The Treasure of Captain William Kidd.

[Oak Island Sage]

Digging through documents and archives is part of the process, but the range of skill sets needed to be successful are vast. Others are out there working at this moment, and yes they have used information provided here on t-net....sure bart...how do you know this....because I talk with them, and info from one thread or another has been used by them and is currently being explored !! The real hard parts are money, logistics, permits, permission, and the real physical challenges presented in the search...how healthy are you, can you treck through the actual terrain, how are your underwater skills, have a pilots license, can you dive, what about captain skills, and navigation. Maritime lawyers, government liaisons, technical experts, magnotometer experience, artifact preservation and on and on !! This thing with the Armchair detective is important, but when there rubber hits the road, and the hunt begins, thats when real obstacles start to appear in good ideas !! This is a very important but small part of succeeding at any of the propositions put forth here !!

Hi Blak Bart you are correct in some ways, and I cannot hope to match the hard work done by researchers. The burning question on this website dedicated to finding treasure is this, do any of them have any chance of locating the elusive treasure, the answer to that is a resounding no, well I have.

Please allow me to blow my own trumpet now Blak Bart. Unlike some armchair critics I have actually been to Oak Island by personal invitation and I've met the owners. I was shown across Oak Island and I have seen the area under which I believe the treasure is stored. I am the only person of the planet who ever got the late Dan Blankenship to agree to work with the late Fred Nolan and I have the "Letter of intent" to prove it, had the late President of the old Triton Alliance Company David Tobias also agreed the treasure would been recovered twenty years ago. After several years had past I gave up all hope of trying to broker a peaceful share deal between the three original feuding O I treasures hunters of the sixties. I then posted some of my theories on a excellent website called "Oak Island Treasure" and my topic entitled "Oak Island revelations" had received more three hundred thousand viewing hits when it was last viewed by my friend, unfortunately it was just before the website was sold.
Coming up to date I have had business discussions with the present searchers and I have offered them my help for nothing, no charge and no percentage of and recovered treasure. These treasure hunters have voted and they opted to first try their other pre-planned projects that are centred around the Money Pit area. For now in 2026 my input and offer must apparently be considered by the members of the Cerca Trova company to be superfluous to requirements.

When they finally realise that (as I told them) no treasure was ever put in the empty Money Pit which was a Sand Sump (see CAD) I might get a call, and if I'm still alive I will help them, if not then it's game over - period.
Now if anyone can name any researcher or writer who has actually come closer than me in actively trying to recover the treasure of Oak Island I hope someone will please name that person. then I can close the book on this subject and pursue my other interest.

Oak Island Sage

 

[Oak Island Sage]

Ya might be onto something Bart. We all know a giant space elephant farted and blew a hole in Oak Island and filled it up with treasure from Avery and Kidd that was stored on the dark side of the moon.


View attachment 2249675



All jokes aside, after 45 pages, one would be excused for needing a lift home in the rubber taxi.

There is no doubt that many people are passionate about the topic of Kidd. There have been many theories by book Authors written and published here about the topic. Some theories are anchored in truth and or half-truths. Others are pure flights of fantasy.

They all claim they are correct, even now, Oak Island Sage. That is why it is a treasure legend. So much has been written as fact over the years, which has been one author copying off another author, and assumed as fact. That has been done over the 20th century. Today, we have much greater access to information than in the early 20th century; most information was untouchable.

Each Captain Kidd author believes they have solved the mystery. But no one has bothered to ask whether there was any treasure to begin with or to hunt down original documents. There is too much speculation based on other people's speculation.

For better or worse, I prefer to dig for the truth behind the hype and legends. This topic is for me only an exercise in research skills. If I am presented with verifiable facts, I am prepared to change my opinion. Personally, at present, I do not believe in any conspiracy between Avery and Kidd. (Sage believes so, but refuses to prove his claim ) Nor a great treasure taken by either captain. Avery's personal share was substantial but not a great hoard, and Kidd's, well, his personal share was recovered from Gardiner's Island, but Kidd, in an ironic twist, gained immortality in connection to the treasure when Avery did not. But that does not mean there are not small personal caches of surviving pirates lingering about. I definitely think your island has merits in finding some of Avery's crew's private caches, or at least artifacts from that time period.

I understand cryptid1990's frustration, and his lashing out from that frustration earned him a time-out. I understand treasurehunters unenviable role of moderating in asylum.

Ironically, cryptid1990 found a lot of good stuff that, beyond doubt, reveals the Kidd Palmer charts for what they are. Yet still, a true believer will post believing in the Kidd Palmer charts. Yet in the midst of the chaos of 45 posts, there is some really good information on the topic. Indeed, cryptid1990 posted links to where John Ware mentions in several references. I stand corrected on that point. It does give a clue to Edward Roe Snow, who obtained the name from on his map. I confess I have mixed opinions about Edward Rowe Snow. He was, as it now appears, knowledgeable but still a bit of a showman. He claimed information of John Ware came from the following. Information of Henry Bolton. February 4, 1701 From the manuscripts of the Duke of Portland at Welbeck Abbey, a copy having been kindly furnished by the Rev. Richard W. Goulding, librarian to the duke. The date Feb. 4, 1700, means Feb. 4, 1701, new style. Bolton's previous history and his relations with Kidd are sufficiently shown by this and preceding documents. In 1700 he had been shipped to England from Jamaica, and he was now, or at any rate on Dec. 22, 1700, in Newgate prison under charges of piracy. Cal. St. P. Col., 1700, p. 760.

View attachment 2249735

Source Information of Henry Bolton. February 4, 1701 this letter must have been in the Duke of Portland's archives.

