TRICKERY OF THE TRADE

[MadMarshall]

Having spent a number of years prospecting I have encountered a number of differnt ways men try to captilize on the ingnorance of men exspeacialy when dealing with rules and regulations and claim staking. Having never beining sastisfied with the words of men I have taken upon myself to find multiple sources for information. And here are a few things I have learned to watch out for Be wary of a man willing to let you work his claim as why would anyone give away money he has rights too all too often they just want you for a day or two to help move overburden or old tailing and when they get to the desired spot your help is no longer needed. Also In my research of claims all too often are claims filed with the county recorders office and not with blm. and once someone wants to buy it the company file with blm and then sell it you.. so much property that is not recorded properly and are beining sold to people who don't know any better. And it's been my experiance that the people with all the good ideas rarely have the will to put them into action.. As I'm sure everyone has met the person with no children telling you how to raise children! the same is even more true with gold hell most prospectors I meet know of some great vein or way to get gold but for some reason they choose not to.. Also I have had men try to tell me they had claims that were Grandfathered in.. And I must admitt that the individual who told me that was very convincing and even had sighns little did he know that he picked the one man who was goinin to go home and find every document for that area known to man..And of course he was a liar and I pursued the matter and confronted him with facts.. I now work that area to this day for some reason he don't come around no more.I got story after story as Im sure lots of you do and I am very interested in hearing about the TRICKERY's OF THE TRADE from some of you. My grandpa always told me to pay extra care with all two legged creatures!! Oh yea always double check when selling gold that they are giving you the percent they say they are and are on current gold prices as I have encountered more then a few jewelers/prospecting stores/gold buyers that use week old prices or just outright lie about current prices.

 

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[TerryC]

Some of us, Mad, invite people over to claims for the simple joy of sharing with friends... no strings attached. TimC and I have some claims that others work. They take home gold. I even put them in my RV, free. Take them down to the claims, free. Let them use the most up-to-date equipment, free. When I'm not there, as right now (two guests at the moment), I give TimC an expense account. Gasoline, propane, food, and other costs are picked up by Tim and I. Our guests stay without spending a dime.... unless thay want to. Don't lump me or others on the Net into a general category. I know you didn't mean to. TTC

 

[TerryC]

Incidently, a claim not filed with the BLM is an open claim and subject to being claimed by anyone quick enough. TTC

 

[sidvail]

TerryC
How does that county/BLM issue work? If a claim was not filed with BLM, but was at local level, could someone else claim it? Is that possible, or does the local claim prevent that? Is that a form of claim jumping?

 

[MadMarshall]

Some of us, Mad, invite people over to claims for the simple joy of sharing with friends... no strings attached. TimC and I have some claims that others work. They take home gold. I even put them in my RV, free. Take them down to the claims, free. Let them use the most up-to-date equipment, free. When I'm not there, as right now (two guests at the moment), I give TimC an expense account. Gasoline, propane, food, and other costs are picked up by Tim and I. Our guests stay without spending a dime.... unless thay want to. Don't lump me or others on the Net into a general category. I know you didn't mean to. TTC

TerryC Thankyou for your understanding as I only speak of my own experiances and am quite amazed that individuals like you exsist.(I Admitt I doubt I would be so generous!) and wish I have known of you when I was working that crappy claim my brother bought in 2009 around meyer AZ how I suspect my values and experiance as a prospector would have most definitly benifited. And I often have the trouble putting thought into words properly. I once met a man in 2009 who was known around the Bear river as the" GOLD NAZI" who talked about this awesome claim he had and so forth and convinced my brother and another individual to go up to the north fork salmon river and work his claim Granted beining dazzled by the allure of gold and claim I never questioned him nor did any one else. Long story short we get up there very early in the season to work have him leave a week later and a storm hit the next day and we ended up snowed in at mule bridge campgrounds let me just say that the their was no claim and thanks to a understanding forest service no real harm was done other then a month and half of cold crappy weather and the costant reminder on how stupid I can choose to be!! OH YEA "GOLD NAZI" I'm looking for you bud

 

[leadnugget]

it seems like when it comes to prospecting and gold, it draws out the greedy and kooks.
about 10 or so years ago i heard about the prospecting shop in Prescott valley AZ buying some gold that was laced with brass filings,
i think it was at least an ounce.
then there are the ebay mining claim sellers, selling worthless claims to people from out of state.
so yea the scumbags are out there. however there are a lot of good people out there too.
the ones willing to help a newbie, or help with an idea.
its just like life, there are good people and bad.

