Four Peaks Seen As One

[EDN]

All,

The interesting thing is the directions do not say that Four Peaks lines up with Weavers Needle. It just says when you get to this high point and look south you can see a high needle. I do think the high needle is Weavers Needle however, this does not mean both mountains are lined up.

EDN

 

[skyhawk1251]

The interesting thing is the directions do not say that Four Peaks lines up with Weavers Needle. It just says when you get to this high point and look south you can see a high needle. I do think the high needle is Weavers Needle however, this does not mean both mountains are lined up.

True, EDN, if you're saying that when Four Peaks are seen as one Weavers Needle has a compass heading exactly 180 degrees opposite. However, I think there is a ridge above Peters Canyon where Four Peaks are seen as one, and Weavers Needle is seen to the south, very nearly 180 degrees opposite. Someone will need to go to the high point of the ridge to verify this. It is not an easy hike.

 

[SPARTANOC]

There is no place where the 4 peaks line up as one and also line up with Weavers needle

Sure there is, you just have to go and search for it. There's 2 places, but only one of those spots is the correct spot.
-SpartanOC

 

[Al D]

Have you ever been in the mountains or even looked at a map ?

 

[SPARTANOC]

Have you ever been in the mountains or even looked at a map ?

AI D,

Yes, I've been in there a few times. And yes, even looked at a map. Funny how that works.

Have you?

-SpartanOC

 

[Al D]

It is shameful for people (not you of course) to give out false information where other may believe it and even look for it ending up another mountain casualty or needing emergency rescue.
Anyone can look at a topo map and see for themselves that the trending alignment of 4 peaks is a northeast to southwest line and, pay attention to this part…. Weavers needle line up with 4 peaks at 357 degrees true north which is basically North and a little West.
Maybe you are thinking of some other mountains named 4 peaks, in California perhaps ?

 

[SPARTANOC]

It is shameful for people (not you of course) to give out false information where other may believe it and even look for it ending up another mountain casualty or needing emergency rescue.
Anyone can look at a topo map and see for themselves that the trending alignment of 4 peaks is a northeast to southwest line and, pay attention to this part…. Weavers needle line up with 4 peaks at 357 degrees true north which is basically North and a little West.
Maybe you are thinking of some other mountains named 4 peaks, in California perhaps ?

AI D

Nope - we're talking about the Supes. From a particular position, you can see Weaver's Needle AND the 4 peaks as one and they're both viewable at the same time. Don't get messed up by degrees. It's not an exact direction via a compass. Do you honestly think Waltz even used a compass?

No one here is leading anyone to a dangerous area - unless one doesn't listen to those who have knowledge of the Supes. The Supes are probably the most dangerous mountains to be trekking through and anyone with personal knowledge and a heart of gold, would never allow someone to aimlessly go to an undisclosed area. That would be irresponsible. Most if not all of whom I know here on TN wouldn't send someone on a goose chase.

Be safe out there!
-SpartanOC

 

[Al D]

If you want to see Weavers needle line up with 4 peaks just visit Adamsville. On a clear day, it is spectacular. Weavers Needle is framed by the silhouette of 4 peaks 8 degrees west from true North.
The confusing, probably on my part, is the phrase “4 peaks seen as one” to me this means that all 4 of the peaks are lined up. Apparently, that is not how others read it.

 

[sgtfda]

If it was false information it was unbeknownst

If he gave false information I’m sure it was unbeknownst to him. Just like that kid that chopped down the cherry tree.

Don't be so sure

 

[coazon de oro]

Don't be so sure

Howdy Sarge,
We are all human, some more trusting than others, and when it comes to new information on our shared interest, we tend to be more credulous. Most of us have shared false information that we picked up from others. Helen was a victim, but so was her source. You too have shared false information several times, because you don't know who is telling you the truth, it just makes you as human as the rest of us.

 

[Idahodutch]

If you want to see Weavers needle line up with 4 peaks just visit Adamsville. On a clear day, it is spectacular. Weavers Needle is framed by the silhouette of 4 peaks 8 degrees west from true North.
The confusing, probably on my part, is the phrase “4 peaks seen as one” to me this means that all 4 of the peaks are lined up. Apparently, that is not how others read it.

Hello AI D,
Up above a shallow cave, that faces north, up on the high point of a ridge directly above the cave, there is visible on the horizon to the north, part of the Four Peaks mountain. What is visible looks to be just one peak. That is what I could see from that spot.

I don’t know a better way to describe what the view is. 🤷🏼‍♂️

Maybe one day, someone will take a photograph of the view. Unfortunately I am not able to go in anymore, so it looks like it won’t be me to take the photo.

It is not the only clue to come to life in that region. They (the clues) pretty much all come to life there 😉.

Viewable in the opposite direction of Four Peaks, according to the German clues, is a peak with a hole through it.

My son was up at a spot very near the high point and did get a photo of what is viewed in the opposite direction.


Over the top of the bluffs of blacktop Mesa, you can see the upper part of Palomino mountain, and in particular, Aylor’s Arch.