View attachment 2249732
This was transcribed first in 1891 and later in 1923 above. where it mentions John Ware. You can see below.

View attachment 2249733

And the other source that mentions John Ware, his [Kidd's] master, was noted in Kidd's Instrument of Protest, 7 July 1699: mentions John Ware.

View attachment 2249738

So I acknowledge the two sources that do mention John Ware. When I looked at the original documents in British archives, there was no mention of John Ware by W Jenkins. You can see for yourself below.

View attachment 2249744


None of Captain Kidd's or known crew mentions John Ware other than the claims of Henry Bolton. February 4, 1701 this letter must have been in the Duke of Portland's archives. which transferred to the British Archive and Library. However, it is hard to find as I cannot find a catalogue with it listed..

Sources searched for John Ware. assioates and Kidd himself in all the following never mentioned him below.

Examination of Andrios Henlyne and other concerning Kidd's ship Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64ix)
Letter from Bellomont to Captain Kidd Date: 8 June 1698 Reference: HCA 1/98 f214
Letter to Captain Kidd from New York Date: 4 June 1698 Reference: HCA 1/98 f209
John Clarke's account of Captain Kidd Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123iv) 3 of 3
John Clarke's account of Captain Kidd Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123iv) 2 of 3
John Clarke's account of Captain Kidd Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123iv) 1 of 3
Narrative of Captain Kidd's voyage from London Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xxv) 7 of 7
Narrative of Captain Kidd's voyage from London Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xxv) 6 of 7
Narrative of Captain Kidd's voyage from London Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xxv) 5 of 7
Narrative of Captain Kidd's voyage from London Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xxv) 4 of 7
Narrative of Captain Kidd's voyage from London Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xxv) 3 of 7
Narrative of Captain Kidd's voyage from London Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xxv) 2 of 7
Narrative of Captain Kidd's voyage from London Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xxv) 1 of 7
Copy of Captain Kidd's examination Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xxiv) 2 of 2
Copy of Captain Kidd's examination Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xxiv) i of 2
Letter from Bellomont to Captain Kidd Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64v) 2 of 2
Letter from Bellomont to Captain Kidd Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64v) 1 of 2
Letter from Bellomont detailing the seizing and committing of Captain Kidd Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64) 5 of 5
Letter from Bellomont detailing the seizing and committing of Captain Kidd Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64) 4 of 5
Letter from Bellomont detailing the seizing and committing of Captain Kidd Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64) 3 of 5
Letter from Bellomont detailing the seizing and committing of Captain Kidd Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64) 2 of 5
Letter from Bellomont detailing the seizing and committing of Captain Kidd Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64) 1 of 5
Letter from Earl of Bellomont luring Kidd to New York Date: 8 June 1698 Reference: HCA 1/98 pt1 f128
Captain William Kidd's articles of the Adventure galley drawn up in New York, via Joseph Palmer Date: 1701 Reference: HCA 1/15/8
Captain William Kidd's articles of the Adventure galley drawn up in New York, via Joseph Palmer Date: 1701 Reference: HCA 1/15/8
Captain William Kidd's articles of the Adventure galley drawn up in New York, via Joseph Palmer Date: 1701 Reference: HCA 1/15/8 (reverse)
Captain William Kidd's privateering commission Date: 11 December 1695 Reference: HCA 1/15 (108)
Captain William Kidd and others indictment for piracy and murder Date: May 1701 Reference: HCA 1/15 (69v)
Captain William Kidd and others indictment for piracy and murder Date: May 1701 Reference: HCA 1/15 (69)
Captain William Kidd's memorandum of treasure left on Gardiner's Island Date: 4 September 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (65xx)
Account of merchandise seized from Captain Wiliam Kidd by Bellomont Date: July 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xix) 2 of 2
Account of merchandise seized from Captain Wiliam Kidd by Bellomont Date: July 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xix) 1 of 2
Captain Nicholas Everts' depoistion concerning Kidd Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64x)
Letter from Captain Wiliam Kidd in Newgate gaol Date: 30 December 1700 Reference: ADM 1/2004
Testimony of William Kidd Date: 1695 Reference: HCA 13/81 (313)
Kidd's letter for wood and water Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123v) 2 of 2
Kidd's letter for wood and water Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123v) 1 of 2
Examination of Kidd's crewmen Wm Jenkins Richard Barleycorn and Robert Lamley Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xi) 8 of 8
Examination of Kidd's crewmen Wm Jenkins Richard Barleycorn and Robert Lamley Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xi) 7 of 8
Examination of Kidd's crewmen Wm Jenkins Richard Barleycorn and Robert Lamley Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xi) 6 of 8
Examination of Kidd's crewmen Wm Jenkins Richard Barleycorn and Robert Lamley Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xi) 5 of 8
Examination of Kidd's crewmen Wm Jenkins Richard Barleycorn and Robert Lamley Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xi) 4 of 8
Examination of Kidd's crewmen Wm Jenkins Richard Barleycorn and Robert Lamley Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xi) 3 of 8
Examination of Kidd's crewmen Wm Jenkins Richard Barleycorn and Robert Lamley Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xi) 2 of 8
Examination of Kidd's crewmen Wm Jenkins Richard Barleycorn and Robert Lamley Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xi) 1 of 8
Copy of Kidd's letter to Bellomont Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64v) 2 of 2
Copy of Kidd's letter to Bellomont Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64v) 2 of 2
Examination of Andrios Henlyne and other concerning Kidd's ship Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64ix)
Copy of French pass dated 14 Jan 1698 taken by Kidd on board Moorish ship Cara Marchand Date: 14 Jan 1698 Reference: CO 5/860 (64iii)
Copy of French pass dated 14 Jan 1698 taken by Kidd on board Moorish ship Cara Marchand Date: 14 Jan 1698 Reference: CO 5/860 (64iii)
Deposition of Nicholas Alderson Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (124ii) 3 of 3
Deposition of Nicholas Alderson Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (124ii) 2 of 3
Deposition of Nicholas Alderson Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (124ii) 1 of 3
Deposition of Benjamin Franks Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (124i) 4 of 4
Deposition of Benjamin Franks Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (124i) 3 of 4
Deposition of Benjamin Franks Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (124i) 2 of 4
Deposition of Benjamin Franks Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (124i) 1 of 4
Narrative of William Willock Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123viii) 15 of 15
Narrative of William Willock Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123viii) 14of 15
Narrative of William Willock Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123viii) 13 of 15
Narrative of William Willock Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123viii) 12 of 15
Narrative of William Willock Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123viii) 11 of 15
Narrative of William Willock Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123viii) 10 of 15
Narrative of William Willock Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123viii) 9 of 15
Narrative of William Willock Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123viii) 8 of 15
Narrative of William Willock Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123viii) 7 of 15
Narrative of William Willock Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123viii) 6 of 15
Narrative of William Willock Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123viii) 5 of 15
Narrative of William Willock Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123viii) 4 of 15
Narrative of William Willock Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123viii) 3 of 15
Narrative of William Willock Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123viii) 2 of 15
Narrative of William Willock Date: 1697 Reference: CO 323/2 (123viii) 1 of 15
Deposition of Abel Owen Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xxiii) 3 of 3
Deposition of Abel Owen Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xxiii) 2 of 3
Deposition of Abel Owen Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xxiii) 1 of 3
Inventory of the sloop Antonio Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xx)
Examination of Hugh Parratt Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xviii) 3 of 3
Examination of Hugh Parratt Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xviii) 2 of 3
Examination of Hugh Parratt Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xviii) 1 of 3
Deposition of Duncan Campbell and his wife Susanna Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xvii) 3 of 3
Deposition of Duncan Campbell and his wife Susanna Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xvii) 2 of 3
Deposition of Duncan Campbell and his wife Susanna Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xvii) 1 of 3
Examination of Edward Davis Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xvi)
Deposition of Robert Livingston Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xv) 2 of 2
Deposition of Robert Livingston Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xv) 1 of 2
Examination of Thomas Way Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xiv)
Examination of Samuel Wood Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xiii) 3 of 3
Examination of Samuel Wood Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xiii) 2 of 3
Examination of Samuel Wood Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64xiii) 1 of 3
Copy of the examination by Bellomont of Gabriel Loff Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64viii) 3 of 3
Copy of the examination by Bellomont of Gabriel Loff Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64viii) 2 of 3
Copy of the examination by Bellomont of Gabriel Loff Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64viii) 1 of 3
Bellomont to Mr Gardiner Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64vii)
Memorial of Duncan Campbell Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64iv) 2 of 2
Memorial of Duncan Campbell Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64iv) 2 of 2
Abstract of the letter from Bellomont Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64i) 2 of 2
Abstract of the letter from Bellomont Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (64i) 1 of 2
Abstract of the letter from Bellomont to the Lords of the Council Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (62i) 1 of 2
Abstract of the letter from Bellomont to the Lords of the Council Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (62i) 2 of 2
Letter from Bellomont to the Lords of the Council Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (62) 6 of 6
Letter from Bellomont to the Lords of the Council Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (62) 5 of 6
Letter from Bellomont to the Lords of the Council Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (62) 4 of 6
Letter from Bellomont to the Lords of the Council Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (62) 3 of 6
Letter from Bellomont to the Lords of the Council Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (62) 2 of 6
Letter from Bellomont to the Lords of the Council Date: 1699 Reference: CO 5/860 (62) 1 of 6