 

[AzViper]

Some of us, Mad, invite people over to claims for the simple joy of sharing with friends... no strings attached. TimC and I have some claims that others work. They take home gold. I even put them in my RV, free. Take them down to the claims, free. Let them use the most up-to-date equipment, free. When I'm not there, as right now (two guests at the moment), I give TimC an expense account. Gasoline, propane, food, and other costs are picked up by Tim and I. Our guests stay without spending a dime.... unless thay want to. Don't lump me or others on the Net into a general category. I know you didn't mean to. TTC

Well said TerryC. Nothing ever is wrong offering to help others. Someday the rewards will reverse and you will be on the other side and be that grateful person. Most level headed people can read between the lines.

 

[kuger]

it seems like when it comes to prospecting and gold, it draws out the greedy and kooks.
about 10 or so years ago i heard about the prospecting shop in Prescott valley AZ buying some gold that was laced with brass filings,
i think it was at least an ounce.
then there are the ebay mining claim sellers, selling worthless claims to people from out of state.
so yea the scumbags are out there. however there are a lot of good people out there too.
the ones willing to help a newbie, or help with an idea.
its just like life, there are good people and bad.

...it does!!!The reason I no longer will enter a partner venture,just out to have fun,you keep what you find,one day at a time,yea,never anything more than that,ever again!!!

 

[Fullpan]

I have met both kinds, many times, the bad ones help you learn "street smarts", the good ones rekindle your faith in mankind. Note: the bad ones tend to
wave their arms and talk loud.

 

[Oakview2]

...it does!!!The reason I no longer will enter a partner venture,just out to have fun,you keep what you find,one day at a time,yea,never anything more than that,ever again!!!

Kuger

It this stupid moratorium is ever lifted, I will partner up with you for a weekend, you keep your gold, I'll tender, and you teach me something about dredging. My only requirement is that I leave a little smarter than when I got here, not and easy task...

 

[TerryC]

TerryC
How does that county/BLM issue work? If a claim was not filed with BLM, but was at local level, could someone else claim it? Is that possible, or does the local claim prevent that? Is that a form of claim jumping?

No form of claim jumping. Simply a "share the weath" thing. The feds are the ones that get the lion's share. The county is just at the public trough to get what they can. TimC and I filed for two claims recently (a post). We are registered as the owners of those two claims "at the county" but the feds say the old owners still have the claims. Guess who wins? County or feds? Yep, we are not the owners even though the county records show it. Oh, well. The ultimate owner is those the Feds say is the owner. The claim belongs to who is registered at the BLM. Those that "buy" a claim from the "claim mongers" need to file the county AND BLM forms to make it theirs. TTC

 

[TerryC]

TerryC Thankyou for your understanding as I only speak of my own experiances and am quite amazed that individuals like you exsist.(I Admitt I doubt I would be so generous!) and wish I have known of you when I was working that crappy claim my brother bought in 2009 around meyer AZ how I suspect my values and experiance as a prospector would have most definitly benifited. And I often have the trouble putting thought into words properly. I once met a man in 2009 who was known around the Bear river as the" GOLD NAZI" who talked about this awesome claim he had and so forth and convinced my brother and another individual to go up to the north fork salmon river and work his claim Granted beining dazzled by the allure of gold and claim I never questioned him nor did any one else. Long story short we get up there very early in the season to work have him leave a week later and a storm hit the next day and we ended up snowed in at mule bridge campgrounds let me just say that the their was no claim and thanks to a understanding forest service no real harm was done other then a month and half of cold crappy weather and the costant reminder on how stupid I can choose to be!! OH YEA "GOLD NAZI" I'm looking for you bud

Tnx for your concern and help. TTC

 

[TerryC]

Well said TerryC. Nothing ever is wrong offering to help others. Someday the rewards will reverse and you will be on the other side and be that grateful person. Most level headed people can read between the lines.

I've already been paid all I expect.... a smile on a friend's face! Tnx. TTC

 

[TimC]

I might add to the post my brother posted... A $10 fee will get your claim filed with county as proof you staked out and filed for the claim. You then have 90 days to forward the claim papers to the BLM with $189 for filing. The claim cannot be "stolen" between the Co. filing and the BLM filing. TKC

 

[TimC]

There also was mentioned the price the buyers are paying for gold. Many newbies are dissapointed with the offer for their hard earned gold. The good buyers work in the impurity of most gold found to come up with a price. Recently, I dug up some gold that was less than a mm across... and under a stereo microscope I could see that some of the gold had up to 25% silver attached. TKC

 

[spillercanyon]

Back in the early 80's, I had to drive to town once a week to get supplies for dredging. Every week we would drive by a dredge, 6" I believe, that they would rent out for 5 days a week to groups that would pay good money to dredge. The funny thing was, the groups rarely dug all the way to bedrock and clean out the cracks (most likely because the owners were telling them where to dig). The normal day we would drive by would be one of two days a week the paying groups were not there. The owners of the claim and dredge for rent would be working real hard, cleaning the bedrock and cracks that the 'renters' had cleared the overburden of. What a racket, paid by a group of people to clear their overburden for them.