From up on the ridge, it looks like a big beautiful “hole” right through the peak. (And in the opposite direction too).

A saddle is there, and there is a big rock man that can be seen from the next canyon over, and where you go east of the trail (left of the trail when traveling south).

The small shallow cave that opened to the north, and needed a small tarp to keep out the weather from the north.

And of course there is the clue about how waltz spent an entire winter covering his mine and all signs of their digging.

He said his mine is not more than 200’ directly across canyon, from his hidden camp.

Here is what is 200’ directly across the canyon from the shallow cave we found.



Just right of center on that giant rock pile, is where 200’ from the shallow cave lands.

How badly do you want to know AI D? 🤔

The giant pile of rocks, is much easier to hike to, than the view spot up above. 😁🤓

 

[Idahodutch]

All,

The interesting thing is the directions do not say that Four Peaks lines up with Weavers Needle. It just says when you get to this high point and look south you can see a high needle. I do think the high needle is Weavers Needle however, this does not mean both mountains are lined up.

EDN

Guys,
There is another clue about what can be seen and from where. This one has to do with the seeing of weavers needle, but the view is a short climb from “his mine”. It only said to go a short climb.

What constitutes a short climb?
In my youth, I kind of figured a short climb to be less than 1/4 mile. Just what I had in my head is all.

I believe “his mine” is under the giant rock pile.
And there is a view of weavers needle by hiking/climbing less than 1/4 mile to the west at the 3 small peaks over there.

I don’t have a photo of it, but anyone can put a pin drop on the small peaks and see the view … in Google Earth.

Here are a couple screenshots from GE.

It is much less than 1/4 mile up over to weaver’s needle viewing area.

The clue associated with 4-Peaks doesn’t say weaver’s needle.

But this clue did, and it comes to life in that area.

PS- I have no clue as to WHERE to find the clue, as it was told to me when I was a kid …. Like not passing the 3 little red hills, or gone too far. 🤷🏼‍♂️👍

Sincerely,
Idahodutch

 

[markmar]

Howdy Sarge,
We are all human, some more trusting than others, and when it comes to new information on our shared interest, we tend to be more credulous. Most of us have shared false information that we picked up from others. Helen was a victim, but so was her source. You too have shared false information several times, because you don't know who is telling you the truth, it just makes you as human as the rest of us.

It's very true what you said. Remember when Not Peralta put that photo which showed a building which he believed was Jesuit mission above Burns Ranch, on his thread? That image was not invented by him, it was also in Bob Wards book, but he believed was accurate because BoB told it to him when they have came along as partners. All the experts on this topic, using Google's matching images app, found the picture was from an old school from NM., and started calling NP a con and a liar. Nobody called the same Bob when he published his book , because then was not Internet and no one could find he was wrong.
But here emerges the question: what people would have done if Internet existed in Bob Ward era? They would accused Bob for printing a false photo of the Jesuit mission at Burns Ranch, and then Bob would say he got the info from Garmαn, the same guy who stated how Tumlinson found α gold cache at Byous Butte. What irony, isn't it?

 

[markmar]

Hello Idahodutch, I hope you are doing well. You wrote in the post #57: " Viewable in the opposite direction of Four Peaks, according to the German clues, is a peak with a hole through it."
IMHO, this clue which is part of the German clues, is wrong translated. I will tell you the real meaning of this clue, and it's on you if you will take it in consideration or not.

In a free translation, the text would says: " From above my cache, in the sadle, you will see a long ways to the south, through a hole in the mountain ".
Now, that hole, always IMHO, it's not an eye or an opening through a mountain, but an opening between the mountains, an area between high landmarks wich allows you to see a long distance to the south, maybe because to the north you can't see anythig at long distance or nothing at all.

 

[Idahodutch]

Hello Idahodutch, I hope you are doing well. You wrote in the post #57: " Viewable in the opposite direction of Four Peaks, according to the German clues, is a peak with a hole through it."
IMHO, this clue which is part of the German clues, is wrong translated. I will tell you the real meaning of this clue, and it's on you if you will take it in consideration or not.

In a free translation, the text would says: " From above my cache, in the sadle, you will see a long ways to the south, through a hole in the mountain ".
Now, that hole, always IMHO, it's not an eye or an opening through a mountain, but an opening between the mountains, an area between high landmarks wich allows you to see a long distance to the south, maybe because to the north you can't see anythig at long distance or nothing at all.

Hello markmar,
You were gone for a while. What happened?
Can you talk about it?

On the post of yours above, the translation you provide, doesn’t address seeing 4-peaks. The thread is about the clues seeing 4-peaks.

Holmes manuscript also gives a 4-peaks clue.

I’ve been giving reports of what has been found and even provided a photo of the opposite direction from the view spot…. and the photo does not support your version, but it does support the German clues as they came to us.

The view spot of 4-peaks that you have not wanted to acknowledge, is up there. And it is not on the saddle according to Holmes manuscript. I too can attest to the inability of anyone seeing 4-peaks from the saddle.

You have stated elsewhere and on more than one occasion, that the LDM clues need to be rewritten….. (in your opinion)
You are entitled to your opinions.