There is at present no trace of this original Henry Bolton. February 4, 1701 this letter nor Kidd's Instrument of Protest, 7 July 1699: cannot yet be verified. other than transcribed copies in 1923. Which, no doubt, Edward Edward Rope Snow pulled the name from.

So I cannot say John Ware did not exist. Nor can I confirm he existed without confirming the original source documents that appear to be missing?

Nor can Sage claim without the original Henry Bolton. February 4, 1701 this letter, or Kidd's Instrument of Protest, 7 July 1699: to claim Ware was a real crew member of Kidd's Crew.

Sage, I agree with you to verify the signature on the chart as William Kidd's, which goes a long way in confirming your hypothesis.

However, thats your job? If I engaged an expert, you would simply dismiss them as a biased expert. I gave a link to experts in the UK and can supply a real signature and handwriting from Kidd via the British Archives original documents. To compare with the signature on the map.

If you want to be believed by anyone. Since you made bold claims, it is your responsibility to prove your claims.


One word of advice: comparing yourself to Albert Einstein confirms my comments about egocentrity and narcissism.

Crow

Egocentricity and narcissism you should really stop comparing other people to yourself. You know very well that my meaning was not a comparison but only to question your rational when you're making patronizing comments about me regarding my age, it smacks of age discrimination.
If I am a thorn in your side remember that you put it there with you derogatory comments.
Oak Island Sage

 

[Bocaj]

Hi Bocaj, I think you are referring to John Ware's rough version of the Deadmans Island map, on this he appears to have drawn a volcano but that is not what he tried to depict. The early satellite picture of Oak Island shows a triangular shaped pond near to the beach. A three hundred foot long ten foot high ridge of earth formed the base of the triangle, and that line forms a strong barrier to construct the excavated nine foot deep pond on the inside. This stagnant level gets shallower at the apex and it was built as a reservoir to supply fresh water via a stream at the apex, it's clearly shown on Captain Kidd's version of the Deadman Island map.

