The Treasure of Captain William Kidd.

[William Kidd]

Hello, You are right to say so, but if you want my opinion, if the island is the right one, they have already found the treasure. I have looked at thousands of islands from satellite and none has all the characteristics that this one has.
- Turtles - Lagoon - many "Cayo" names as in the map - 200 leagues from Brazil - Coconut Palm Area - Kidd's Route - Near Curacao, where Kidd charged - Coral reef - Island shape - Presence of a "Death Valley" depression - Very remote from civilization - Sandy soil (where you can dig) - "Skeleton island" because it is possible to survive a few days - Location of the "Deserto" beach. - Boat docking location - Location of the Settlers and Kidd, ecc...

etc. I am very curious to know if anyone has found an island with all these and other coincidences that this one possesses. What is out of place, however, is the lack of hills. In my opinion, the hills were used as filling material to widen the beach with docks and piers, and moreover it is not explained the reason for such a handmade work, and that none of the fishermen present did or remembers ancestors who did it, so why and by whom was it done?
Maybe someone found the treasure and then flattened the rest of the island hoping to find more? Maybe the first seasonal fishermen simply wanted to make artificial barriers to prevent the beach from being eroded by the waves? But why given that space is wasted? What is strange is that if there were, it would be below sea level, since it is flat and almost at its level, although we must consider the fact that the sea level in the last 350 years has risen by almost 40 cm...

 

[markmar]

Hello, You are right to say so, but if you want my opinion, if the island is the right one, they have already found the treasure. I have looked at thousands of islands from satellite and none has all the characteristics that this one has.
- Turtles - Lagoon - many "Cayo" names as in the map - 200 leagues from Brazil - Coconut Palm Area - Kidd's Route - Near Curacao, where Kidd charged - Coral reef - Island shape - Presence of a "Death Valley" depression - Very remote from civilization - Sandy soil (where you can dig) - "Skeleton island" because it is possible to survive a few days - Location of the "Deserto" beach. - Boat docking location - Location of the Settlers and Kidd, ecc...

etc. I am very curious to know if anyone has found an island with all these and other coincidences that this one possesses. What is out of place, however, is the lack of hills. In my opinion, the hills were used as filling material to widen the beach with docks and piers, and moreover it is not explained the reason for such a handmade work, and that none of the fishermen present did or remembers ancestors who did it, so why and by whom was it done?
Maybe someone found the treasure and then flattened the rest of the island hoping to find more? Maybe the first seasonal fishermen simply wanted to make artificial barriers to prevent the beach from being eroded by the waves? But why given that space is wasted? What is strange is that if there were, it would be below sea level, since it is flat and almost at its level, although we must consider the fact that the sea level in the last 350 years has risen by almost 40 cm...

There is another small island which could be considered as a possibility. Just few miles east from your region.

 

[Bocaj]

Good Afternoon everyone,

This is the link to watch the video from 8:00 this afternoon.



The language is Italian, I hope You can translate by AI...

I was there without permissions, so I check the ground secretly, but anyway police call the fisherman to order I came back in the Apartment, after 2 nights spent in the island. How Police know I was there is not clear. They also check my baggage, but fortunately they don't know English and I said the georadar box was an "Signal amplifier"...
Obviously the name of the island will be visible and also my Identity. Now I'm back.

Hope to speack with you about the Island. I'm curious to know how many of you will be agree with me about the real treasure Island.

Best Regards,
W. K.

I warned you didn't I? At least they didn't hang you this time. I call that progress.

There are worse ways to waste your time than visiting beautiful tropical islands. There are plenty out there that could have been taken as an inspiration to that story. But if you really want to know the truth about that treasure you first have to become a real pirate. Join up.

 

[Cryptid1990]

Hope to speack with you about the Island. I'm curious to know how many of you will be agree with me about the real treasure Island.

Best Regards,
W. K.

Captain Kidd never travelled to the island you visited in your video. Aside from that problem, there is no evidence Kidd buried treasure. Pirate treasure maps ("X" marks the spot) and pirates burying treasure are fictional literary tropes popularised by Robert Louis Stevenson.

