WATCH AND CLOCK MAKERS PRINTING PLATE..SOLVED BY DCMATT AND CURIOUS THE GEORGE!!

[civilman1]

When I get home I have an hour of daylight left Since it's deer hunting season,I split my time.I live on 154 ac. so I had a 1/2 hr. for the MXT and a 1/2 hr. for the Remington Anyway,let me start with I knew excactly what this puppy was when I popped the plug (9").....A mangled pice of brass Seriously,I put it on the recycle bin and left for the bank barn for the last 1/2 hr.Got back and soap and watered it with a soft toothbrush and started revealing bit by bit an engraving that I can't even get a decent image from.....Yet!!!!(stay tuned).It's all hatch marked on the front and as you can see in some of the cleaned picture's some of the detail........Enough said,In the Eye of the Beholder!!!By the way it was found 15ft. from my Block A button!!!

SEE BELOW OR READ FOR THE RIDE TO SEE FAR FROM IT!!!!

 

[MiniMe]

Re: ENGRAVED CLIPPED CORNER BELT PLATE!!....UPDATED CLOSE UP PIC'S!!!

I did George and thank you.

 

[DCMatt]

Re: ENGRAVED CLIPPED CORNER BELT PLATE!!....UPDATED CLOSE UP PIC'S!!!

I've been looking at this piece since it was posted. I began my research on the assumption that it is indeed a belt plate. The fact that it is engraved on both sides was very intriguing and I hoped I could discover the owner's name.

Like everyone on this thread, I was baffled by the backwards engraving on the "back" of the piece so I photo shopped a mirror image and enlarged it to try to determine the writing. On Friday morning I showed a print out of the lettering to a guy at my office. His first words were, "That looks like it says Nusz. That's a Polish name." (This guy is actually Polish.)

So using the name Nusz and location of the find I did an internet search. Immediately I found the name Frederick Nusz from Frederick Maryland. He was German, not Polish. He was a clock and watch maker in the very early 19th century. He was also a silversmith which means he would probably have engraving skills.

More research found a clock made by Nusz with the inscription:

Fredk Nusz Fredk Town (note the capital 'T' used for Town just like on the relic)

After trading a couple of emails with another poster on this thread and a little more research, I think we can say with a high degree of certainty that this item is a printing plate for a "watch paper". A watch paper is a paper placed in or with a pocket watch after it has been repaired.

Here is an example:



I'm not 100% sure of the exact lettering on Civilman's item but I think it says:

Frdk Nusz
Clock & Watch Maker
Frdk Town

Here is another watch paper example from E. Nusz (possibly Frederick's brother Ezra).



If this is a watch paper print plate as we suspect, it is a valuable piece of Frederick County Maryland history and worthy of a place in a local museum. In my opinion, that is WAY cooler than a belt plate.

DCMatt

Special thanks to Curious the George for his invaluable research and input on this item. It was truly a joint effort.

 

[Curious The George]

Re: ENGRAVED CLIPPED CORNER BELT PLATE!!....UPDATED CLOSE UP PIC'S!!!

To add to DCMatt's work on this little project.

In addition to the E. Nusz watch paper in DCMatt's post I found other information and photos below.

I have included a photo of a Seth Thomas clock paper label that is from the same time period so one can see what a clock label would look like.

Frederick was a sliversmith as well as a clock and watch maker. A picture of his silversmith hall mark is in the photos below.

He was a clock maker. A photo of a ca. 1790 tall case clock he made is below. Above the center of the face is his name, Frederick Nuze. Below the center is the words, "Fred.k Town. Just as on the printing plate with his first name abbreviated as "Fred." I have contacted the owner of the clock and asked if there is a paper label in it, if I get a response, I'll add it here later. This is the clock that DCMatt found that solved the mystery of the printing plate.

It looks like the printing plate has the following on it:

Fred. Nuze​

Watch Clock Maker​

(or Clock Watch Maker)​

Fred.k Town​

Cleaning and straightening likely would uncover what the middle line says.

Civliman never posted the dimensions of the plate or the engraving on this thread. I made a rough measurement of the circle border that the engraving is inside of and came up with ca. 1 5/8"(+or-)which is roughly what a watch paper measures.

Watch papers were put inside the back case cover of pocket watches by a watchmaker and every time the watch went to another maker for repair they added their paper in the back cover. It is not unusual, if a pocket watch hasn't been tampered with, for there to be a half dozen or more watch papers found inside from it's repairs over the years. Kind of a history of the life of the watch.

In Frederick, MD, Frederick Town, there is a home still standing called "The Nusz House". A photo of it is below. It is on a register of architecturally significant houses in Frederick County, MD. There is an unusual single story very large room that projects off the back of the house. Not ordinary for the type of house. It is my opinion that the room on the back was Frederick's watch/clock, silversmith shop.

As far as the other side of the printing plate goes it very well could be for printing another watch paper, or clock label. And until it is straitened out and restored so the image can be more clearly seen we won't know. I do suspect it is for printing another watch label. It was mentioned several times about the crude engraving work on it not being done by an professional engraver. Please look back up to the E. Nusz watch paper in the previous post and contemplate the "crude" work.

It is also of note that Frederick was a silversmith. Silversmiths were engravers. Perhaps the most well known American silversmith would be Paul Revere. Revere engraved copper printing plates for the printers in Boston. Revere always used both sides of printing plates. He thought it a crime that one side would be left blank and not used for productive work. It wouldn't be at all a suprise to find that the printing plate not only was for Frederick's watch work but that he engraved it himself.