Smithsonian experts declared the ridge of earth to be of a man made construction. That artificial facility is what John Ware tried to illustrate, however, Captain Williams Kidd's signed and much improved version does not show what looks like a volcano. Captain Kidd actually drew a triangular pond with a fresh water stream which is (or rather was) in plain sight in around 1960, but that was long before the current extensive searcher excavations in the mid section of Oak Island. The triangular pond and stream are sadly both gone, and now in wet weather the whole valley becomes flooded and it looks like a big lake, but 80% of that long ridge of earth is still there.
The anchorage shown on Kidd's version of the Deadman Island map is still visible today next to Tom Nolan's modern jetty.

Oak Island Sage

On both maps there is a visible step hill (volcano) next to a smaller one (no pod) and on one of them exactly in the position where the volcano (symbol as you would draw them on antique maps) is shown on both the relief and flat drawing.

Apart from that all the other features (islets clearly of volcanic origin) marked 2,3 are done too. Those points are high elevations (the second lower peak below the volcano 1 one of them). they are all given with compass direction to point to the spot. A blind man can see that this has nothing to do with OI!

I am really getting fed up with people having next to no idea of traditional navigation and trying to read maps done from navigators!!! Of course they know what they do - if the orientation is N it means North. If they draw a volcano it means there is one. if they draw islets and reefs than you will find them there. Maybe the shape isn't 100% because they had no satellite maps but most of the features will be there and can't be explained away!

 

[Bocaj]

Ya might be onto something Bart. We all know a giant space elephant farted and blew a hole in Oak Island and filled it up with treasure from Avery and Kidd that was stored on the dark side of the moon.

I am sure someone takes this location as the right one. Just wait...

For better or worse, I prefer to dig for the truth behind the hype and legends. This topic is for me only an exercise in research skills. If I am presented with verifiable facts, I am prepared to change my opinion. Personally, at present, I do not believe in any conspiracy between Avery and Kidd. (Sage believes so, but refuses to prove his claim ) Nor a great treasure taken by either captain. Avery's personal share was substantial but not a great hoard, and Kidd's, well, his personal share was recovered from Gardiner's Island, but Kidd, in an ironic twist, gained immortality in connection to the treasure when Avery did not.

I agree when it comes to Kidd but disagree on Avery. First of all the treasure is documented in those two letters (did you do a deeper research on them?). Further it doesn't need to be Avery's personal share but part of the crew's as well. He might have hidden it to have a bargaining chip negotiating a pardon for all of them. At least it is possible. This is also were Kidd could have come into the play a he could have send to verify Avery's claim (see the coded letter). So in theory there could have been a connection between.

I do not claim the above has happened but I claim this is a reasonable theory that could explain the legend of the buried pirate haul that latter triggered treasure island and all the rest.

 

[Crow]

I am sure someone takes this location as the right one. Just wait...


I agree when it comes to Kidd but disagree on Avery. First of all the treasure is documented in those two letters (did you do a deeper research on them?). Further it doesn't need to be Avery's personal share but part of the crew's as well. He might have hidden it to have a bargaining chip negotiating a pardon for all of them. At least it is possible. This is also were Kidd could have come into the play a he could have send to verify Avery's claim (see the coded letter). So in theory there could have been a connection between.

I do not claim the above has happened but I claim this is a reasonable theory that could explain the legend of the buried pirate haul that latter triggered treasure island and all the rest.

Just to clarify my present Belief that there is no connection between Kidd and Avery? At present, I can find no solid evidence for it.

I admit I was very intrigued by the two documents connected to Avery I posted from the Scottish and Cornish archives, and agree that deeper research is needed there.

Truth seeker referred to a dismissive Times newspaper claim on the alleged letter of Avery. Sean Kingsley and Rex Cowan rely on scant evidence and take remarkable creative liberties to build a portrait of infamous 17th century pirate Henry Avery that may be entertaining, but has little basis in fact. However that might be Sean Kingsley and Rex Cowan conclusions and not the document found itself.

Truth seeker conveniently casts doubt on the authenticity of the document by virtue of being connected to Sean Kingsley and Rex Cowans. This did the document in Scottish archives a disservice. This can sometimes be put down to jealous academic snobbery. Or a conflict of agenda in his own research. But also what truth seeker eagerly dismissed was that a document was found, regardless of Sean Kingsley and Rex Cowan conclusions.

For me, I feel the treasures mentioned in both letters are remarkably similar to be a coincidence. I think you think along the same lines? There have been, throughout history, fake documents found in archives and magically found. So my conclusion is er on the side of caution. There needs to be more research on the authenticity of the letter that requires more research. There needs to be more independent access to this document, which was in the Scottish archives. An archivist would now catalog this document. I am hoping one day to get access to this document.I would not be surprised that other documents are scattered across archives and personal collections that will give us more insight.

Now, you as well as I would be interested to see evidence of a connection between Kidd and Avery. Sage makes bold claims. Anyone can make a claim. His refusal prove his claims does him a disservice and rings alarm bells that it is just an intuition of his and not physical evidence of a document connecting the two together. I still keep an open mind.

Crow

 

[releventchair]

Hi Blak Bart you are correct in some ways, and I cannot hope to match the hard work done by researchers. The burning question on this website dedicated to finding treasure is this, do any of them have any chance of locating the elusive treasure, the answer to that is a resounding no, well I have.