 

[TerryC]

Back in the early 80's, I had to drive to town once a week to get supplies for dredging. Every week we would drive by a dredge, 6" I believe, that they would rent out for 5 days a week to groups that would pay good money to dredge. The funny thing was, the groups rarely dug all the way to bedrock and clean out the cracks (most likely because the owners were telling them where to dig). The normal day we would drive by would be one of two days a week the paying groups were not there. The owners of the claim and dredge for rent would be working real hard, cleaning the bedrock and cracks that the 'renters' had cleared the overburden of. What a racket, paid by a group of people to clear their overburden for them.

The rates are what the market will bear. If the rentors are repeats, they surley are getting what they want. If they are first-timers, they won't be back. TTC

 

[Doug Watson]

Terry and Tim, you guys are what this is all about. I hooked up with Gillaro (Max) a few years ago in Idaho where he was running a pay to play operation. The price was cheap and the experience was priceless. We were on a patented claim that was never worked for placer and the country was beautiful. The best part of the whole thing was meeting Max. He gave me a tour of the claim and even pointed out where the better spots were likely to be. I had to leave early because of health issues of a family member but I'll always treasure the trip, and the amount of gold that was just past the point where I left off will always be burned into my mind, but that's another story. Anyway the sharing and new friends are the fun parts of prospecting and mining.

 

[spillercanyon]

The rates are what the market will bear. If the rentors are repeats, they surley are getting what they want. If they are first-timers, they won't be back. TTC

Terry,
You are quite the stellar person your portrait portrays, thanks for the service to this country and all that you do for the mining community. I know it is hard to believe with your personality but there are a lot of snakes out there and these were snakes. They were taking advantage of the price of gold (which with inflation included, was a much higher price than it is today) and people's fever for it. I'm sure the people had a fun camping and mining experience but I don't believe anyone who was paying to mine there knew they should be cleaning bedrock and cracks. The rates that the market would bear at the time were inflated due to the price of gold, the ignorance of those paying it and gold fever. None of these were repeats, they were all city folks thinking they would hit it big in a week.

 

[mellowyellow]

Having spent a number of years prospecting I have encountered a number of differnt ways men try to captilize on the ingnorance of men exspeacialy when dealing with rules and regulations and claim staking. Having never beining sastisfied with the words of men I have taken upon myself to find multiple sources for information. And here are a few things I have learned to watch out for Be wary of a man willing to let you work his claim as why would anyone give away money he has rights too all too often they just want you for a day or two to help move overburden or old tailing and when they get to the desired spot your help is no longer needed. Also In my research of claims all too often are claims filed with the county recorders office and not with blm. and once someone wants to buy it the company file with blm and then sell it you.. so much property that is not recorded properly and are beining sold to people who don't know any better. And it's been my experiance that the people with all the good ideas rarely have the will to put them into action.. As I'm sure everyone has met the person with no children telling you how to raise children! the same is even more true with gold hell most prospectors I meet know of some great vein or way to get gold but for some reason they choose not to.. Also I have had men try to tell me they had claims that were Grandfathered in.. And I must admitt that the individual who told me that was very convincing and even had sighns little did he know that he picked the one man who was goinin to go home and find every document for that area known to man..And of course he was a liar and I pursued the matter and confronted him with facts.. I now work that area to this day for some reason he don't come around no more.I got story after story as Im sure lots of you do and I am very interested in hearing about the TRICKERY's OF THE TRADE from some of you. My grandpa always told me to pay extra care with all two legged creatures!! Oh yea always double check when selling gold that they are giving you the percent they say they are and are on current gold prices as I have encountered more then a few jewelers/prospecting stores/gold buyers that use week old prices or just outright lie about current prices.

Good post and true. There are some nice people still out there though, just not that many of them. If I had a claim I would offer it so I had a friend to be ther with me while I prospect. I have spent mostly prospecting alone and it's more fun with a buddy there. And safer!

Pat Keene let me work his claim on the north yuba last year for 6 days straight. He felt bad when i told him my horror story from eBay and how i got screwed. My whole trip that I had been planning for months got screwed due to a claim seller on eBay. So pat let me work his claim for nothing. All he wanted was one of my fire department T-shirts, haha.

I walked away with over 4 grams of gold and I even went to his shop and showed him and he was more excited than me! Lol.

Yes there are a few generous people out there.