So my friend, in my opinion, you lose credibility, every time you try to change LDM lore.

Sincerely,
Idahodutch

 

[markmar]

Hello markmar,
You were gone for a while. What happened?
Can you talk about it?

On the post of yours above, the translation you provide, doesn’t address seeing 4-peaks. The thread is about the clues seeing 4-peaks.

Holmes manuscript also gives a 4-peaks clue.

I’ve been giving reports of what has been found and even provided a photo of the opposite direction from the view spot…. and the photo does not support your version, but it does support the German clues as they came to us.

The view spot of 4-peaks that you have not wanted to acknowledge, is up there. And it is not on the saddle according to Holmes manuscript. I too can attest to the inability of anyone seeing 4-peaks from the saddle.

You have stated elsewhere and on more than one occasion, that the LDM clues need to be rewritten….. (in your opinion)
You are entitled to your opinions.

So my friend, in my opinion, you lose credibility, every time you try to change LDM lore.

Sincerely,
Idahodutch

Yes, I was banned for about an year as a consequence of a debate in a KGC thread. Nothing very disperectifully from my part, just telling the truth as always. When the truth is treatening someone's interest, then you are not so respectfully as expected. When logic is fighting fiction, always wins the side which is supported by the majority. I don't believe most of them are not cabable to see the logic/truth, but they lose intentionally their ability to recognize the difference when they belong to the same religion "club" or to the same fun club.

Now, let's come back on the track. As you can see in my previous post, I quoted your post where you used to mix the Holmes clue concerning the Four Peaks, with the German clue concerning the " hole in the mountain ". So, was not me who used these two different sources to prove how my spot of interest is in the right place. Also, in the German clue, the saddle could be something completely different landmark than the saddle described in the Holmes route/clues.
Also, in the Holmes description, he stated how in the opposite direction from the Four Peaks is a high peak. Looking at Palomino peak from the spot you say you can see one peak from the Four Peaks, I believe it's at the same level if not smaller with that spot of observation. So, because Palomino Mountain doesn't resembles the standards from Holmes clues, you chose to select the German clue in regards to correct the image of your location. IMO, you can mix the sources only if you are sure the location which you are talking about is the right one.
You could be right, but I gave only another perspective on what " the hole in the mountain " from the German clue could be, with no intention offending someone or to impose my opinions.

 

[markmar]

Idahodutch, forgot to mention in the previous post, I stated in the past how the order of the clues from the Holmes route shoud be rewritten in the right order, and not the LDM clues.
If I would change a LDM clue, would be that which says how " about 40 feet above my mine you can see WN to the south " . From what I know, someone is starting to see WN at the Waltz mine , while is climbing up to the mine from the bottom of the gulch for about 40 feet and not climbing up from the mine, and this because from the Waltz's mine WN is/was always in sight.

 

[393stroker]

Idahodutch, forgot to mention in the previous post, I stated in the past how the order of the clues from the Holmes route shoud be rewritten in the right order, and not the LDM clues.
If I would change a LDM clue, would be that which says how " about 40 feet above my mine you can see WN to the south " . From what I know, someone is starting to see WN at the Waltz mine , while is climbing up to the mine from the bottom of the gulch for about 40 feet and not climbing up from the mine, and this because from the Waltz's mine WN is/was always in sight.

You guys are thinking Weavers Needle when it just says a pointed peak to the south. If I’m not mistaken. So that’s how the clues get all distorted. That’s why everyone thinks the mine is to the north of WN but couldn’t find the mine.

 

[Ponteach]

you can look north and the four peaks are lined up to look like one peak. In the other direction ( you will see a high needle. )
far from to be Weavers Needle...

 

[Idahodutch]

you can look north and the four peaks are lined up to look like one peak. In the other direction ( you will see a high needle. )
far from to be Weavers Needle...

Thank you Ponteach, and besides the discrepancy of “high needle” -vs- “Weaver’s Needle”, there is also the discrepancy of “other direction” -vs- “ opposite direction”.

Other just means “different”. It could be anything as long as it is different than where 4- peaks is.
However; the word opposite is not so open, and means opposing direction …. Like 180 degrees.

Both clues are about the 4-peaks view spot to see them look like one peak, and the concern is, what is visible elsewhere, from the same view spot, and ultimately, where his hidden camp (shallow cave) is located.

In other direction is a high needle, while in the opposite direction is a peak with a hole through it.

Markmar seems to miss the distinctions, along with the fact that both clues are about the same view spot. 🤷🏼‍♂️

Can lead a horse to water….

The entire point is that the wording of the clues is not the problem, it is how our minds interpret the words.

My understanding is that the giant rock pile, has begun to be removed, well past my efforts. …. Rock by rock, the pile is getting smaller.

Chucking rocks off of a pile eventually will reveal the natural terrain below the rock pile.

I really think it is the LDM that Waltz and his partner started, under the giant rock pile. The mine they started shortly after inspecting the Peralta Shaft mine up above.

I think his partner is still buried inside of Waltz’ mine, under the giant rock pile.