Please allow me to blow my own trumpet now Blak Bart. Unlike some armchair critics I have actually been to Oak Island by personal invitation and I've met the owners. I was shown across Oak Island and I have seen the area under which I believe the treasure is stored. I am the only person of the planet who ever got the late Dan Blankenship to agree to work with the late Fred Nolan and I have the "Letter of intent" to prove it, had the late President of the old Triton Alliance Company David Tobias also agreed the treasure would been recovered twenty years ago. After several years had past I gave up all hope of trying to broker a peaceful share deal between the three original feuding O I treasures hunters of the sixties. I then posted some of my theories on a excellent website called "Oak Island Treasure" and my topic entitled "Oak Island revelations" had received more three hundred thousand viewing hits when it was last viewed by my friend, unfortunately it was just before the website was sold.
Coming up to date I have had business discussions with the present searchers and I have offered them my help for nothing, no charge and no percentage of and recovered treasure. These treasure hunters have voted and they opted to first try their other pre-planned projects that are centred around the Money Pit area. For now in 2026 my input and offer must apparently be considered by the members of the Cerca Trova company to be superfluous to requirements.

When they finally realise that (as I told them) no treasure was ever put in the empty Money Pit which was a Sand Sump (see CAD) I might get a call, and if I'm still alive I will help them, if not then it's game over - period.
Now if anyone can name any researcher or writer who has actually come closer than me in actively trying to recover the treasure of Oak Island I hope someone will please name that person. then I can close the book on this subject and pursue my other interest.

Oak Island Sage

Trying to manipulate Torricelli's trumpet into a bugle to promote your attempt at an Oak Island book isn't really research.
[ For now in 2026 my input and offer must apparently be considered by the members of the Cerca Trova company to be superfluous to requirements.]

Gee Wally ; between the company and members here that are not impressed by your absence of proof it's almost like the credibility of your claims is being questioned.
That the company isn't following your book to the treasure speaks volumes. Well against one volume anyways. Almost as if their researches X doesn't match your hypothetical X for some mysterious reason.
How deep did you dig?

 

[Crow]

Hi Crow, my late associate was an RCMP detective and he knew me and my theories very well, in his opinion I should have been a detectives myself because in his view I have the natural gift intuitive perception. I respect you for your own work and would prefer not to dual with you, but please don't patronize me because of my age it does you no credit, would you do that to someone like Albert Einstein.
You make the point that on the Deadman Island drawn by Captain William Kidd he shows the main land close on the right east side, however your picture shows the mainland is on the left West side and I totally agree .
Now comes the detective work,
Question. Why would Captain Kidd include the source of logs on his treasure map?
Answer, Because hundreds of log were required for the construction of the Subterranean system of Oak Island.
2/ Question, Why is that coast line that he drew to the East nowhere near Oak Island?
Answer. Because it is actually located about twenty miles to the East across the far side of Mahone Bay, it was drawn only to additionally illustrate the source of stolen logs, he was essentually laughing at the Spaniards who had done all the hard work for them.
The date that a map was copyrighted does not indicate when it was originally drawn, or even establish who drew the original copy.
Oak Island Sage

Sage

Hi Crow, my late associate was an RCMP detective and he knew me and my theories very well, in his opinion I should have been a detectives myself because in his view I have the natural gift intuitive perception. ( Is that not patronizing you?)I respect you for your own work and would prefer not to dual with you, but please don't patronize me because of my age it does you no credit, would you do that to someone like Albert Einstein. (99.9 percent of ordinary people, including myself, are not Einstein, everyone ages with a cognitive skills decline a fact of life. But to equate my alleged patronising of you with that of Einstein speaks volumes. )

You make the point that on the Deadman Island drawn by Captain William Kidd he shows the main land close on the right east side, however your picture shows the mainland is on the left West side and I totally agree . ( Okay I have no issues there.)

Now comes the detective work,

Question. Why would Captain Kidd include the source of logs on his treasure map? (The issue I have there, you still claim the deadman map as a real treasure map. You have the chance to prove us all wrong by having Kidd's signature verified on that map with real Kidd signatures in the national archive. Yet you ignore it. Why is that? )

Answer, Because hundreds of log were required for the construction of the Subterranean system of Oak Island. ( the natural gift intuitive perception?)
2/ Question, Why is that coast line that he drew to the East nowhere near Oak Island?

Answer. Because it is actually located about twenty miles to the East across the far side of Mahone Bay, it was drawn only to additionally illustrate the source of stolen logs, he was essentually laughing at the Spaniards who had done all the hard work for them. ( Okay, yes, I see your reasoning there. But you seem to ignore the hill on the maps that is clearly not on Oak Island?" )

The date that a map was copyrighted does not indicate when it was originally drawn, or even establish who drew the original copy. ( It appears you have very little understanding of copyright.

Yes, someone can copyright a historical chart, but the protection only applies to the specific, original creative expression of the data, not the historical facts themselves. While historical facts and data are in the public domain, a new, unique arrangement of that data is protected. Here is a breakdown of how copyright applies to historical charts:

What CANNOT Be Copyrighted.

Historical Facts: Facts about the past (e.g., "The population of London in 1800 was X") cannot be owned by anyone.
Data and Information: Raw data, dates, and historical occurrences are free for anyone to use.
Old Charts: Charts that are very old (e.g., published in the US before 1923) are generally in the public domain and free to use.

What CAN Be Copyrighted

Original Expression: If someone takes historical data and creates a unique, creative chart, that specific visual representation is protected.
Compilations: If a person compiles scattered historical facts into a new, organized chart or database, that organization is protected.
Modern Interpretations: A new chart created in 2024 showing 18th-century data is protected by copyright from the moment it is created

Clearly, Edward Rowe Snow copyrighted his work in 1946. Thus, concluding it was his creation below.

The signature below of Kidd on Edward Rowe Snow copyrighted his work in 1946. cannot be Captain Kidd's.