 

[BennyV]

Captain Kidd never travelled to the island you visited in your video. Aside from that problem, there is no evidence Kidd buried treasure. Pirate treasure maps ("X" marks the spot) and pirates burying treasure are fictional literary tropes popularised by Robert Louis Stevenson.

False. He buried treasure on Gardiner’s island.

 

[Cryptid1990]

False. He buried treasure on Gardiner’s island.

Nope. I refuted that dubious (often repeated) claim in my thread. You should try to fact check/verify claims before repeating them.

 

[BennyV]

Nope. I refuted that dubious (often repeated) claim in my thread. You should try to fact check/verify claims before repeating them.

Great research but your articles don’t say it was buried and don’t say it wasn’t buried.

 

[Randawg72]

Hope to speack with you about the Island. I'm curious to know how many of you will be agree with me about the real treasure Island.

Best Regards,
W. K.

Hi W. K.,
I am not a fan of inverting the island's North/South position in analyzing the charts. And I firmly believe that the "Mar Del" maps were created by Harold T. Wilkins and have nothing to do with Kidd. I'm sorry, but I do not share your choice of Isla Fernando as Kidd's island. Remember, there are many more physical features and landmarks to consider besides the island's shape. Thank you for posting your ideas.

-Randawg72.

 

[William Kidd]

Nope. I refuted that dubious (often repeated) claim in my thread. You should try to fact check/verify claims before repeating them.

Kidd's route passed nearby. Kidd had passed through Curacao and the archipelago of los Roques is a remote and uninhabited place (at the time) to hide such a treasure

 

[William Kidd]

Hi W. K.,
I am not a fan of reversing North and South in analyzing the charts. And I firmly believe that the "Mar Del" maps were created by Harold T. Wilkins and have nothing to do with Kidd. I'm sorry, but I do not share your choice of Isla Fernando as Kidd's island. Remember, there are many more physical features and landmarks to consider besides the island's shape. Thank you for posting your ideas.

-Randawg72.

View attachment 2267403

Hi, there is not only the shape:

- Turtles - Lagoon - many "Cayo" names as in the map - 200 leagues from Brazil - Coconut Palm Area - Kidd's Route - Near Curacao, where Kidd charged - Coral reef - Island shape - Presence of a "Death Valley" depression - Very remote from civilization - Sandy soil (where you can dig) - "Skeleton island" because it is possible to survive a few days - Location of the "Deserto" beach. - Boat docking location - Location of the Settlers and Kidd, ecc...

I prefer if you propose an island like markmar...

But there is one thing that is not completely clear to me: Can't Kidd's companions be the ones who recovered the treasure later? They had helped bury the treasure... Or, who says the government didn't torture him to confession, then kill him, and then organize a recovery expedition?

Besides, I think that Wilkins, as a rigorous scholar of history, could not afford to add details of Fantasy... It would be misleading for scholars to come. I think it is plausible instead that he added details recovered from now unknown or disappeared sources that he considered reliable.
In any case, without the details of the "Mar Del" map it would be impossible to uniquely identify an island that already so, with all these details, is not found. If you wanted to identify their location, the information would not be enough on the 4 maps of the trunk...

 

[William Kidd]

There is another small island which could be considered as a possibility. Just few miles east from your region.

Hi, Your location could be good, but the shape is not similar, there is no hills, the lagoon is too small, so for this reasons I discarded...

 

[Bocaj]

Hi, there is not only the shape:

- Turtles - Lagoon - many "Cayo" names as in the map - 200 leagues from Brazil - Coconut Palm Area - Kidd's Route - Near Curacao, where Kidd charged - Coral reef - Island shape - Presence of a "Death Valley" depression - Very remote from civilization - Sandy soil (where you can dig) - "Skeleton island" because it is possible to survive a few days - Location of the "Deserto" beach. - Boat docking location - Location of the Settlers and Kidd, ecc...

I prefer if you propose an island like markmar...

But there is one thing that is not completely clear to me: Can't Kidd's companions be the ones who recovered the treasure later? They had helped bury the treasure... Or, who says the government didn't torture him to confession, then kill him, and then organize a recovery expedition?

