but all on the same trail.

Interesting.

It's good to keep your eyes open and to check out all curiosities. You never know. As far as the 4-1/2 mile line goes, when it is rotated 90° clockwise from the sunburst, it leads one to a much, much more interesting item than a placer mining site. Get coordinates on all the curiosities you find, then plot them up (Google Earth Pro isn't perfect, but it's pretty handy) and see what it tells you, if anything.

 

[sdcfia]

"This went on for decades, with particular heavy activity occurring in the 1930s and 1980s."

Care to expand on that?

Following the 1933 Gold Act, most Americans complied and redeemed their gold coins for paper gold certificates (denominated Federal Reserve Notes), and then subsequently lost 70% of their wealth when FDR revalued gold from $20.67 to $35 per ounce. Those who knew what was coming refused and hid the coins or melted them into crude bars. A lot of this was cached.

New caches needed more security. Many new fabricated treasure tales found their way into the public domain in the 1930s through adventure magazines and sensational newspaper stories. It's a common template used to confuse a new cache by conflating it with an historical lost Spanish mine in the same general area. Searchers following fake details just ran in empty circles.

After the Black Book and other sources introduced/strengthened the KGC cache idea in 1975, around 1980 there seemed to be a number of anecdotal stories appearing in the media of people searching for KGC caches, spurred by the location of numerous treasure carvings, many introduced by a "Mexican with a map." I got involved myself in those days, and it piqued my interest in lots of "treasure lore".

I wondered if this had any connection with Nixon's removal of the ability to redeem paper certificates for physical metal in 1971. Gold then became just a commodity for most people - no longer "money". I'm not sure I see a connection, but the price of gold had risen to about $600/oz by 1980, so it sure stimulated interest in lost mines and hidden treasures.

 

[robertk]

I'm not sure I see a connection, but the price of gold had risen to about $600/oz by 1980, so it sure stimulated interest in lost mines and hidden treasures.

Did the gold price rise? Or did the value of the paper dollar fall?

 

[cuzimloony]

Following the 1933 Gold Act, most Americans complied and redeemed their gold coins for paper gold certificates (denominated Federal Reserve Notes), and then subsequently lost 70% of their wealth when FDR revalued gold from $20.67 to $35 per ounce. Those who knew what was coming refused and hid the coins or melted them into crude bars. A lot of this was cached. Casheing makes sense. Go on.......

New caches needed more security. (If these things are still being hidden/protected today, why would anyone go through the trouble of marking signs into rocks or trees when they can just write down the gps coords of the final spot and be done with it? No signs for curious wanderers that way...) Many new fabricated treasure tales found their way into the public domain in the 1930s through adventure magazines and sensational newspaper stories. The Wagoner comes to mind. It's a common template used to confuse a new cache by conflating it with an historical lost Spanish mine in the same general area. Hehe they're all Peralta mines, didn't you know? Searchers following fake details just ran in empty circles. I know the feeling.

After the Black Book and other sources introduced/strengthened the KGC cache idea in 1975, around 1980 there seemed to be a number of anecdotal stories appearing in the media of people searching for KGC caches, spurred by the location of numerous treasure carvings, many introduced by a "Mexican with a map." Are you familiar with Ron Quinn? I got involved myself in those days, and it piqued my interest in lots of "treasure lore". Understandably so.

I wondered if this had any connection with Nixon's removal of the ability to redeem paper certificates for physical metal in 1971. Gold then became just a commodity for most people - no longer "money". I'm not sure I see a connection, but the price of gold had risen to about $600/oz by 1980, so it sure stimulated interest in lost mines and hidden treasures.

Thanks sdcfia.

 

[mdog]

I do a lot of hiking & backpacking and I've seen these bent trees quite often. From saplings to 100-yr olds and everything in between. What this tells me is that bent trees are continuously being formed and by nature, not human manipulation. Most likely ice storms.

The Internet is full of articles on them being Indian trail markers but I have serious doubts about this. First, how would you distinguish a naturally bent tree from an intentionally bent tree? That alone makes it a poor choice for a marker. Next, a bent tree takes many many years to grow big enough to be a useful marker, making it a pretty useless marker in the present. Third, Indians probably didn't need markers, they knew the land exceptionally well.

