Dig all those signals! Counterfeit (maybe) Connecticut Copper!

[Bramblefind]

I went out this morning to a site I have been going to for years. It is really where I got my start detecting. On other digs I found a 1795 large cent and a whole bunch of nice buttons there. But it has been very quiet lately. I was there for nearly 2 hours and not finding much at all and decided to head back home.

I went to the old road and started walking up the side. It is also an area where I have dug many modern bullets etc. Since when the local farmers were teens they used to practice shooting there. I got a solid "zinc" signal and I thought ok here is a shotgun shell end to finish the day. This will be my last target.

I put the shovel in and flipped the dirt and out popped this! I couldn't believe it! Probably 2 inches down! I scanned it again just to be sure and once again it came up very low in the zinc range.

After showing it to some colonial coin experts there was a request made to nick the edge to see if any copper color would come through - I did a good scratch to it and it looks white. It also shows signs of being cast. Still inconclusive on what its origins might be - my gut since I first picked it up is that it is a counterfeit. But I haven't handled too many Connecticuts.

** I give up on getting the photos in the correct order**

 

[mep4888]

Found one just like it today, ringing up in the twenties on the vdi scale. thought mine may be a counterfeit also. Even still, it's a very OLD counterfeit. Cool find.

 

[oldsalty19]

How could it be conterfit......."WHO" would be counterfiting back then and in such a low amount......?

 

[Henry2]

You might have a Machin Mills counterfeit, you are in the right area for such a find. Not long ago I got a 1776 George III copper, after some research I learned it was a fake although to my surprise it is worth more than some of the real ones.

 

[Don in SJ]

How could it be conterfit......."WHO" would be counterfiting back then and in such a low amount......?

I suggest you read about counterfeits on the Notre Dame website, than you will answer your question yourself. Counterfeiting has been going on for a long time........


Counterfeit British Coppers

Don

 

[Iron Patch]

Interesting and makes me wonder about counterfeits being among the known types. I mean how would they know if it was unique dies, that was well made, struck, copper, and close in weight.

 

[BuckleBoy]

That is a great find! I hope you are able to get some more information about it.

 

[CASPER-2]

i HAVE ONE LIKE THAT TOO - used XLT and VDI # was in the 20's i think
did research and supposedly they made real ones out of an alloy for a short time
they did not work out and went back to original formula - so yours could be an actual minting
i will see if I can find site that talks about these

 

[Rick (Nova Scotia)]

Can't help in the genuine / counterfeit department, I can't see a thing one the one side.

But here are some thoughts I have;

1) cant believe any "expert" suggest you damage your coin as any king of testing method, even if it's not worth a fortune, and since they didn't know, maybe it is ?

2) the low zinc reading is not suprising at all, I found quite a few old coins, they can read all over the place. I did think it strange as an older bigger coin could have a lower reading than a much smaller new one. My theory is it depends a lot on what exact chemical concoction has encrusted the piece.

3) Don't know why your seeing white in the nick, if it is of that age it would have long since rotted if it were zinc as your MD thinks it is, and that is not the case. The coin is in good shape as far as rot goes, with it's sharp corners.

 

[jerseyben]

My counterfeit KGII rang up in the zinc range as well.

 

[Iron Patch]

My counterfeit KGII rang up in the zinc range as well.

That's not uncommon because we expect many to ring lower because of the amount of counterfeits.

 

[Valley Ranger]

Very interesting - thanks for posting.

 

[Iron Patch]

1) cant believe any "expert" suggest you damage your coin as any king of testing method, even if it's not worth a fortune, and since they didn't know, maybe it is ?

In either scenario it wouldn't really matter. Being noting special in that condition makes it low value, and if it was the other way, a super rarity, a collector's main issue would be the over all condition and not a mark on the edge. That being said you can probably see the metal with a much smaller mark and a bright light.

I think there's very little chance of it be anything great because first it would have to be genuine, and 2nd you would have to ID the variety, and I think only one of those questions has a chance at being answered... and if it's true what was said in a post about the mint (s) possibly using alloys then maybe even determining whether it's genuine or counterfeit could be impossible.

 

[Bramblefind]

Hi Rick The damage to the coin really is minimal to the naked eye. It looks much brighter in the photo due to magnification and catching it with the lighting. I've studied and sold a number of old coins now and I am OK with this. Though I probably scratched it more than I needed to.

I have sent this coin out for x-ray analysis to help determine the metal composition. I will update with the results of that.

It might not be zinc but possibly pewter.. I'll see what I can find out.

Thanks all!

Can't help in the genuine / counterfeit department, I can't see a thing one the one side.

But here are some thoughts I have;

1) cant believe any "expert" suggest you damage your coin as any king of testing method, even if it's not worth a fortune, and since they didn't know, maybe it is ?

2) the low zinc reading is not suprising at all, I found quite a few old coins, they can read all over the place. I did think it strange as an older bigger coin could have a lower reading than a much smaller new one. My theory is it depends a lot on what exact chemical concoction has encrusted the piece.

3) Don't know why your seeing white in the nick, if it is of that age it would have long since rotted if it were zinc as your MD thinks it is, and that is not the case. The coin is in good shape as far as rot goes, with it's sharp corners.

 

[Bramblefind]

i HAVE ONE LIKE THAT TOO - used XLT and VDI # was in the 20's i think
did research and supposedly they made real ones out of an alloy for a short time
they did not work out and went back to original formula - so yours could be an actual minting
i will see if I can find site that talks about these

That would be great! Really interesting too! Please post if you find it again

 

[flakefinder]

Very interesting thanks for posting and keep us updated if you would, Good Hunting!!!!

 

[steelheadwill]

Big Congrats Bramble!!
I LOVE period counterfiets, they come in all types of metals and degrees of quality.
a couple I have found could never have been passed by themselves,
they may have been used in transactions where the coinage was traded by bulk weight
rather than individual pieces.... IE, an 18 gram draped cent struck in lead
Great Find! Keep em coming!!

 

[Rickiowa2009]

Interesting find

 

[Bramblefind]

Thanks Herbie! And thanks everyone for the responses. The test results on the coin came in. Here are excerpts from the report:

________________________________

Copper (61.94%), Iron (15.85%), Lead (10.08%), Tin (7.8%), Arsenic (2.3%), Antimony (0.5%), Zinc (0.5%), Bismuth (0.27%), Silver (0.27%), Nickel (0.11%) & Platinum (0.25%).

Good News: Its a legitimate bronze (Cu/Sn) cast. Note the high iron due to burial - a common outside contaminant from burial still remaining on the surface. Note the good array of trace constituents confirming it as 18thC.

.....

.. Cast coins of the realm are rare. U.S. Colonial coppers as NJs, Ct's and Vermonts do seem to have lower copper levels than English produced coins but never really below 85-90% copper for these halfpence sized pieces.

______________________________

So I am very pleased Probably my best find yet!

 

[Wldbil]

Either way it is a very cool find... Old either way as well. Congrats