You have based your perceptions on a chart that is clearly a 1946 creation by Edward Rowe Snow, who copyrighted his work in 1946. Getting the above signature on the chart, there is no way you're ever going to get a handwriting expert to match that with real Kidd signatures below from the British Museum. Taken from his letters. That is why you keep avoiding the issue.

Williams Kidd's signature is consistent in real documents, bent dds, and the W carries over to the letter M. It does not jump over the letter M to the letter K in Kidd's surname.

Edward Rowe Snow faked William Kidd's signature on his Deadman map, which he copyrighted in 1946. Based on the signature below, which is not Captain William Kidd's signature. You can see the W scrolling over the top of M to the letter K. The problem below this signature was copied.

You can see the Edward Rowe Snow Forgery below. He copied in error the W scrolling over the top of M to the letter K.

The irony was that the document Edward Rowe Snow copied from was not Kidd's signature. and not Kidd's handwriting. It was copy, written by the secretary below.

Crow

 

[THE TRUE SEEKER]

I am commenting because I was mentioned. (I don't intend to get deeply involved in this matter.)

Truth seeker referred to a dismissive Times newspaper claim on the alleged letter of Avery. Sean Kingsley and Rex Cowan rely on scant evidence and take remarkable creative liberties to build a portrait of infamous 17th century pirate Henry Avery that may be entertaining, but has little basis in fact. However that might be Sean Kingsley and Rex Cowan conclusions and not the document found itself.

Truth seeker conveniently casts doubt on the authenticity of the document by virtue of being connected to Sean Kingsley and Rex Cowans. This did the document in Scottish archives a disservice. This can sometimes be put down to jealous academic snobbery. Or a conflict of agenda in his own research. But also what truth seeker eagerly dismissed was that a document was found, regardless of Sean Kingsley and Rex Cowan conclusions.

This is what I quoted.

The Pirate King by Sean Kingsley and Rex Cowan review — The Times

As the authors claim: "Past scammers went to great lengths to fake and sell documents." How - without reassurance from the authors can we be sure this is an exception?

Even if 'Avery's Treasure' truly exists and remains hidden, it—as you mentioned in a previous post—would only be a pirate captain's share. (Pirates distributed their loot almost equally.)

Benerson Little points this out. (The Golden Age of Piracy: The Truth Behind Pirate Myths p.329)

 

[Crow]

Hello truth seeker,

I stand corrected, you passed on what was said by others. Everything else I agree with.

But your quoted post did make sense, so much so that it forced Crow to cautiously reevaluate the authenticity of the document in question. Which is not a bad thing.

Regardless of the spurious claims of Cowan and Kingsley. I wish academics would at least determine the age of the document before dismissing it out of hand. It would be interesting to see if the handwriting was the same as William Defoe's. The documents from the Scottish and Cornish archives are interesting because the description of the alleged treasure is similar. Yet the Cornish document is from the early 19th century. The Scottish archive document still needs investigation into its age, the writing style of the era, and the type of paper used. We also do not know the context of these documents in the time between the Tories and Whigs, when privateering and piracy were bankrolled by members of high society.

It is easy to slip forged documents into archives. Then a discovery can be made. The evidence will be in a forensic examination of the document.

Crow

 

[Oak Island Sage]

Hello truth seeker,

I stand corrected, you passed on what was said by others. Everything else I agree with.

But your quoted post did make sense, so much so that it forced Crow to cautiously reevaluate the authenticity of the document in question. Which is not a bad thing.

Regardless of the spurious claims of Cowan and Kingsley. I wish academics would at least determine the age of the document before dismissing it out of hand. It would be interesting to see if the handwriting was the same as William Defoe's. The documents from the Scottish and Cornish archives are interesting because the description of the alleged treasure is similar. Yet the Cornish document is from the early 19th century. The Scottish archive document still needs investigation into its age, the writing style of the era, and the type of paper used. We also do not know the context of these documents in the time between the Tories and Whigs, when privateering and piracy were bankrolled by members of high society.

It is easy to slip forged documents into archives. Then a discovery can be made. The evidence will be in a forensic examination of the document.

Crow

Crow, my late associate John Askew moored his boat next to the Late Fred Nolan at the Oak Island Marina for many years, and he knew everybody involved with the Treasure hunting projects. John had been on the island during many projects for several years and he met with many experts, theorist writers and reporters. He was well a respected and a very intelligent man, certainly not given to making patronizing remarks, on the the contrary at six foot seven inches tall weighing around 260 pounds if he thought you were a fraud or wrong he would tell you straight.
My mentioning of Albert Einstein was only to question your rational for making patronizing remarks (regarding my age) and you know well it was not to compare me to him, but, you saw another opportunity to make a disparaging remark about me, I am beginning to see your true colours.
There is no doubt that topics here involving Kidd, Every, and/or Oak Island are dominated by a group of researchers who may intend to write their own books in the future, and some appear to just feed off old findings like a carrion crow.

Theories are like finger prints each person has their own, and some researchers like to support and associate with like minded people in a selective click. They close ranks when one of their buddies has a problem, and that effect scares away a lot of potential members outside the intellectual circle who are not researchers and writers. They certainly would not want to enter what a appears to be an arena filled with hungry lions from the same pride.
This is the main reason now why I don't choose to reveal the possible link with Kidd and Every, I don't like people who make petulantly displays because they can't have there own way, it's like a child throwing toys out of their pram and I don't reward bad behaviour.
With regards to my opinion of you Crow, I consider you to be a very good researcher, but I feel you are devoid of any tact in dealing with people with different theories to your own. Your defence mechanism need some work.

Yes Crow you can pull out lot's of dandy records, but when push come to shove what else can you offer when it comes to actively contributing to the recovery of the Oak Island treasure, zero, zilch, is what you've got and sorry to say this but revealing old records just won't cut it buddy.