Besides, I think that Wilkins, as a rigorous scholar of history, could not afford to add details of Fantasy... It would be misleading for scholars to come. I think it is plausible instead that he added details recovered from now unknown or disappeared sources that he considered reliable.
In any case, without the details of the "Mar Del" map it would be impossible to uniquely identify an island that already so, with all these details, is not found. If you wanted to identify their location, the information would not be enough on the 4 maps of the trunk...

Kidd never sailed there (only his crew and the ship could have passed there). In any case many tropical islands share some of the details of those maps your is one of many. Of course as the rest you discard those details that don't fit. This way you can find any amount of places. Which is fine with me as looking at some nice tropical beaches is better than what most people do with their lives.

 

[William Kidd]

Great research but your articles don’t say it was buried and don’t say it wasn’t buried.

Hi, I couldn't dig because I expected to find the desert island as google maps says. The "seasonal" fishermen are actually sedentary. In any case, the place of the strong signal of the georadar was a few centimeters above sea level, so I think it is impossible to have been buried on the sand immersed in the water, even if it is true that the sea level at the time was lower than 30 cm. (AI) but I don't think it is likely. In conclusion, given the enormous amount of shells dating back to 350 years ago (according to the experts who analyzed them) and the ancient work of leveling the island completely by hand (since fishermen have no memory of it), I believe that the island hosted a large crew of a large crown fleet, for a few months, in charge of recovering the treasure buried on the island.

 

[William Kidd]

Kidd never sailed there (only his crew and the ship could have passed there). In any case many tropical islands share some of the details of those maps your is one of many. Of course as the rest you discard those details that don't fit. This way you can find any amount of places. Which is fine with me as looking at some nice tropical beaches is better than what most people do with their lives.

I won't hide from you that the beaches are fantastic and the sea amazing, but I was completely alone in the country with the most crime in the world after an earthquake. The airport was decommissioned, they canceled a flight and for five consecutive days I took a different flight, only to return. It was not a walk in the park. As for the many Caribbean islands that have the same characteristics, I looked at almost all of them, but none comes so close. If you find one with all these coincidences it would be nice to see it and think about it all... After all, there seems to be no faster way to find it than through satellite...

 

[Bocaj]

I won't hide from you that the beaches are fantastic and the sea amazing, but I was completely alone in the country with the most crime in the world after an earthquake. The airport was decommissioned, they canceled a flight and for five consecutive days I took a different flight, only to return. It was not a walk in the park. As for the many Caribbean islands that have the same characteristics, I looked at almost all of them, but none comes so close. If you find one with all these coincidences it would be nice to see it and think about it all... After all, there seems to be no faster way to find it than through satellite...

At least you have been there. Of course it is the question of how much Treasure Island and all what followed had some base in reality or was it all just imagination? In any case independent from those maps which are quite probably just sourced from another pirate treasure story there are some islands that could have been visited by both Every and Kidd. We will sail to them in good time.

 

[Cryptid1990]

Great research but your articles don’t say it was buried and don’t say it wasn’t buried.

If you read the transcripts of oral testimonies at his trial (1701) and John Gardiner's sworn narrative/deposition before Bellomont (1699), they make clear that Kidd never set foot on Gardiners island. It was therefore impossible he buried treasure on the island. John Gardiner's deposition stated Kidd met him aboard the HMS San Antonio: "Kidd desired this Narrator [John Gardiner] to take on shore with him, and keep for him [...] a chest, and a box of gold, and a bundle of quilts, and four bales of goods". Kidd gave Gardiner a chest, box of gold, and other items when he was aboard the sloop, not on the island. Curtiss Gardiner (1890), a direct descendent of Lion Gardiner, who compiled family traditions, pointed out that the stories Kidd buried treasure first appeared in literature c. 1800. Kidd died in 1701 so there was a gap of approximately 100 years. This is strong evidence that the stories Kidd buried treasure on Gardiners Island lack a historical foundation. Furthermore, as I detailed in my thread there are multiple, contradictory, family traditions by the Gardiner's where Kidd buried treasure on the island and those stories were first told 100-200 years after he died.