All and all this is a very historic find, an important piece of Frederick County, MD's history. No, it's not a belt plate it is far more significant.

The printing plate is quite a significant find for the Frederick County, MD area. I do hope that Civilman will get it restored and offer it to the Frederick County Historical Museum.

 

[sscindercoop]

Re: ENGRAVED CLIPPED CORNER BELT PLATE!!....UPDATED CLOSE UP PIC'S!!!

Awesome find

 

[MiniMe]

Re: ENGRAVED CLIPPED CORNER BELT PLATE!!....UPDATED CLOSE UP PIC'S!!!

What a way to start the year. Congratulations Civilman1 on a very sweet find.

 

[DCMatt]

Re: ENGRAVED CLIPPED CORNER BELT PLATE!!....UPDATED CLOSE UP PIC'S!!!





Fred Nusz
Clock & Watch Maker
Fred Town

That's my best guress until I get better pics.

DCMatt

 

[Curious The George]

Re: ENGRAVED CLIPPED CORNER BELT PLATE!!....UPDATED CLOSE UP PIC'S!!!

Well done DCMatt!

 

[Bramblefind]

Re: ENGRAVED CLIPPED CORNER BELT PLATE!!....UPDATED CLOSE UP PIC'S!!!

Incredible research!! Hats off to you both!

And what an amazing find this is!

 

[civilman1]

I first want to start this response saying Thank You to Curious The George and also to DCMatt for there work in solving this mystery.Being the CW relic hunter that I am I really wanted this to be a Clipped Corner Belt Plate So I have to especially apologize to Curious for putting up with me,I had my sidekick so it was kind double trouble.I hope you except my apology George!! Great work to you both and it spell's out just like Matt has it on his last post.One thing I can't figure out is the front with the initial's M B ? Either way,I'm just as happy if it was a Belt Plate.Now I have to talk to the Frederick Historical Society and let them know exactly what I have,I'm sure they will LOVE to know.Can't Thank you two enough for taking the time to even do something like this!!! I will keep everyone posted on this piece of Frederick History.Unbelievable!!!

 

[Curious The George]

I first want to start this response saying Thank You to Curious The George and also to DCMatt for there work in solving this mystery.Being the CW relic hunter that I am I really wanted this to be a Clipped Corner Belt Plate So I have to especially apologize to Curious for putting up with me,I had my sidekick so it was kind double trouble.I hope you except my apology George!! Great work to you both and it spell's out just like Matt has it on his last post.One thing I can't figure out is the front with the initial's M B ? Either way,I'm just as happy if it was a Belt Plate.Now I have to talk to the Frederick Historical Society and let them know exactly what I have,I'm sure they will LOVE to know.Can't Thank you two enough for taking the time to even do something like this!!! I will keep everyone posted on this piece of Frederick History.Unbelievable!!!

Thank you Civilman, no problem. I knew what I was looking at. We owe a big thanks to DCMatt and his Polish friend for putting the hounds on the trail.

I do hope that TNet can still be seen by folks in Australia.

 

[Steve in PA]

This has to be the best relic detective work I have ever seen. This post should be on the Best of T-Net. Do we vote on that?

 

[Burdie]

Wow this is a super thread and as Steve said great detective work. Thank all of you involved in this research.

Burdie

 

[MiniMe]

Being just a "Sidekick" I vote for one of the best threads in a very very long time. Between the find itself, the collaboration with so many t-net members, and the history surrounding this plate is exactly what this forum should be. Awesome find and glad to be able to physically see it and hold it. Thanks for putting up with me being the devils advocate on this one DC Matt & Curious. Excellent research...You guys.... Rock Hope it can be straightened and the other side can be discovered as well. Congratulations C'man, you've got more than you thought in many ways. Besides other things you've started the year with a bang! No doubt you'll find that clipped belt plate some day, but if I were you, I would be doing back flips right now.

 

[Curious The George]

Civilman, I have sent you a private message.

 

[RockyDig]

Great relic, Joe! This was an entertaining thread as well. Keep digging!!

 

[SeatedorBust]

Great thread.... great find... and awesome detective work!

 

[ModernMiner]

AWESOME REASEARCH GUYS!!!!!!

-MM-

 

[{Sentinel}]

Terrific Research, Terrific Post, Great detective work DC Matt and Curious the George....my Hat's off to you both Joe I know you love the Civil War and Colonial Relics like

the rest of us Relic-Hunters buddy but I gotta say, this really is a cool alternative, especially being as old as it is. I would put it in it's own display and add the information on a nice card

and display that sucker up on the wall in your relic room buddy! Congrats my friend

 

[civilman1]

Terrific Research, Terrific Post, Great detective work DC Matt and Curious the George....my Hat's off to you both Joe I know you love the Civil War and Colonial Relics like

the rest of us Relic-Hunters buddy but I gotta say, this really is a cool alternative, especially being as old as it is. I would put it in it's own display and add the information on a nice card

and display that sucker up on the wall in your relic room buddy! Congrats my friend

Thank's Josh,and and my hat's are off to Curious and Matt as well I'm really not sure how to approach this one now,part of me want's to donate it and the other say's,I've got my own Museum.....I will let them know what I have and take it by,I'm only 15 min.'s away from the Museum.I think they even have a Frederick Nusz clock there.Still picking at it Buddy

 

[MiniMe]

I think taking it to the museum to show them is a great idea. They may even know a little more about it, but I agree with Josh - display that baby in your own museum. I'd personally like to see it straightened so we can figure out the other side as well. Get a print off both sides and put them in the frame with the plate. That would be an awesome display. Just my opinion.