If I get a phone call I am 95% sure I can deliver the goods, can you or any of your "serious discussion" flock do that? No! then as the late great John Wayne said in "True Grit, " Come and watch an old man sometime".

Oak Island sage

 

[Crow]

Sage

There is no shame in having a dream and writing a book. I admire people having a go, even you, regardless of your claims. But refusing to see and ignore facts and relying on intuition alone is pure folly. As for not finding treasure on Oak Island, I totally agree with you. I cannot deliver treasure from Oak Island, nor anyone else, because there is nothing there. The only treasure there is the income from the TV show, advertising, and marketing promoting tourism, asking what if? Considering all the wild theories, the Cerca Trova has already followed up on how many seasons, and they politely deemed your theory to be superfluous to requirements; it silently speaks volumes.

I cannot speak for others here. Their opinions are their own. Not mine. I have no interest in writing treasure hunting books. For three reasons. One: Sadly, these days, there is no money in treasure-hunting books. Two: There are some things better left unsaid, as there are better prospects elsewhere. Three: I have more to lose from writing such a book than to gain.

Finally, at risk of being deemed again to be patronizing you, I hope you really do get that phone call. But would not hold my breath.

Crow

 

[Oak Island Sage]

Crow, you have said clearly that there is quote " no treasure there" was that just your highly qualified opinion? or do you have indisputable evidence to support that bold statement? No! whew!!!! that's a relief, if you had then Rick would need to go on tranquillizers.

Why not take a trip to Halifax, Nova scotia and meet the "Fellowship of the dig" and tell them in person that they have been wasting their time searching for the last fourteen years, when they spent long hours working in all weathers and up to their a****s in mud and mosquitoes.

You tell them straight Crow that in your view there is "no treasure there". I'm sure Rick ( who suffered a life threatening illness from a very dangerous bug infection that he picked up in the swam area) would in particular graciously thank you for your valuable enlightenment, and then he'd shake you warmly -- by the throat. 😄

I made a free offer to help them, will I get the phone call, as Rhett Butler said in "gone with the Wind" " Frankly my dear I don't give a Dam".😉 It's all you people out there who should have their fingers crossed. 🤞🤞🤞🤞🤞🤞🤞🤞

OAK ISLAND SAGE

 

[Blak bart]

Hi Blak Bart you are correct in some ways, and I cannot hope to match the hard work done by researchers. The burning question on this website dedicated to finding treasure is this, do any of them have any chance of locating the elusive treasure, the answer to that is a resounding no, well I have.

Please allow me to blow my own trumpet now Blak Bart. Unlike some armchair critics I have actually been to Oak Island by personal invitation and I've met the owners. I was shown across Oak Island and I have seen the area under which I believe the treasure is stored. I am the only person of the planet who ever got the late Dan Blankenship to agree to work with the late Fred Nolan and I have the "Letter of intent" to prove it, had the late President of the old Triton Alliance Company David Tobias also agreed the treasure would been recovered twenty years ago. After several years had past I gave up all hope of trying to broker a peaceful share deal between the three original feuding O I treasures hunters of the sixties. I then posted some of my theories on a excellent website called "Oak Island Treasure" and my topic entitled "Oak Island revelations" had received more three hundred thousand viewing hits when it was last viewed by my friend, unfortunately it was just before the website was sold.
Coming up to date I have had business discussions with the present searchers and I have offered them my help for nothing, no charge and no percentage of and recovered treasure. These treasure hunters have voted and they opted to first try their other pre-planned projects that are centred around the Money Pit area. For now in 2026 my input and offer must apparently be considered by the members of the Cerca Trova company to be superfluous to requirements.

When they finally realise that (as I told them) no treasure was ever put in the empty Money Pit which was a Sand Sump (see CAD) I might get a call, and if I'm still alive I will help them, if not then it's game over - period.
Now if anyone can name any researcher or writer who has actually come closer than me in actively trying to recover the treasure of Oak Island I hope someone will please name that person. then I can close the book on this subject and pursue my other interest.

Oak Island Sage

Well sir...you have it all worked out then !! Seems you win 🏆!! thanks for letting us know how right you are....I would hate to miss the wagon, and not know the truth....seems now I know 100% that kidds treasure is on "Oak Island". I wonder why they dont dig it up ? You know what...I think we should all hang up our boots 👢 and quit while we're ahead. Silly me ... and I thought I was a someone having actually recovered a few pirate, and Spanish treasures 🤪!! Im sure one day you'll have some proof to show us...all that experience surly you've recovered something?? I mean even little Ole me has had success on multiple galleon fleets 1715, 1733 !! I've metaldetected all over novascotia, lunenberg, cape bretton, gaspeie, prince Edward Island, Newfoundland, toudassac, etc etc etc. Let's blow our trumpets, and pound our chests !! Im in!!.... want ta start comparing finds ?? Show me something beyond imaginative manuscript!! Show me kidds jewels, show me some coins, and no im not buying a book about Oak Island from a thread about captain kidd !! You came here blowing your trumpet, but the proof is in the pudding, and it seems at the moment your not even allowed to have any pudding at all. Go do your thing on Oak Island and prove it, ill be eating the popcorn 🍿 patiently waiting for you to succeed.....good luck Sage!!🫡

 

[Carl-NC]

or do you have indisputable evidence to support that bold statement?

It's good to see you ask for evidence and not proof. That's progress. The evidence is in 231 years of failure. It's hard to argue with that.