To sum up, there is not a shred of historical or archaeological evidence Kidd buried treasure anywhere and the absence of evidence over three centuries strongly infers evidence of absence. As I said above, pirates burying treasure is a fictional literary trope, the same for pirate treasure maps of buried treasure ("X marks the spot") hence there are no known authentic pirate treasure maps with clues to buried treasure. The Kidd-Palmer treasure maps as a I proved were copied from a 1903 fictional map (Rainbow Island) and are a hoax. If people are actually interested in trying to dig up buried treasure from maps or clues, they should look at things such as Byron Preiss—The Secret (1982). Preiss' book contains 12 paintings and 12 accompanying verses. Each painting/verse combination gives clues to the real location of one of 12 buried treasure casques. Some of these casques have not been found. Here is a longer list of so-called armchair treasure hunts up to the year 2000 (there are of course more recent armchair treasure hunts):

Year	Book / publication	Author / organiser	Physical treasure	Buried/hidden?	Clues in publication	Outcome
1979	Masquerade	Kit Williams	18-carat gold & jewel-encrusted hare	Buried	Pictures, riddles and visual clues	Found 1982
1982	The Piper of Dreams	Terry Pitts Fenby	Jewelled golden flute	Buried	Book's puzzles/clues	Found 1982
1982	The Golden Key	Don Shaw	Golden key + £50,000	Buried	Illustrated book / riddles	Not solved; withdrawn
1982	The Secret	Byron Preiss	12 ceramic casques containing keys to jewels	Buried	12 paintings + 12 verses	3 found; 9 unresolved
1983	The Last Fairy	Fred Hancock	Golden fairy/wand	Buried in UK & USA	Illustrations containing geographical clues	Status uncertain
1983	Conundrum: The Cadbury's Creme Egg Mystery	Don Shaw / Cadbury	12 gold eggs	Buried in caskets	Paintings + verses	Hunt concluded; individual finds documented
1989	Search for the Lost Railway Engine	Pauline & Steve Bane	Golden railway engine	Hunt prize physically prepared	Book riddles	No correct solution; prize later donated
1994	Treasure	Dan James	40 gold coins + bronze keys leading to major prize	Hidden/buried	Book contained multi-stage geographical clues	Solved
1994	Quest: In Search of the Dragontooth	Michael Green	Large tusk mounted on bronze handle	Apparently physically hidden	Book + map + 15 geographical points	Unsolved/closed
1996	Chasing Charlie	Richard Henderson	Claimed 1,000 bottles of rare whisky	Claimed hidden in Scotland	Book contained clues to locations	Unresolved; existence/quantity disputed
1997	A Fairy Story	Stephen Parkes	Silver bell with gold fairy + gold necklace	Buried	Picture + poem → location → further clue → casket	Found 2000

1998

A King's Ransom

Dan James

Mounted original picture + gold lute key

Yes

Hunt clues

Solved April 1999

1999

Mysterious Island

Malcolm Brockbank

Silver dolphins on mount

Yes

Illustrated clues

Solved Spring 2001

1999–2001

Scottish Quest

Charles Cunningham

Silver plate representing Scotland

Hidden

Serial newsletter clues

Solved Spring 2001

2000

Alice's Further Adventures in Wonderland

Paul Harkin & Martin Dennett

Hand-painted Alice in Wonderland chess set

Yes casket buried

9-page story + A3 illustration

Solved Sept. 2000

If you are interested in finding actual buried or hidden treasure from clues, you should focus on an armchair treasure hunt—you are not going to ever find Captain Kidd's treasure since it was never buried nor did pirates of the 16th-18th centuries make maps of buried treasure. Over the past 50-years there have been some pirate-themed armchair treasure hunts, Jim Hawkins and the Curse of Treasure Island is an example (the winner received £5,000 worth of antique sovereigns). In a previous comment, I mentioned the possibility the Kidd-Palmer maps are the basis of an armchair treasure hunt c. 1930. While not impossible, I now think this is very unlikely (in light of the Rainbow Island map), and I abandoned that hypothesis, nevertheless, if someone continued my previous line of thought and research I would still be interested. Something I recently learnt was in 1930, Agatha Christie was commissioned by the Isle of Man tourism authorities to create an actual treasure hunt designed to attract tourists to the island. The result was "Manx Gold", a fictional detective story whose clues were real-world instructions for finding buried/hidden prizes worth £100 (worth £8,484.50 today). So around the time Hubert Palmer said he found the Kidd-Palmer maps, there were armchair treasure hunts in Britain.