You've assigned significance to the bent tree because it happens to lie on a line that crosses some other odd-looking elements. And you've assigned significance to that line because of those odd-looking elements. Most likely there is no significance to any of it, they are just odd-looking elements. Most likely the heart rock and bird rock are natural, just from the 2 photos I don't see anything that suggests manipulation. Also, I've seen a ton of odd-looking rocks on my hikes, they are pretty common. In the first photo it's hard to tell because it's zoomed in pretty tight.

I consider the Black Book to be obvious fiction, and it seems to be a major originating source of subsequent KGC lore. Absolutely none of whic Even if the h has any backing evidence, nor any resulting recovered treasure. Yes, I know, no one would ever publicize finding a KGC treasure, but if it actually happened I bet you would hear about it.

Hi Carl. Even if the tree were naturally bent, it could still be used as a point on a line. Same thing with an unusual looking rock or geological formation. Some type of confirmation mark, chisel marks, carvings or measurements, would show it to be a marked trail.

I don't think you could trust any carved treasure signs, at this point in time. Treasurenet and various treasure related TV shows have made many people aware of what treasure signs and symbols look like. Even Bob Brewer's book, Rebel Gold, has described layouts and symbols associated with treasure. A few guys with a sense of humor could set up a fake treasure site on a free weekend, and then sit back and laugh at all the suckers who are out busting through the bush trying to find buried treasure. There are some, including myself, who believe the Masons did this very thing, during the 19th century.

 

[point hunter]

That tree looks to be 30-40 yrs old. So what makes a tree a hoot owl tree as opposed to a tree that was bent by nature?

Mr. Carl. The best explanation I can give you is to walk the line both ways. Not only the way its pointing, but also 180 degrees back azmith. If no other trail trees, twisted limbs, or other oddites/clues within say a couple miles then I'd assume it's not valid. Back here, the trails seem to come from multiple directions to beech tree carving sites. That is the validation for me when I find the carved beech and sometimes oak trees. As I said previously, it seems that the youngest bent/carved trees are from the 70's to 80's. This is inline with and helps valid Imho SD's statements.

 

[cuzimloony]

Hi Carl. Even if the tree were naturally bent, it could still be used as a point on a line. Same thing with an unusual looking rock or geological formation. Some type of confirmation mark, chisel marks, carvings or measurements, would show it to be a marked trail.

I don't think you could trust any carved treasure signs, at this point in time. Treasurenet and various treasure related TV shows have made many people aware of what treasure signs and symbols look like. Even Bob Brewer's book, Rebel Gold, has described layouts and symbols associated with treasure. A few guys with a sense of humor could set up a fake treasure site on a free weekend, and then sit back and laugh at all the suckers who are out busting through the bush trying to find buried treasure. There are some, including myself, who believe the Masons did this very thing, during the 19th century.

I've left a couple easter eggs to be found on Google Earth, not to throw anyone off or anything, but just to give people a chuckle. I'm just waiting on them to update their satellite imagery. Lot's of rocks to work with in the Sups.
Jeez, maybe it's a Mason thing.

 

[sdcfia]

Did the gold price rise? Or did the value of the paper dollar fall?

It was the $value of gold that rose dramatically between 1971 and 1980. But remember, the gold price had been frozen at $35 until 1971, then allowed to be priced at whatever people were willing to pay for it. Now gold is 100 times more costly in US dollars since 1971, which to most people means that the dollar has lost at least 90% of its purchasing power the last 54 years. Seems about right.

 

[markmar]

Still KGC doing some activity todays?

 

[Hoss KGC]

Two Hoot Owl trees near a very famous Civil War Fort, can someone help with deciphering the symbols and letters...or is there a resource(book of symbols, etc.) out there to help me decipher these symbols?...please send a private message and not post on this thread with any info so I can talk with you more about it. The two white pages are drawings of what is on the 2 trees with a directional compass I drew on top of page for direction and the big V's with the compass up top represent the direction the limb elbows are pointing above the markings...any help is appreciated. Thank you

These trees are KGC. This doesn't appear to be a map tree. You need to find the map tree which gives information such as where the layout starts, key numbers used in the layout, bearings used in the layout, and topographic features. Good luck.

 

[Hoss KGC]

If you think pointer trees aren't made by the KGC because it's only 40 years old then you are making a bad assumption. If you think the KGC didn't put treasure down along with their layouts in the 1960s or even the 1980s, then you are making a bad assumption. If you think the KGC doesn't exist today, then you are making a bad assumption. I'm telling you what I know, not what I think...no assumptions...but you believe what you want to believe.