 

[Oak Island Sage]

Well sir...you have it all worked out then !! Seems you win 🏆!! thanks for letting us know how right you are....I would hate to miss the wagon, and not know the truth....seems now I know 100% that kidds treasure is on "Oak Island". I wonder why they dont dig it up ? You know what...I think we should all hang up our boots 👢 and quit while we're ahead. Silly me ... and I thought I was a someone having actually recovered a few pirate, and Spanish treasures 🤪!! Im sure one day you'll have some proof to show us...all that experience surly you've recovered something?? I mean even little Ole me has had success on multiple galleon fleets 1715, 1733 !! I've metaldetected all over novascotia, lunenberg, cape bretton, gaspeie, prince Edward Island, Newfoundland, toudassac, etc etc etc. Let's blow our trumpets, and pound our chests !! Im in!!.... want ta start comparing finds ?? Show me something beyond imaginative manuscript!! Show me kidds jewels, show me some coins, and no im not buying a book about Oak Island from a thread about captain kidd !! You came here blowing your trumpet, but the proof is in the pudding, and it seems at the moment your not even allowed to have any pudding at all. Go do your thing on Oak Island and prove it, ill be eating the popcorn 🍿 patiently waiting for you to succeed.....good luck Sage!!🫡

Blak Bart, you don't take prisoners do you? 😄 Ok it's fair comment and I'll take it on the chin, but by the law of average someone had to eventual arrive who could do the job. The bottom line is this Blak Bart, I am confident that I can be instrumental in recovering a huge treasure located beneath Oak Island and I'll do it for free. Now if anyone out there can persuade Rick and Marty to take up my offer we can all benefit.
What some people fail to consider is this, if I put too much information in the public domain it could threaten the lives of people who live there or are involved with Oak Island projects, and they have been plagued by drones and trespassers for years. Thank you for your best wishes.

Oak Island Sage

 

[Blak bart]

Blak Bart, you don't take prisoners do you? 😄 Ok it's fair comment and I'll take it on the chin, but by the law of average someone had to eventual arrive who good do the job. The bottom line is this Blak Bart, I am confident that I can be instrumental in recovering a huge treasure located beneath Oak Island and I'll do it for free. Now if anyone out there can persuade Rick and Marty to take up my offer we can all benefit.
What some people fail to consider is this, if I put too much information in the public domain it could threaten the lives of people who live there or are involved with Oak Island projects, and they have been plagued by drones and trespassers for years. Thank you for your best wishes.

Oak Island Sage

Well to be fair, why does no one ever mention the most likley culprits for oak island.....seems the most logical culprits are never mentioned. The greatest pirates of the north east seem to get no attention at all, and when someone wants to attribute treasure to Oak Island they try to squeeze one or more of the golden age pirates into the culprit of oak Island. Seems no one has ever herd the names David kirke, or how bout mainwaring, or the great Easton!! These men were on and around the oak island scene, and commanded entire fleets of ships amassing tons of treasure ?? If you ever got on the ground in any of the locations ive hunted it becomes apparent that artifacts are literally on all the islands in the area. Ill leave it there, and hopefully this thread can continue, although I cant see much more info on Kidd being available at this point in the thread ??

 

[releventchair]

 

[Oak Island Sage]

Well to be fair, why does no one ever mention the most likley culprits for oak island.....seems the most logical culprits are never mentioned. The greatest pirates of the north east seem to get no attention at all, and when someone wants to attribute treasure to Oak Island they try to squeeze one or more of the golden age pirates into the culprit of oak Island. Seems no one has ever herd the names David kirke, or how bout mainwaring, or the great Easton!! These men were on and around the oak island scene, and commanded entire fleets of ships amassing tons of treasure ?? If you ever got on the ground in any of the locations ive hunted it becomes apparent that artifacts are literally on all the islands in the area. Ill leave it there, and hopefully this thread can continue, although I cant see much more info on Kidd being available at this point in the thread ??

Hi Blak bart, you clearly a treasure hunter in the true sense, one who has had wide experience searching underwater and beneath the ground. It's natural that you want tangible evidence but I don't own the land or the many permits required for searching on Oak Island. Successful Under water searches are either a result of a lot of research to locate the search area, or by sheer luck. Metal detectors and ground penetrating radar are exploratory devises, and the searches on Oak Island have used every thing they can in random searches all over and around the island all to no avail.

They are pestered for about twenty five years by an old English guy who claims to know how to retrieve the treasure in about two weeks at very low cost, and he'll do it for - nothing. Now if I were Rick unless that old guy came up first with up with evidence and provenance normally I'd reject his 2026 offer, however if it was for free I would shelve the offer.

That is where we are today.

Oak Island Sage

 

[Randawg72]

I started this thread to spark interest in Kidd's treasure and to ponder the possibility that the Kidd/Palmer charts could be authentic. I never imagined it would reach 46 pages and 73K views. Mr Edmunds based his research on the historical data that was available to him at the time. Just like everyone else does. Misquoting the timeline of a chart's discovery does not diminish or invalidate his findings.
And to those readers that are convinced that the charts are a hoax, and/or if you don't believe that Kidd hid a second larger treasure than the Gardiner's Island stash, you are entitled to that opinion.
Please stop presenting obvious nonsense as facts, and stop insulting other members and their comments.

 

[Randawg72]

Simple advice....go and search !! You will definitely not find the treasure speculating. Each person is here with a different perspective. Prove it !! Go into the field and prove it. I just cant imagine not scratching the itch !! Blah blah blah....aside from crow, I dont see anyone with practical experience in the field.

Hi Blak bart,
Simple? Global treasure hunting is an expensive proposition. While I have full confidence in my island and my solution, it will take some saving and logistics for me to carry out an expedition. Hopefully the planets will align and I will be able to go while I'm still able.