 

[BennyV]

If you read the transcripts of oral testimonies at his trial (1701) and John Gardiner's sworn narrative/deposition before Bellomont (1699), they make clear that Kidd never set foot on Gardiners island. It was therefore impossible he buried treasure on the island. John Gardiner's deposition stated Kidd met him aboard the HMS San Antonio: "Kidd desired this Narrator [John Gardiner] to take on shore with him, and keep for him [...] a chest, and a box of gold, and a bundle of quilts, and four bales of goods". Kidd gave Gardiner a chest, box of gold, and other items when he was aboard the sloop, not on the island. Curtiss Gardiner (1890), a direct descendent of Lion Gardiner, who compiled family traditions, pointed out that the stories Kidd buried treasure first appeared in literature c. 1800. Kidd died in 1701 so there was a gap of approximately 100 years. This is strong evidence that the stories Kidd buried treasure on Gardiners Island lack a historical foundation. Furthermore, as I detailed in my thread there are multiple, contradictory, family traditions by the Gardiner's where Kidd buried treasure on the island and those stories were first told 100-200 years after he died.

To sum up, there is not a shred of historical or archaeological evidence Kidd buried treasure anywhere and the absence of evidence over three centuries strongly infers evidence of absence. As I said above, pirates burying treasure is a fictional literary trope, the same for pirate treasure maps of buried treasure ("X marks the spot") hence there are no known authentic pirate treasure maps with clues to buried treasure. The Kidd-Palmer treasure maps as a I proved were copied from a 1903 fictional map (Rainbow Island) and are a hoax. If people are actually interested in trying to dig up buried treasure from maps or clues, they should look at things such as Byron Preiss—The Secret (1982). Preiss' book contains 12 paintings and 12 accompanying verses. Each painting/verse combination gives clues to the real location of one of 12 buried treasure casques. Some of these casques have not been found. Here is a longer list of so-called armchair treasure hunts up to the year 2000 (there are of course more recent armchair treasure hunts):

Year	Book / publication	Author / organiser	Physical treasure	Buried/hidden?	Clues in publication	Outcome
1979	Masquerade	Kit Williams	18-carat gold & jewel-encrusted hare	Buried	Pictures, riddles and visual clues	Found 1982
1982	The Piper of Dreams	Terry Pitts Fenby	Jewelled golden flute	Buried	Book's puzzles/clues	Found 1982
1982	The Golden Key	Don Shaw	Golden key + £50,000	Buried	Illustrated book / riddles	Not solved; withdrawn
1982	The Secret	Byron Preiss	12 ceramic casques containing keys to jewels	Buried	12 paintings + 12 verses	3 found; 9 unresolved
1983	The Last Fairy	Fred Hancock	Golden fairy/wand	Buried in UK & USA	Illustrations containing geographical clues	Status uncertain
1983	Conundrum: The Cadbury's Creme Egg Mystery	Don Shaw / Cadbury	12 gold eggs	Buried in caskets	Paintings + verses	Hunt concluded; individual finds documented
1989	Search for the Lost Railway Engine	Pauline & Steve Bane	Golden railway engine	Hunt prize physically prepared	Book riddles	No correct solution; prize later donated
1994	Treasure	Dan James	40 gold coins + bronze keys leading to major prize	Hidden/buried	Book contained multi-stage geographical clues	Solved
1994	Quest: In Search of the Dragontooth	Michael Green	Large tusk mounted on bronze handle	Apparently physically hidden	Book + map + 15 geographical points	Unsolved/closed
1996	Chasing Charlie	Richard Henderson	Claimed 1,000 bottles of rare whisky	Claimed hidden in Scotland	Book contained clues to locations	Unresolved; existence/quantity disputed
1997	A Fairy Story	Stephen Parkes	Silver bell with gold fairy + gold necklace	Buried	Picture + poem → location → further clue → casket	Found 2000

1998

A King's Ransom

Dan James

Mounted original picture + gold lute key

Yes

Hunt clues

Solved April 1999

1999

Mysterious Island

Malcolm Brockbank

Silver dolphins on mount

Yes

Illustrated clues

Solved Spring 2001

1999–2001

Scottish Quest

Charles Cunningham

Silver plate representing Scotland

Hidden

Serial newsletter clues

Solved Spring 2001

2000

Alice's Further Adventures in Wonderland

Paul Harkin & Martin Dennett

Hand-painted Alice in Wonderland chess set

Yes casket buried

9-page story + A3 illustration

Solved Sept. 2000

If you are interested in finding actual buried or hidden treasure from clues, you should focus on an armchair treasure hunt—you are not going to ever find Captain Kidd's treasure since it was never buried nor did pirates of the 16th-18th centuries make maps of buried treasure. Over the past 50-years there have been some pirate-themed armchair treasure hunts, Jim Hawkins and the Curse of Treasure Island is an example (the winner received £5,000 worth of antique sovereigns). In a previous comment, I mentioned the possibility the Kidd-Palmer maps are the basis of an armchair treasure hunt c. 1930. While not impossible, I now think this is very unlikely (in light of the Rainbow Island map), and I abandoned that hypothesis, nevertheless, if someone continued my previous line of thought and research I would still be interested. Something I recently learnt was in 1930, Agatha Christie was commissioned by the Isle of Man tourism authorities to create an actual treasure hunt designed to attract tourists to the island. The result was "Manx Gold", a fictional detective story whose clues were real-world instructions for finding buried/hidden prizes worth £100 (worth £8,484.50 today). So around the time Hubert Palmer said he found the Kidd-Palmer maps, there were armchair treasure hunts in Britain.

Nice work. It may or may not be out there still.

 

[Randawg72]

there is not a shred of historical or archaeological evidence Kidd buried treasure anywhere

Who said that he did? The stone marker on Gardiner's says: "Capt Kidd's treasure was bur-ied in this hollow and recovered 1699". How do you know that some of Kidd's men, or John Gardiner himself did not bury it? ..You don't. And why is it such an "Aha" subject for you? Kidd never (to my knowledge) said that he buried any treasure.
He wrote: "I have lodged goods and Treasure to the value of one hundred thousand pounds..". The only hint that Kidd may have buried some of his treasure is written on the Yunnan Parchment: "Ator Near 2 ft͟ Deep..". Which is a logical assumption, as leaving treasure sitting uncovered and unprotected in a cave would not be very secure.

 

[William Kidd]

So maybe you are right, the "MAR DEL" map could be an hoax. I check thousands of Island by satellite, but I can't find an Island similar at that map. The only one I found is Isla Fernando...
The AI said me there is just 5 island in caribbean sea with sweet spring water, and are not similar, so in another map (you post in the first page), you can read "waterfall" so this is another element give me doubt about the reality of the Story, because noone of them is similar,,, unless it is temporary rainwater cascades...
In this case, to continue the search for this treasure, it is necessary to know which maps are authentic and which are not.
If The MAR DEL map is not genuine, It's almost an impossible job...

 

[Bocaj]

So maybe you are right, the "MAR DEL" map could be an hoax. I check thousands of Island by satellite, but I can't find an Island similar at that map. The only one I found is Isla Fernando...
The AI said me there is just 5 island in caribbean sea with sweet spring water, and are not similar, so in another map (you post in the first page), you can read "waterfall" so this is another element give me doubt about the reality of the Story, because noone of them is similar,,, unless it is temporary rainwater cascades...
In this case, to continue the search for this treasure, it is necessary to know which maps are authentic and which are not.
If The MAR DEL map is not genuine, It's almost an impossible job...

The MAR DEL maps are no hoax because Wilkins never claimed them to be authentic but his creations illustrating his books. He was not allowed to reproduce the Palmer Maps in details so he invented his own map.

There are some details (Death Valley mostly) he claimed to have seen written on the original Skeleton Map.

In any case it makes no sense to start a treasure hunt based on any of those maps. They only authentic document I know of that indicates a buried treasure (by Kidd from Every's hidden cache) is the Kresen Kernow document:

There has been no follow up on the authenticity of this document but it seems so far fairly authentic. As it is not written by Avery himself but of someone listening to some W.K, (which is probably Kidd) we do not know how truthful the report is. Could be it was just made up by Kidd to avoid the noose...

But this is the best we got. It also gives a good description of the place which has some details in common with the Palmer Maps. There has been no explication so far why.